Credit where she be due

When Mike Kinsley isn’t being an annoying contrarian-for-the-sake-of-contrarianism, he can be pretty good. This is one of his better efforts:

Imagine that you had been told in 2003 that when George W. Bush finished his second term, dozens of American soldiers and hundreds of Iraqis would be dying violently every month; that a major American goal would be getting the Iraqi government to temper its “debaathification” campaign so that Saddam Hussein’s former henchmen could start running things again (because they know how); and that “only” 100,000 American troops would be needed to sustain this equilibrium.

You might have several words to describe this situation, but “success” would not be one of them.

Too true. Besides, if Bush had tried employing our bear-and-puma strategy, he could have had violence in Iraq down to practically nothing.*

*If only because no one would be left alive.

 

Comments: 140

 
 
 

One small nitpick: I don’t think he uses the correct term for as surge that surges then does not receed.

It’s called an “escalation”.

 
 

I’ve never quite forgiven Kinsley for being such a wimpy token “liberal” back in his Crossfire days. Then again, that’s pretty much the only kind of “liberal” allowed on American television, so I guess he’s not entirely to blame.

 
 

I’ve never quite forgiven Kinsley for being such a wimpy token “liberal” back in his Crossfire days. Then again, that’s pretty much the only kind of “liberal” allowed on American television, so I guess he’s not entirely to blame.

[hunched over in a dark corner]

Now come on guys, that’s not… well, now you may have a point, but perhaps not all liberals… erm, what I mean to say is, that I have always considered myself to be… of course… well, I don’t want to argue, but I think you might just be wrong about this one.

[glasses flash menacingly]

 
"Oh Stewardess, I Speak 'Nut"
 

. . . that “only” 100,000 American troops would be needed to sustain this equilibrium.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the true number closer to 175,000? And that’s not even counting the tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of private mercenaries contractors, or the remnants of the “coalition of the willing.”

 
 

This reminds me of how ironic it is that the bear that ate the Grizzly Man is the one he nicknamed “Jeffrey Dahmer.”

No….wait…..I just made that up.

 
Smiling Mortician
 

Re Kinsley on Crossfire — y’know, I kinda hate the “wimpy token” thing. He was up against Pat Buchanan, as I recall, and Pat’s always been of the O’Reilly school of debate: shout, scream, snarl, cut to commercial. My recollection is that Kinsley typically had pretty good arguments and often tried to talk over Buchanan, but wasn’t quite the bellower that Pat’s always been. I don’t think that makes him wimpy — it just means he’s either trying to play by the rules or fundamentally unable to be a real asshole. Yeah, he got shouted down, but primarily because he was being (mostly) rational and (perhaps too) civil.

Which brings us to the question: do we really want those who speak for teh left (or what passes for it in the media) to be shrieking eels? That’s a serious question, BTW — I’m honestly conflicted about the answer.

 
 

Imagining that the government told us that is too improbable. Can’t buy it.

But imagine that a major public figure made a prediction in 2003 about how our war effort would look five years later. Imagine that the prediction was 100% accurate.

Now imagine the rain of scorn that would fall on that public figure. They would be objectively pro-Saddam, a defeatocrat, a terrorist sympathizer, un-American, etc. Every cheeto-dusted hand would be raised against them. Malkin et al. would make uproarious photoshops of pictures of them, to which Reynolds would grunt “Heh. Indeed.” The very notion that the war would go as it, in fact, has — and that America’s ostensible goals would morph as they, in fact, have — would be treated as anti-government propaganda of the deepest dye.

 
 

The fact is, the troop surge is working. No American soldiers have been killed in combat in months. Iraq is becoming stable and orderly thanks to the leadership of General Patreaus. The fact that you liberals still complain about the Iraq war when it is going so well proves that you are biased against America and our President and desire a terrorist victory. As fat ass Michael Moore said “The Iraqi insurgents are the minute men of our time.” I’ve got news for you libs, the war in Iraq is now going so well that it is going to be a non-issue this election. That means a Republican landslide victory in both the Presidency and Congress my lefty friends.

 
 

mikey smells like shit said,
I like pie!

Ugh, the Most Tiresomest Troll of them all.

 
 

Ahh, jeez, here we go again.

Delusional bastard calling MY odor into question.

I’d rather smell like shit (which, BTW, I DON’T) than be so out of touch as to make the statement “No American soldiers have been killed in combat in months”. Isn’t that kind of disrespectful of the five young Americans who died futilely over there yesterday?

mikey

 
 

Which brings us to the question: do we really want those who speak for teh left (or what passes for it in the media) to be shrieking eels? That’s a serious question, BTW — I’m honestly conflicted about the answer

If we must be serious, I think we need both. Not all conservative commentators are bellowing apes. People like Brit Hume can be just as conservative but appear to be moderate and reasonable in contrast. They push the Overton Window to the right and make moderates look like liberals.

