Shorter Big Tent Democrat
Why The Obama/Clinton Rules Led Us To This Rough Campaign
- It is entirely Barack Obama’s fault that the Clinton campaign is pushing stories that smear him as an anti-Semite.
‘Shorter’ concept created by Daniel Davies and perfected by Elton Beard.
I’ve had it with the damn Clinton campaign. They have done extreme amounts of damage to the Democratic Party over the past couple months, and they are only getting worse.
UPDATE: Woof:
The new Gallup poll says that 19% of Obama supporters would vote for McCain over Hillary and a whopping 28% of Hillary supporters would abandon Obama for McCain.
Whoever wins, those numbers will flatten out considerably. But starting from such high numbers is a big, big problem.
Is everyone ready for President St. BBQ? I hope you are!
UPDATE II: And no, Clinton supporters, I do not want to hear any whining about “OOOOO, Obama said somethin’ mean about Hillary once, OOOOO!!!”
The Obama campaign has never – repeat, never – done anything nearly as irresponsible as branding Hillary Clinton an anti-Semite. I’m sorry, but that just will not wash.
I’m with you, dude. When Hillary tried to resurrect the Wright “controversy” yesterday was when I reached the breaking point. I never thought I’d say this, but if at this point she manages to beg, borrow, or steal the nomination, I’ll be staying home in November. That’s how much I’ve had it with her bullshit.
BTW and off-topic, but on comments to OldPunk’s original post, there’s now a charming white supremacist chick who I just totally bitchslapped with her undeniable African heritage…I really shouldn’t find this kind of thing so entertaining and yet…I do.
Calling BULLSHIT immediately, Brad…
The ‘beef’ with this issue is that this is all being sourced ‘anonymously’…
just like the “Clinton’s gonna go Tonya Harding on Obama” was ‘anonymously’ sourced…
Why are ‘liberal’ bloggers passing along anonymous hearsay as ‘fact’, is the issue at this point.
Better ‘slow your roll’ and find out what people are bitching about before you start snarking.
Fuck Armando and the horse he rode in on… He wouldn’t know a big tent if one was stuffed up his ass.
Why are ‘liberal’ bloggers passing along anonymous hearsay as ‘fact’, is the issue at this point.
You know, this stuff keeps happening again and again.
Christ, the Clinton campaign OPENLY pushed that BS story connecting Obama to domestic terrorist Bill Ayers. What makes you think this crosses the line for them? Especially after Hillary had that fun sit-down with one-time nemesis Richard Mellon Scaife?
Whassup with with Harry Reid’s remark?
Yep. Just can’t argue with this at this point.
I always had a certain admiration for the Clintons.
After Edwards dropped out, I really had no opinion who I’d prefer, Clinton or Obama. And you know, Obama has said some things I really like.
But the biggest factor in my conversion to full on Obama supporter has been the atrocious behavior of both Bill and Hillary. I am saddened to see people I thought were inherently good turn into voracious, amoral predators right in front of my eyes. I continue to be disgusted by both, as they find new lows to sink to.
I understand you’re supposed to want it. But I’m pretty sure you can want it too much…
mikey
‘I’m with you, dude. When Hillary tried to resurrect the Wright “controversy” yesterday was when I reached the breaking point.’
See Brad…
before I could even get my comment in, the disinformation starts up…
Hillary was asked a direct question about Wright, she answered it.
She didn’t ‘resurrect’ anything.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ASWvyAxeSxQ
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/25/us/politics/25clinton-text.html
And she was asked that question during a meeting at one of Scaife’s propaganda rags. Of course, I’m sure, just sure, that Hillary couldn’t have known that Scaife’s propagandists would ever ask a question like that! Just like Joe Lieberman couldn’t have known that when he went on Hannity’s program that he’d be asked to explain why everyone in his party hated America!
Please.
I’m tired of both campaigns. Its seems that Democrats enjoy having Republicans in office. They start using the Republicans dirty tactics but instead of using it against the Republicans they use it against each other.
I’m still voting for either Clinton or Obama in the fall though. Either one is so far still better than McCain.
‘What makes you think this crosses the line for them? Especially after Hillary had that fun sit-down with one-time nemesis Richard Mellon Scaife?’
What does any of that have to do with the fact that you are working on hearsay and shoddy reporting?
Sartia – agreed, obviously.
But Clinton better use the same scorched-earth tactics against St. BBQ if she gets the nod.
“Anonymous hearsay”?? Really??
Ambinder confirmed that Phil Singer sent out the email. You know, the spokesman for the Clinton campaign?
The more I see of Clinton, the more I support Obama….
Still, am pulling the lever for whoever has the big “D” after their name in November. Ain’t never voted republican and I’m not starting with Grandpa
SimpsonMcCain.What does any of that have to do with the fact that you are working on hearsay and shoddy reporting?
What does any of that have to do with the fact that you just completely dodged my point?
‘Just like Joe Lieberman couldn’t have known that when he went on Hannity’s program that he’d be asked to explain why everyone in his party hated America!’
This is going nowhere.
Peace.
I’d really like a few choice HillBots over at Feministe* to own up for ignoring Run H.R.C.’s rapid shift to the rabid right while getting all in a stew over randomly parsed Obama quotes.
*Not you, Jill. Or you, Zuzu. Or any of the regular contributors, really.
Well said mikey. However, should Hillary somehow through voodoo magic subvert the delegates to her will, I’ll *still* vote for her over McCain. Good god. Policy, people. You’d rather have 4 more years of Bush than soil your pristine hands by voting for Hillary?
I don’t think this whole thing is as bad as people are making it out to be, but pretty soon the Democratic leadership (oxymoron) is going to have to gently tell Hillary she can have whatever cabinet position she wants but she’s done.
‘Ambinder confirmed that Phil Singer sent out the email.’
He must of just updated his post then…
because as of this morning there was no sourcing.
‘What does any of that have to do with the fact that you just completely dodged my point?’
You had one?