During the 60s and 70s there were a lot of angry liberals who were getting message out to the public. When was the last time that you saw an angry liberal? I see them all the time, at my office, in coffee shops, among my friends – but never on TV, unless its my own reflection screaming at the shithead who gets airtime. There is a lot to be pissed about, quite frankly, and that is what grabs people’s attention. Once you have control of the conversation, you can leave it up to the “reasonable people” to work out the nuances.

 
 

MSLS, in addition to having a nonexistent website (which would be pretty awesome if it did exist, I’ll admit) also seems not to be following the news:

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iJOyVUZG4J-7YAqrQ5R9PRdyHTWA

Thus, I refute thee, MSLS!

 
 

Regardless of whether five soldiers died in Iraq yesterday or not, far fewer are dying since the brilliant troop surge began. Iraq is now very close to being a stable orderly secular democracy like their negibhor, our powerful friend and ally Israel.

 
 

…my lefty friends.

You talkin’ to me? You talkin’ to me? You talkin’ to me? Then who the hell else are you talking… you talking to me? Well I’m the only one here. Who the fuck do you think you’re talking to?

 
 

Hey, troll, read, learn: http://tinyurl.com/ytl7na

 
 

But how do you keep them hungry when they’re munching on Iraqis?

I think the carnivores would have to be given gastric bypass surgery, so that they’d stay hungry.

 
 

No American soldiers have been killed in combat in months.

Wrong

Disgustingly wrong. Vilely wrong. You should have to face the families of the people who’ve been killed, you fucking loser.

 
 

Iraq is now very close to being a stable orderly secular democracy

Move there, then, asshole.

 
 

Hey Bickle. Let’s go get a beer. See if any of these hard cases wanna come on down and chat…

mikey

 
 

You can’t IED a puma. Puma’s IED YOU!

Yeah, well, mikey’s dad is better then YOUR dad, Smells Like Shit!

 
 

“….that’s not even counting the tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of private mercenaries contractors…”

Last Sunday, the little woman and I got together with some friends here in town. Their oldest son is hardcore Army (Ranger), and has been deployed to both Iraq and Afghanistan many times in the last 3+ years (I think Ranger units do shorter stints, but more of them, than regular units).

The Ranger’s mom noted that he gets out (i.e. has fulfilled his active duty obligation) this month. His first order of business? “He’s going to sign on as a contractor, since he needs to make some money. These boys finish their tours flat broke.”

True story.

To summarize: after you risk everything for no money, you qualify to risk everything for some money.

How fucked up is that?

 
 

I demand the other bear and puma picture. You know the one I mean.

C’mon, it’s been a sucky week already and it ain’t gettin’ any better before the end of the month. Gimme bear and puma pic. Please? I’ll be good, I promise.

 
 

That’s fucked, RWsnarkle. That poor family – that poor mom, thinking of her kid going back in and what he’s risking.

 
 

Some Guy. My dad was a violent asshole, burned out and used up in the south pacific and the occupation of japan. I understand him, but I don’t forgive him. He can fuck off.

Rightwingsnarkle. If I had twenty fewer years and six fewer felonies I’d go in a heartbeat. You’re totally covered, you have the best weapons and intel, and you get to make up your own rules for a couple hundred grand a year.

Lets be clear. Thats fifteen THOUSAND tax-free dollars a month for doing the same shit in better conditions. You don’t go? Fine, but frankly? You’re an idiot.

It’s not the DOODS that are fucked up, its the system. You can’t hate the mercs when the system NEEDS them. I hate them because I’ve had to deal with them. But frankly? I’d take that job in two heartbeats…

mikey

 
 

mikey smells like shit has to be joking. No one could possibly be that colossally stupid and ignorant who isn’t named Bill O’Reilly.

Hmmm….

Anyway, the word I would use in place of “success” is “clusterfuck.”

That sounds about right.

 
 

Hey Sidhe.

Let’s go break something…

mikey

 
 

Imagine that you had been told in 2003 that when George W. Bush finished his second term, dozens of American soldiers and hundreds of Iraqis would be dying violently every month

Nobody could have foreseen, etc. etc.

 
 

Another vote for the “let 100 flowers bloom” theory of liberal propaganda … street stuff is good, inspirational rhetoric is good, soft-spoken reason is good … let’s just keep it honest — f’rinstance, the mighty O has taken a shitload of dollars from Wall Street — not complainin’, that’s the game he’s playing, and playing to win — and said some worrying things about supporting the Afghanistan intervention. I like him a lot, but we have to gently hold his metaphorical feet to the fire. He’ll thank us for it. Quietly. Like, under his breath. But not with his fingers crossed. Meanwhile, we can honestly (pick your forum) call the opponent a war-mongering/militaristic/diplomatically challenged old fart/insider/veteran … you get the picture? (Yes, we see.)