Bullshit. And she’s really pissing me off. She sits down with Richard Melon-fucking Scaife. At all? Then claims she couldn’t have expected a quesiton about Wright? And that she couldn’t deflect it?
I don’t know if it’s all Hillary or her campaign “strategists” or exactly who’s in charge but it’s clear that Hillary et. al. are more concerned with opportunity for them than anything. They’ll poison the well to O’bama from winning.
The Rovian techniques: “He’s goot a Jewish problem but I didn’t say that.”
A pox on you Hillary. I used to respect you, even admire you. Now you turn my stomach.
I’m not voting for the first time in my life this November, because I’m sick to death of the whole system. I wish Obama the best, but at this point I don’t think there’s a chance in hell that the elites would let someone grab onto power who might actually change things. He’ll either conform to what they want, they’ll rig the election, or he’ll be killed.
Yes. My point was why was Hillary meeting with someone whose surrogates accused her of murdering Vince Foster? Did she honestly not think they’d try to get her to spill some dirt on Obama?
The idea that HRC “had” to answer the Wright question is just all kinds of patently absurd. Deflect, demur, refuse, change the subject. She might have done any of these.
Just because we support our candidates doesn’t mean we have to turn ourselves into fucking idiots on their behalf.
Uh, sorry, but one of the members of Hillary’s finance committee said the same thing more or less in the Irish press yesterday…and admitted that the campaign has been actively pushing the Wright “controversy”.
I know it’s so unfair to castigate Hillary or her campaign for behaving like Republicans when they, you know, behave like Republicans, but honestly, at this point, if they’re going to be playing the scary brown people game every day, I don’t really see the point of having a Republican in the race. And I’m damn sure not going to vote for anyone who plays that game, regardless of what letter comes after their name on the ballot.
I never liked the Clintons. Still don’t. But even if she steals the nomination by destroying Obama (the only path available to her) I will pull the lever for her just to make Jonah/Sully/Limbaugh/the entire wingnut-osphere cry.
I will also buy a shit-load of scotch to survive the next 8 years.
And FWIW, Brad…it’s March. The HillBots will grind their teeth for a few months about how oh-so-close they were, then hear the old McMan talk about 100 more years in Iraq or how suck it up, nancies, the economy is a-OK, and realize that Barry’s the only way to go.
‘Then claims she couldn’t have expected a quesiton about Wright? And that she couldn’t deflect it?’
The question was about her…directly…
why should she have to deflect a question to protect Obama?
And on what planet has Obama deflected a question to protect her?
The Obama campaign has never – repeat, never – done anything nearly as irresponsible as branding Hillary Clinton an anti-Semite. I’m sorry, but that just will not wash.
Except of course for the fact that a few months ago Hillary had the presidency all sewed up until Obama decided to enter the race and “Unite the party”. That worked pretty good.
And she was asked that question during a meeting at one of Scaife’s propaganda rags.
The photo of her with Scaife really saddened me. After what that guy did to her and Bill, she sits down with him and uses his rag to do the same thing to someone else.
It’s the same feeling i have for McCain and Bush/Rove – you know, if someone deliberately send out vile propaganda about my CHILD in 2000, there’s no way sit down with him, much less ask my child’s mother to do the same, much less actually invite him to support me.
And now Hillary is doing the same, with a guy that spent billions to accuse her of unspeakable things.
It’s not about talking to your enemies – it’s about co-opting someone evil in order to achieve your own end.
Hello, McFly? Anybody home?
Think, McFly. Think.
‘My point was why was Hillary meeting with someone whose surrogates accused her of murdering Vince Foster?’
So your concern is for her?
Noted.
It’s the second largest paper in Pitt.
There is your ‘why’, Brad.
Except of course for the fact that a few months ago Hillary had the presidency all sewed up until Obama decided to enter the race and “Unite the party”. That worked pretty good.
Oh, yeah. It’s Obama’s fault because he did something as awful as….running.
After all, it was Hillary’s turn.
You’ll need more than Scotch (although booze is an excellent thing to stock up on before the fall, right mikey?). I recommend laying in a large supply of dehydrated foods, water, purifier, ammo, guns,…. And move to a defensible fortress in eastern Oregon maybe.
Okay, Griff…I’ll do it…whatever you say…
DN Nation’s right. The angry Hillary voters aren’t really the problem. It’s the low information voter who thinks McCain is a “maverick” or otherwise “not that bad” and will vote for him because by November Obama’s going to have so much shit dumped on his head by the rightwing noise machine they’ll think he’s the second coming of Malcom X, who they also don’t know anything about but think he’s scary. And black.
I’m no fan of BTD, but, jeepers, Brad, you’ve still got Taylor Marsh in your blogroll and she’s been even more off-the-hook than he has when it comes to scorched earth anti-Obama lunacy over the last several months.
She may (and I’m leaning on that word heavily) be coming around if this post is any indication, but the Marshians don’t seem to be on board with her.
And on what planet has Obama deflected a question to protect her?
You don’t get it.
Hillary knows perfectly well what she’s doing when she’s meeting with these people. She knows they’re the right-wing slime machine that drove the impeachment campaign against her husband. If she’d had any self-respect, or any respect for any Democrat, she would have told them to go screw. But instead, she goes over there, sits down right next to RMS himself – the very guy who push countless smears against her in the ’90s – and acts as if everything is just peachy.
Also:
http://jamesfallows.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/03/this_is_disgusting_clintons_mc.php
(Marc has just confirmed to me that indeed the article came in an on-the-record email from Phil Singer, the Clinton campaign spokesman.)
Kev- yep, I’ve been meaning to take her off my roll. Don’t worry, I’ll get around to it.
‘Think, McFly. Think.’
I’m asking a question, dick…
care to answer or snark?
If this is the ‘Hillary must protect Obama so he can win the general election’ argument then save it…
both have been slinging shit during the primary.
Outrage at tactics this late in the game is a little tired.
Branding HRC an anti-Semite = Running for president
Classic.
Except of course for the fact that a few months ago Hillary had the presidency all sewed up until Obama decided to enter the race and “Unite the party”. That worked pretty good.
I just… sigh… that has to be a joke.
Big Tent Democrat:
Get that man a thesaurus! Or better yet, just get an editor with a big red pen.
‘Don’t worry, I’ll get around to it.’
Ooooooooooooo!
LOL.
Outrage at tactics this late in the game is a little tired.
You’re serious. You really don’t see anything wrong with branding Obama and anti-Semite.
Authoritarians are the same – conservative or (ostensibly, not really) liberal. Don’t expect consistency or reason from them.
Look, man. There’s a difference between the usual slate of election mud- which, yes, both candidates do/have done- and cowtowing to the extreme right, or threatening to take a leak on the democratic process to steal the nomination.
I find this very enlightening. We call HRC out for vile namecalling/power grabs, and what do her followers do? Tell us to stop whining. Gee, this sounds nothing like what’s gone on the past seven years. Absolutely nothing.
“Branding HRC an anti-Semite = Running for president
Classic.”
Man, you said it. The sense of entitlement is just out of control.
Please stop and just spend a moment thinking, willy.
Here, I’ll get you started:
To smear, or not to smear?
Whether tis better for the party and the country to suffer
the loss of the nomination
Or cut off my nose to spite my face
And by doing that to ensure McBush has the opportunity to finally finish off this country completely…
I’m sure you’ll get the idea if you take a deep breath and *think* about it.
It’s the second largest paper in Pitt.
That’s like saying the New York Sun is the fourth-largest paper in New York, the media capital of the world. Both are right-wing vanity rags, who have to be virtually given away in order to get circulation.
Having said that at least Conrad Black, convicted felon though he is, never accused Hillary of murdering Vince Foster, as the esteemed publisher of the Tribune-Review has done.
Bored in the role, but he can’t stop
Standing up to sit back down
To lose the one thing found
Spinning the world like a toy top
‘Til there’s a ghost in every town
Can’t make a sound
-Elliott Smith
Those Hillary fans sure have a way with words.
If this charm offensive continues, I might have to change my vote!
I expect Hillary to appear on Rush Limbaugh any day now – that’s what this is leading to.
That’s too much work. I’d rather just be in a complete stupor when the Mexicans overrun us, or is it the blacks, or the Islamists, or OleProfessor-bots or whatever the hell is going to destroy the republic this week.
I recommend laying in a large supply of dehydrated foods, water, purifier, ammo, guns
That’s too much work. I’ll just flee to Canada and sell my kidney. Ole’ rightie should be good for a few grand.
This is all assuming our votes mean shit in November at all.
Be sure to take the American Spectator test to see if you too are an anti-Semite (linked in the Armbinder post).
The right wing noise machine’s job is to confuse things enough to make the election close enough to steal credibly. They’re doing pretty well so far.
By the way, mikey, I hope you noted last night’s thread went the way you hoped it would.
unrelatedwaffle-
I like Palast, so I hope he’s being tongue-in-cheek with this:
Shorter Greg Palast:
Also, Karl Rove ceased to be a legitimate threat in November 2006, when he got on Hooters Hewitt’s radio show and acted like he and the cronies had shored up a surprising Republican election sweep. And then….no.
As originally a Richardson, then Edwards and now Obama supporter, I will vote for Sen. Clinton if she wins the nomination because we can’t afford 4 more years of Republican regulatory and judicial appointments. Though I will do so without enthusiasm because her election will mean that the “business as usual” forces have won again.
But please President Clinton, whatever you do, keep Wolfson, Carville, Lanny Davis and Terry McAuliffe in backgound positions where we don’t have to listen to their insufferable pontifications. Do you really want to be the cause of so many people shooting their TV sets? Hell, there might be neighbors on the other side of the wall!
‘You’re serious. You really don’t see anything wrong with branding Obama and anti-Semite.’
Where in the article does it state that Obama is an anti-semite?
It doesn’t.
It implies that one of his advisers is…and it isn’t the ‘Clinton Campaign’.
‘I find this very enlightening. We call HRC out for vile namecalling/power grabs, and what do her followers do? Tell us to stop whining. Gee, this sounds nothing like what’s gone on the past seven years. Absolutely nothing.’
And again, dick…
this ‘story’ is anonymously sourced, and continues to be.
Marc has yet to update his post…
bullshit post
test
The Other Ed is aining in the rights spot. If Obama wins, McCauliffe, Carville, the whole bankrupt Democratic Losership Committee will be OUT. Done. Finis.
THAT’s why this is going on.
Er, “aiming…”.
Ugly In Pink–
I just might be able to provide a good home for Ole Rightie–what’s your blood type?
‘I find this very enlightening. We call HRC out for vile namecalling/power grabs, and what do her followers do? Tell us to stop whining. Gee, this sounds nothing like what’s gone on the past seven years. Absolutely nothing.’
The story is still not sourced.
Please please please please please tell me this whole thing is just some sort of deep-cover op to counter Limbaugh’s Operation Chaos by appearing to fall headfirst into it, and that come nomination time, whichever candidate is not selected will wholeheartedly throw his or her support behind the nominee.
Because if it isn’t, we’re getting four (or eight!) more years of this crap, and that is almost too depressing for words.
I don’t think Willie has been around here before. Be nice to him.
I try to coddle our trolls. Because how would we make it through the long stretches without them?
He understands not our multiple-personality open-minded snarkaliciousness.
Plus he bowls and listens to hip-hop, so he can’t be all that bad.
Willie-
From the Armbinder article:
‘Plus he bowls and listens to hip-hop, so he can’t be all that bad.’
Fuck yo couch.
And…I’m a Gravel supporter.
So the quickness with which I’m being called a troll is hilarious.
Has nothing to do with Obama/Hillary and everything to do with relying on bullshit sourcing and rushing to denounce someone based upon pulling shit from thin air.
Get it? No? Don’t give a fuck.
Said my piece, and I’m gone.
er, Willy…
O+ but i’m far from desperate enough yet. Good luck though dude.
Are you attempting to compare me to Eddie Murphy?
Cause I’m much more Chappell than Murphy…dogg.
Shalom gentlemen.
However, should Hillary somehow through voodoo magic subvert the delegates to her will, I’ll *still* vote for her over McCain.
Seriously, can we just calm down? Hillary folks are touchy.
I hereby pledge to vote for the Democratic nominee for President.
If it’s Obama, I will vote for him. If it’s Hillary, I will vote against McCain.
Just like in 2000 and 2004.
You win teh prize!
Hillary Clinton is my senator.
I voted for her with great enthusiasm the first time. Then, based on her performance, public statements and voting record, grudgingly the second time.
At this point, I wouldn’t vote for her for Class Clown. This has nothing to do with Obama or anyone else; my senator is no Democrat and no progressive.
From the Gallup report on the poll in Update #1:
The second paragraph echoes Josh Marshall’s point. But the first paragraph is at least somewhat heartening.
Isn’t it? Anyone?
Once last time just for t4toby…
According to Marc, and so far only Marc…
he doesn’t link to how he knows it’s the ‘Clinton campaign’…
he doesn’t say it was sent directly to him…
it would have been very easy for him to post said email the first time around?
The fact is, willyjsimmons is as correct as Thomas Sowell when he says that Hitlery was right for sitting down with Scaife’s newspaper, as it speaks for the heartland of Pittsburgh. Liberals like Hussein Obama say they stand for unity, but only Hitlery is proving that she is like Thomas Sowell.
[…] Fuckers. […]
UIP–
Well, keep me in mind if you get to that point (O+ is what I need!). I’ll even pay in Euro’s…
Well, I for one will miss that troll.
Oh well, at least a Democrat won’t take the blame for the fallout of the economic and Iraq meltdowns over the next four years. This is why I’m not a Democrat. They’re fuckups. Face it.
Hey, good thinking, Other Ed. Lets get all entrepreneurial here. If we do end up witnessing a rash of accidental shootings as a result of teeveeicide, let’s invent a line of anti-television ammunition specifically designed for safely taking out either a tube based or the more modern flat panel tv.
As most people won’t need a lot of them, we could sell them in individual packs and in five packs for when one just won’t do it.
Profit opportunity…
mikey
And…I’m a Gravel supporter.
*smacks forehead*
So you’re the one!
Know what I’ve been wondering some past few weeks?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1Mq8kOXV_E
Why doesn’t anyone bring this up anymore?
Is it true Taylor Marsh is just Michelle Malkin’s brain under Amy Winehouse’s wig?
Pffffff, “heartland of Pittsburg”
Ahahahahaha! Goddamn, you’re too funny, Saul.
Jesus, willy, you come to a snark blog and piss and moan, over and over, that the poster is snarking too soon? And then you’re surprised that some folks think you might be a troll?
Geez – the kidney thing was a flippant comment, but now I feel bad. Good luck man, that’s awful.
Btw the Palast thing does start out very “Pimp My Book” but it gets really interesting about a third of the way down. Makes a good point too – if we agree that the DAs were fired inappropriately, why weren’t they rehired?
Now don’t bring Amy Winehouse down to their level, she can really hold a tune while she whines about staying out of rehab.
Well now that the snotshit has been beaten out of that, here for your enjoyment is today’s email from some barking moonbat scam. I swear, half the ads are for snake oil – real snake oil, this tonic or that rub.
Anyway, I present this to demonstrate that certain um, personality types will always hear what they want and deny what they don’t like regardless of the objective facts.
it speaks for the heartland of Pittsburgh.
Darlin’ Pittsburgh hasn’t had a Republican mayor or city council member since 1933. The ratio of Democrats to Republicans is 5 to 1. All three state senators, all nine state representatives, and Mike Doyle, representing the 14th district in the US House, are Democrats.
If Pittsburght is the heartland, you ain’t.
>The Obama campaign has never – repeat, never – done anything nearly as irresponsible as branding Hillary Clinton an anti-Semite. I’m sorry, but that just will not wash.
Whoa, whoa there Brad, they were only accusing Obama of hating Jews to distract from Hillary’s lies about Bosnia.
Geez, what’s Clinton supposed to do? Tell the truth that she lied?!?!
Anyway if Clinton doesn’t win what the hell is the point of the Democratic Party even contesting November? They might as well just shut down till 2012 so the voters can be given a chance to vote correctly instead for someone other than Clinton.
I like this one, from Jerome at MyDD:
“… you would think that Obama supporters, and his campaign, confident as they are that it’s 90% sewed up and in the bag, that they’d stop to think a bit about not alienating the Clinton voters that they’d need to win over McCain, wouldn’t you?”
Apparently, Obama’s tone-deaf failure to renounce his own campaign and endorse Hillary is really starting to alienate people.
Oh – and because it’s funny in it’s patheticousness.
DAMN! I did NOT misuse that apostrophe! It just…happened. Evil fekking keyboard.
Lets get all entrepreneurial here. If we do end up witnessing a rash of accidental shootings as a result of teeveeicide, let’s invent a line of anti-television ammunition specifically designed for safely taking out either a tube based or the more modern flat panel tv.
I would think your standard rubber bullets would do the trick, no?
That’s twice that Willy has claimed to leave, and twice he’s come back. I guess he’s taking the same attitude toward this thread that Hillary took toward Michigan and Florida: “Nope, not gonna go there, they don’t count. Wait, no, I changed my mind.”
I myself tremble before the awesome power of Some Left Blogs.
The fact is, Pittsburgh is in the breadbasket rust belt of the heartland of the United States, where men are men and we’re losing jobs, thanks to the economic bigtory of politicians like Hussein Obama. We need less politics, not more, which is why John McCain will carry the heartland in November to a win in the election, and we can get on creating more jobs in heartland places like Pittsburgh.
Heheheheeeeee
“Breadbasket Rust Belt”
That’s pretty good.
But Saul, McCain has already promised fewer jobs. How can this be?
Let’s just shorten things up and say Hillary is starting to pull a Nader.
Did I just get spam blocked?
Aieeeeeeee.
I voted for Hillary for Senator with great enthusiasm in 2000, and regardless of her performance in the Senate, she did good things for the state of New York. If she locked up this nomination months ago, and Obama simply got beat by her better organization, money, connections, etc., that would be a reflection of Hillary’s strength. Great. She would have my vote and support.
If she wins now, it will only be by destroying Obama, the candidate who outorganized her and did a better job of franky communicating the values that Dems and Independents want to hear.
I’m not sure if the Democrat party is better at losing or capitulating. They are good at both. I can’t vote for a Democrat who behaves like a nasty, entitled GOPer. Her behavior is nauseating and the party “leadership’s” seeming acceptance of the same, is doing little to endear me to the party of perpetual losers.
No, I won’t vote for McCain either.
Duros, maybe he’s counting on a reverse Malthus effect, where fewer jobs result in fewer people, therefore higher rates of employment.
Saul: I tracked down the only Republican in Pittsburgh. You can go chat up the admiral on what a great heartland kinda city it is. Go on, scoot.
The Medieval Warm Period was significantly warmer than temperatures today – and was a golden age for agriculture, innovation, and lifespan
Except for that little Black Death thingie that happened.
Apparently, Obama’s tone-deaf failure to renounce his own campaign and endorse Hillary is really starting to alienate people.
you owe me a new keyboard
Except for that little Black Death thingie that happened.
Oh that? That wasn’t warming, that was the Joooooos
You mean the Gravel who just switched to the Libertarian Party–Gravel? You will pledge to vote for Obama when he’s nominated–right?
I’ve been checking out Armando just out of morbid curiosity. At this point I think he’s just playing the marks for hits.
I look forward to Hillary coming to my town and telling my neighbors they’re attending the wrong church.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
g wrote: “I expect Hillary to appear on Rush Limbaugh any day now – that’s what this is leading to.”
Why not? Bill Clinton was on recently. And a while back there was news about Bill lunching with Scaife.
Apparently the Clintons have received their Vast Right Wing Conspiracy membership bracelets.
The fact is, all of you need to shut the hell up.
Heartland.
‘Then claims she couldn’t have expected a quesiton about Wright? And that she couldn’t deflect it?’
The question was about her…directly…
why should she have to deflect a question to protect Obama?
And on what planet has Obama deflected a question to protect her?
So amazing it is just sad,,, as a lifelong democrat that has watched the country destroyed and redefined in the likeness of Dick Cheney’s warped view of what America should be…. I will be voting for either one of the Democratic Candidates….
As one that has always admired the Clinton’s I take no pleasure in confirming that in light of the campaign being run I would find myself holding my nose as I place my vote is for Clinton…. and to be honest willyjsimmons….
“both have been slinging shit during the primary.” does not place Hillary on a moral high ground for her statements and “answering the question” …
I watched for weeks as Faux News Hannity, O’Reilly, et al repeated the smears against Obama ad nauseum… searching for anyway to frame Obama with the inflammatory statements of Farrakhan, ayers, Wright and any other personality that will serve the right wing smear pundits as a talking point to inflame voters and define Obama during the General Election…. These people are GOOD at doing just that…. unfortunately…
The fact that 30 second video’s became the rage for a 2 day fed a media frenzy across all the channels and 24/7 run on faux news…. was met with an appropriate response by Hillary … Not do the Republican smear machine’s job and essentially allow her fellow Democrat the space to deal with it… Not with re-direction on against the other democratic Candidate but with, in the words of Jon Stewart… “speaking to voters as if they were adults” …. (Did not realize how much I miss the adult approach to politics and media that I saw when I was growing up)…. But after a week where Obama has essentially reset the smears I watched your You tube Links and had watched it live in the news conference…. Her response signalled a great loss of respect for Senator Clinton in my eyes…. I did not have a problem with the fact that she answered the question as has been repeated here that she would have left any church if she had heard the pastor making the same statements that were being looped…. It was the calculated line after “answering the Question” where she referred to how ” we cannot disown our family members” our pastors are not family members… This was an obscene smear focussed to re-ignite the Hannity’s and Limbaugh’s smear machine in direct response to the speech made by Obama….
No she is not riding any moral high ground here…. sad for the Democratic party and in effect the Nation….
Except for that little Black Death thingie that happened.
Oh that? That wasn’t warming, that was the Joooooos
My people used to be so good at killing the Goyim. Now we just wage war on Christmas, and they tell me to be quiet, that it’s the same thing but I know it’s not.
I know this is off-thread, but my band Creed made some really provocactive and moving music.
Well actually, there’s a few of things wrong with this:
1) The minor climate era known as the “Medieval Warm Period” occurred during the 16th & 17th century. And it wasn’t significantly warmer than now… it was more like slightly less warmer.
2) The Black Death occurred during the 14th century, when there was a minor ice age… before the Medieval Warm Period.
3) To make things more confusing, there was the warming period before the Black Death that was the height of the Viking Era (10th, 11th century). At that time, it was warm enough that northern Canada and Greenland were quite temperate and folks such as Erik the Red were able to colonize these areas.
4) Right now is about the same or slightly cooler than the Viking Era, since Viking ruins that have been buried underneath glaciers for about 1,000 years have been thawing out for the past 5-10 years.
“Except of course for the fact that a few months ago Hillary had the presidency all sewed up until Obama decided to enter the race and “Unite the party”. That worked pretty good.”
Its HER TURN!!! HER TURN BITCHES!!!!
I’d vote for Scott Stapp …
…
…
…
For County Suck Officer!!
I cannot even remember what this band ‘Creed’ you speak of sounds like.
I gather they weren’t great…?
Is Creed an actual band? I thought it was a device to drive moles out of your yard.
You know, I never would have expected, ever, to see Democrats at each others throats, especially given an election which seems like anyone nominated would have an overwhelming chance to beat whatever brain dead zombie the Rethugs would nominate.
I admit, the Clinton campaign has really turned me off. I am firmly in the Obama camp. And I was a big supporter of hers last year. But really, I wish everyone could take a deep breath and take two steps back and listen to yourselves. If Clinton wins the nomination, I will gratefully go vote for her over McCain, who seems operating with just a tad too little oxygen content for the amount of brain cells remaining. And I will be expecting her to hold up her end of the bargain. But isn’t electing a Democrat more important than anything right now?
I’ll probably be lambasted for even saying that….
Everyone take a deep breath and repeat after me: “My candidate sucks.”
The Obama campaign has never – repeat, never – done anything nearly as irresponsible as branding Hillary Clinton an anti-Semite. I’m sorry, but that just will not wash.
Oh really?
What did you think about the Obama thing calling Hillary the Senator from Punjab?
There’s a new Big Tent Democrat up now, reprising the Unity Ticket gambit–apparently, Obama can still bring Hillary supporters back into the fold for his Vice-Presidential campaign.
He needs to start sucking up right now if he wants it to happen, though.
Saul, you’re a fucking moron.
What did you think about the Obama thing calling Hillary the Senator from Punjab?
You’re saying Obama branded her an anti-Sikh?
Aw, Blue Buddha. You could have let me have my little snarky moment! Big meanie.
…. It was the calculated line after “answering the Question” where she referred to how ” we cannot disown our family members” our pastors are not family members…
I heard the tape of that line on the radio at lunchtime today and I was struck at how carefully and deliberately she spoke when she delivered it. It very much sounded like a prepared line waiting for it’s moment rather than something spoken off the cuff. Deciding to do an interview with Richard Mellon Scaife was about as skummy and dishonest a move as her campaign could possibly make. I agree with the comment above that Hillary has to lose just to be sure that her campaign managers are given a permanent political burial.
…since Viking ruins that have been buried underneath glaciers for about 1,000 years…
So when did the topic switch to football?
I don’t think you’re at the site you think you are. Why do you think being sensible will get you lambasted?
Brad has even said he will vote for whoever wins the nomination. Me too. But the Hillary campaign does reek of Carville and Penn.
I love the smell of self-satisfied entitlement in the morning…
Oh great. One mention of the word ‘Creed’ and everyone runs up to the next thread. I didn’t want you to read my comments anyway ::sniff::
Oh, Hi Toby.
Right now is about the same or slightly cooler than the Viking Era, since Viking ruins that have been buried underneath glaciers for about 1,000 years have been thawing out for the past 5-10 years.
Great. Now a bunch of freshly thawed Vikings are going to climb out of the ice and start pillaging New England. After 1,000 years I’ll bet they’re real hungry too. Well, Al Gore warned you and you just wouldn’t listen.
“I don’t think you’re at the site you think you are. Why do you think being sensible will get you lambasted?”
Oh, I dunno…. Being sensible doesn’t seem to get me very far at work. I figured it was one of those things that has come and gone, sort of like Jiffy Pop Popcorn, and no one told me about it.
Y’know, if Hill were on a quest to swing the Democratic party over to a new and dramatic plan to end the war, or bring us all health care, or save the environment, then I’d say go for it.
But her policies are barely distinguishable from Obama’s. Her only reason for prolonging this fight is personal ambition. Even granting her the point that she gained experience when she and Bill ran the country together, that’s no entitlement. Even the Geriatric Old Party is not about to nominate Nancy Reagan.
If the two candidates were exactly tied, I’d tell Hill to bow out gracefully. You’ve had your time on center stage. It’s time to let the next generation take its place.
A: It was offensive, but less due to the “D-Punjab” bit (which was a reference to a direct quote from Clinton) than due to the common “the unspeakable tragedy of wogs stealing our jobs” theme which is currently pervading the discourse.
B: “Anti-semite” carries such weight because it’s implicitly linked to the Holocaust, something you may have heard of. You can use this counterargument just as soon as outsourcing to India is responsible for the mass murder of 6 million people.
the best thing about the Hillary slamming Wright, and Obama for loyalty, is the same day her (dominionist?) pastor said there was nothing wrong with what Wright said, in context, and praised his ministry. I guess she’ll be changing churches for Sunday, huh?
who’s Hillary’s pastor? Is there a linkie?
Truly, I am bored this afternoon – it must be so!
Point is this: the Clinton campaign has to have Obama’s career end, kaput, finito, for Hillary to be the nominee. They all know it, we all know it.
It’s not like a general election, where the loser can usually walk away. This is the final couple of rounds of a title fight where one boxer is six rounds down: if it’s decided by the judges — that is, the voters — you lose.
So the options are simple: stay in the race and either try to destroy Obama, or hope he destroys himself; or bow out with the grace that it won’t grant Obama. Hillary can concede gracefully now and go back to the Senate. There’s no scenario in which Obama can do the same: he either wins the nomination or his career’s finished.
Hi, gbear. I know, bashing Creed is as entertaining and vapid as using the Great Gazoogle to search out pictures of Brittney’s, um, junk.
Also, actor, you should be ashamed of yourself. There was a time when your Clinton support was simply a reasoned stance, and you advanced it with logical arguments in good faith. Those times are past, and it seems now that you have some peculiar personal vendetta against Obama, considering the ethical depravity of the rhetoric you’re using against him.
Seriously. Do you realize you just declared a moral equivalency between false accusations of anti-semitism and false accusations of excess patronage of a foreign ally? Doesn’t that make you feel even a little pang?
But am I gonna refrain?
Oh, hells no!
care to answer or snark?
If this is the ‘Hillary must protect Obama so he can win the general election’ argument then save it…
both have been slinging shit during the primary.
OK how does a soldier in the same foxhole as me make me stronger by shooting at me?
The Obama staff has stayed pretty close to the issues- the HRC crew has gotten personal. Do you REALLY want to be hit with the same crap at a high level that Hillary and the Clinton campagn has been dishing out?
Would you like to see Michelle Obama question Hillary’s love for America? Or Obama go on record saying that McCain is a better choice then Hillary.
Or if you want to really test and vette HRC, lets drag out ALL the GOP myths and legends about Hill and Bill and give them center stage.
2 things, much of what Mcpeak said is verbatim what Wes Clark has said in the past, the NYC/Miami voters thing was a bit much (and while probably accurate, should also have been applied to the fundies) but, um I really don’t think many people would argue that American Foriegn policy is too beholden to the domestic Israel lobby, just that its not a solely Jewish concern, especially now).
Secondly, and this is I admit hillarious, Hillary’s pastor(the one she’ll talk about not the whacky fundie Family one) has released a letter defending Wright at basically the smae time Hill is attacking him: http://www.foundryumc.org/pdfs/Statement%20concerning%20Rev.%20Jeremiah%20Wright.pdf
Clinton’s pastor’s statement- http://tinyurl.com/3crtrt
Sorry for the linkie facility lackie.
He said: “The Reverend Jeremiah Wright is an outstanding church leader whom I have heard speak a number of times. He has served for decades as a profound voice for justice and inclusion in our society. He has been a vocal critic of the racism, sexism and homophobia which still tarnish the American dream. To evaluate his dynamic ministry on the basis of two or three sound bites does a grave injustice to Dr. Wright, the members of his congregation, and the African-American church which has been the spiritual refuge of a people that has suffered from discrimination, disadvantage, and violence.”
The comment section here must have just passed its federal No Troll Left Unresponded To Twelve Times audit.
I love it.
Whose her wacky fundy pastor? The guy from Foundry is a Methodist. Other than the fact that we drink welchade instead of wine at communion, there’s nothing wacky about Methodists.
What did you think about the Obama thing calling Hillary the Senator from Punjab?
I don’t think much of it but I also don’t think much of your not putting it in context. She and a Sikh fund raiser of hers were the first to use that term so what do you make of her saying that about herself?
And BTW, your question, “What did you think about the Obama thing calling Hillary the Senator from Punjab?”, is a direct Bill Clinton quote. You might want to link to your source next time you paste that somewhere or at least put it in quotes. Because, passing off other people’s words as your own is bad form.
Heck, I’ll vote for Hillary over McCain anyday. Three and a half more years of the Iraq War is still better than four. She might even keep us out of a war with Iran.
Hillary’s whacky sky fairy:
Through all of her years in Washington, Clinton has been an active participant in conservative Bible study and prayer circles that are part of a secretive Capitol Hill group known as the Fellowship. Her collaborations with right-wingers such as Senator Sam Brownback (R-Kan.) and former Senator Rick Santorum (R-Pa.) grow in part from that connection. “A lot of evangelicals would see that as just cynical exploitation,” says the Reverend Rob Schenck, a former leader of the militant anti-abortion group Operation Rescue who now ministers to decision makers in Washington. “I don’t….there is a real good that is infected in people when they are around Jesus talk, and open Bibles, and prayer.”
http://tinyurl.com/26eyz5
Heck, I’ll vote for Hillary over McCain anyday. Three and a half more years of the Iraq War is still better than
foureight.If McCain gets elected, everyone that would vote for a democrat in 2012 will have left the country by then.
If Hillary got the nomination, I wonder if she’d go after McBBQ with as much enthusiasm as she did Obama. That’d be cool.
But naah. She’d probably go running after the wingers like they were the cool kids who snubbed her in fifth grade.
If Hillary becomes our candidate, her handlers will step on every land mine that the GOP puts in front of them. They won’t even have to bury them.
Hillary’s campaign will spend more time thinking about how the GOP will campaign than how she should campaign. They already think and operate that way. They’ll be one step behind on everything, and will never get a point out that isn’t a reaction to something rather than a new and distinct directon. Her staff doesn’t know how to do anything new. It’ll suck.
If Hillary becomes our candidate, her handlers will step on every land mine that the GOP puts in front of them.
The Republicans won’t even need to go to any such trouble.
“Hey everyone, did I tell you about the time I went to Bosnia and had to dodge sniper fire?” Foot, meet bullet.
zeppo:
WHAT THE HELL IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?!!11! HILLBAMARY IS TEH WORST THING EVAR!!!!1one!
/spittle
and gbear:
I checked…neither Australia nor Canada really wants someone of my…ahem…experienced nature to immigrate. ‘Fraid I’m stuck here so let’s all make an effort to not fucking throw this election away, ‘k?
I will add that I will still vote for Hillary if she is the Dem candidate.
By the way, I just read the POS post that inspired this thread. “The examples of Obama starting with the negativity are legion”. Then: no examples cited. “Barack Obama blocked the Michigan revote”. Bull. I live in Michigan. We didn’t revote because we have no money for another election. Then Big Tent says “but I’m sure Hillary would have blocked it if the roles were reversed.” Nice moral high ground you got there.
Wow. That’s one horribly counter-factual, poorly reasoned post.
Everyone is ignoring the big elephant in the room. I think it is conservative to say that at least 5% won’t vote for a woman or black man regardless of party affiliation or even party leaning.
Yeah, that means you, Independents.
The Dems should still win given the absolute meta-clusterf**k that is the Bush Admin, but they’ve blown it before, haven’t they? And this time it will be two against one, too, because Media Man is obviously going to be on McCain’s side.
Media Man has a lot of influence over how people vote, and a vested interest in a close, contentious race.
If I had to bet right now, I’d bet on McCain in the general. That would be bad, as Mr. Mackey says. Umm kay?
So the cannibalism going on is repugnant to me. And as someone who will vote for either one, because I love my country, respect both, and think both have great skills (even if of a different type) to lead the country, I say the Clinton campaign has gone further into the mud.
Politics ain’t beanbag, sure, but making the case for the GOP is a little bit silly, and I don’t see Obama doing that as much as Clinton.
Well here’s some excellent sourcing for you. Hot from the Evans Novak Political Report e-mail:
[emphasis added]
I can’t believe I’m doing this….
I totally forgot I had saved this linkie. It’s teh funny. Can someone please edit the voice-over to Mt. St. Hillary or something? I just think it would be even more hysterical; call it the true nature of…. or something.
http://platypuscomix.cartoonsdammit.com/fpo/videos/sthelensbosom81.html
For simplicity’s sake, lets call that 5%, “old Southerners.”
Which of course is NOT to say that old Southerners are universally racist or misogynist or just plain ol’ fashioned. I’m just saying, “watch the numbers” on Nov. 8.
PeeJ, what… what the fuck was that? Did they actually broadcast that on TV? I half suspect that the narrator was just trying to get a woman, any woman, to prove him wrong by showing him her boobies. With luck she told him to go hump lava until he cooled off.
PeeJ said,
March 27, 2008 at 1:00
I can’t believe I’m doing this….
I totally forgot I had saved this linkie. It’s teh funny. Can someone please edit the voice-over to Mt. St. Hillary or something? I just think it would be even more hysterical; call it the true nature of…. or something.
http://platypuscomix.cartoonsdammit.com/fpo/videos/sthelensbosom81.html
Boobies!
Yes, they ACTUALLY broadcast that. One of the two worst local TV news segments I’ve EVAH seen.
And while I’m at it, I also found this linkie I was looking for so’s I could put in that other thread the other day.
http://www.atheist-community.org/images/cartoon/13h26Oi2mV1420C111474.jpg
Esprit d’escalier or whatever it is
Fuck this shit.
You guys get your wordpress crap figured out, let me know.
I’m gonna go do something else.
Shit.
mikey
i can post ?
test
Armando has always been an idiot – however, i took jeralyn for a reasonable type not prone to cognitive dissonance.
there reputations are in much the same condition as the clintons after this horrible last three months.
I wish Obama the best, but at this point I don’t think there’s a chance in hell that the elites would let someone grab onto power who might actually change things. He’ll either conform to what they want, they’ll rig the election, or he’ll be killed.
Y’know, UgPink, back in 2006 I was confidently asserting that Hillary Clinton, however many fundraisers she attended, was NOT going to run for President because she had every reason to know just how many NRA-blessed lost souls are loose in America’s Heartland™, waiting for a truly media-worthy target such as ‘Hitlery’. Obviously I was misled by my memories of Teddy Kennedy’s 1980 run – *there* was a man who campaigned as if he could already hear the bullet with his name on it…
I try to steer clear of full-tinfoil paranoia theories, but I swear to Goddess that the last couple of months have left me wondering what kind of NSA ‘Total Information Awareness’ threats were used to get HRC into the race, to keep HRC in the race, and/or to move BHO to his current status at the pointy end of the Democratic spearhead. The only thing I’d bet on right now is that even 50 years of cynicism haven’t inured me to the roccoco political teratomas we’re going to be forced into witnessing over the next seven months
Oh great. *Now* I’m not good enough to post here anymore, WordPress?
I blame the Republicans.
I wish Obama the best, but at this point I don’t think there’s a chance in hell that the elites would let someone grab onto power who might actually change things. He’ll either conform to what they want, they’ll rig the election, or he’ll be killed.
Y’know, UgPink, back in 2006 I was confidently asserting that Hillary Clinton, however many fundraisers she attended, was NOT going to run for President because she had every reason to know just how many NRA-blessed lost souls are loose in America’s Heartland™, waiting for a truly media-worthy target such as ‘Hitlery’. Obviously I was misled by my memories of Teddy Kennedy’s 1980 run – *there* was a man who campaigned as if he could already hear the bullet with his name on it…
I try to steer clear of full-tinfoil paranoia theories, but I swear to Goddess that the last couple of months have left me wondering what kind of NSA ‘Total Information Awareness’ threats were used to get HRC into the race, to keep HRC in the race, and/or to move BHO to his current status at the pointy end of the Democratic spearhead. The only thing I’d bet on right now is that even 50 years of cynicism haven’t inured me to the roccoco political teratomas we’re going to be forced into witnessing over the next seven months
The new Gallup poll says that 19% of Obama supporters would vote for McCain over Hillary and a whopping 28% of Hillary supporters would abandon Obama for McCain.
Whoever wins, those numbers will flatten out considerably. But starting from such high numbers is a big, big problem.
Um, these people do know they aren’t REQUIRED to vote, don’t they?
Seriously, if you hate one of the Democratic candidates, good for you. That’s what democracy is all about. But what on earth is McCain going to do for Obama’s supporters that Hillary wouldn’t? What is he going to do for Hillary supporters that Obama wouldn’t? Stay home or vote for Nader if you have to, but for fuck’s sake, if you’re gonna vote, vote for somebody who actually represents something you believe in.
Clinton Rules; Everything that happens is Clinton’s fault. No matter who does it, it is part of Hillary’s evil plan for world domination.
Obama Rules: Obama and supporters never do everything bad. Face it, he’s perfect in every way (even though he’s a one time Senator who has done nothing, and since he has no history, there is nothing to stick to him).
Well, too bad Sadly No! has become another depraved hate site, like Kos, Huffinstuff and Buzzflash: all Hil-hating all the time.
You are being used by Republican opps.
Gravel is right!
Well, too bad Sadly No! has become another depraved hate site
Too bad? The champagne doesn’t stop flowing unless the akvavit starts!
Gravel rules!
I mean, one of our local good-guy politicians recently got himself nominated for VP by the Greens, and I thought, “There’s nothing you can do this year (always assuming you’re not Lieberman, an assumption I’d grant to any sentient being out of courtesy) worse than whoring off after the Greens to help McCain.”
Wrong!
Gravel is just brilliant.
Thanks a million, Mr. ex-senator. (Einstein and I have always thanked the person who points out we’ve said something stupid. Don’t want to be wrong for any longer than necessary.)
I feel bad for all you liberals. Your party is in shambles. Billary and Hussein look like a couple of school kids. It’s fun to watch, but pretty pathetic. How about Al Gore??? He’d be more attractive to all you tree huggers than these two! Here’s to four more years of republican rule….cheers!
The Obama campaign has never – repeat, never – done anything nearly as irresponsible as branding Hillary Clinton an anti-Semite. I’m sorry, but that just will not wash.
They branded Bill a racist for saying that the nomination wouldn’t be sewn up after 3 states.