 
 

Isn’t that kind of disrespectful of the five young Americans who died futilely over there yesterday?

They must have been “phony soldiers”.

 
 

I understand the siren song of the cash, but Mikey, seriously, a mercenary in Iraq?

 
 

The problem with Kinsley is not just that he’s too civil…he’s too centrist. He’s been a classic Near-Moderate-Republican since he was at the New Republic. I remember moaning about how NOT LEFT Kinsley was when I was a pup, for god’s sake…if this is our representation, it’s not just the PRESENTATION that’s at fault. It’s the POLITICS.

But then, I’m a fuckin socialist, so what the fuck do I know.

 
Smiling Mortician
 

Shell Goddamnit, I completely buy your argument and stand corrected. And I’m not just saying that because I love typing your name.

 
 

Off topic- Megan McArdle linked to Ace of Spades while guestblogging at Instapundit today.
I fear that a hole has been torn in the fabric of reality, and soon Ben Stein will have the form of a unicorn.

 
 

Oops. Meant to include the linl.

 
 

Well, actually, I prefer to dine on right-wing pundits, but, y’know, they give me such gas.

 
 

I understand the siren song of the cash, but Mikey, seriously, a mercenary in Iraq?

C’mon now. Killings killing. The size of the paycheck doesn’t change the moral calculation. Just the risk/reward calculation. If I’ll kill for eighteen five, why the FUCK wouldn’t I kill for two hundred?

Goddam it, I didn’t invent the system. Why shouldn’t I, or any other kid with skills go ahead and cash in?

mikey

 
Glenn Reynolds Bot On Feedback Loop
 

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Well, I guess that’s a reason. I don’t know, something’s wrong with this world.

 
 

That’s a serious question, BTW — I’m honestly conflicted about the answer.

Smiling Mortician, you’re not the only one. I sometimes envy the sheer organization of the right. You know, like when every conservative person you know suddenly seems to have the same argument, in the exact same words (read: talking points), lined up in advance. They all get the same memo. Literally. And I think, damn, if only I could get my shit that much together.

But then I think, fuck that shit. I don’t want to wait by my fax machine to get my opinion for the day. Let them be more in lockstep, let them scream louder, let them be bigger assholes. That’s why they win, but it’s also why they lose.

 
Smiling Mortician
 

But then I think, fuck that shit.

Precisely. Thanks, Me.

Yes, they’re in lockstep, but it means they’re not thinking. I’d rather think than be robotically organized. It just sucks that robotically organized seems to trump thoughtful, at least in American politics . . .

 
 

Well, Mikey, I suspect that’s the same reasoning this kid’s using. I just think that it truly sucks to run the gauntlet twice. The odds just don’t seem too good.

 
mikey shells like smit
 

I swallow!!

 
 

Yes, they’re in lockstep, but it means they’re not thinking. I’d rather think than be robotically organized. It just sucks that robotically organized seems to trump thoughtful, at least in American politics . . .

Well, until the whole machine marches off the goddamn cliff like it is right now. Faster! FASTER!

But I don’t think that we have to always be ponderous and thoughtful. We can be mad without being in lockstep. The problem is that the token leftie is supposed to be speaking for all the lefties, and doesn’t. If a few angry voices are heard, then they have to put in a new chair for the angry lefty next to reasonable leftie and serious conservative and batshit crazy conservative.

When was the last time that you saw a socialist on the news?

 
 

PS-
I don’t know I think Afghanistan is viewed differently than Iraq by most people, and frankly for good reason.

 
 

Yes, they’re in lockstep, but it means they’re not thinking.

Teh Borg.

 
 

What’d rhinos ever do to you?

mikey, I’d totally go break shit with you, especially if we wound up the night getting stoned sitting on a picnic table in a park somewhere after dark, but I’ve just promised to be good in hopes of bear and puma pic, so you’d have to swear not to tell on me.

 
 

Which brings us to the question: do we really want those who speak for teh left (or what passes for it in the media) to be shrieking eels? That’s a serious question, BTW — I’m honestly conflicted about the answer.

The simple answer: Actors. From theater, not movies. People who have trained voices and are trained TO BE HEARD (without shouting) no matter what the fuck else is happening on or off stage. And believe me, there’s always shit happening on and off stage, usually in the middle of your soliloquy.

A Bill O’Reilly could try to shout over me, but he probably wouldn’t be able to drown me out. And, like most female theater actors, I can be heard without using my high register so I couldn’t be accused of ‘shrieking.’ Also, and this is the beauty part, most well-trained theater actors DON’T EVEN NEED A MICROPHONE, so if Billo cut someone off they would STILL BE HEARD.

Or, you know, politicians could FUCKING LEARN HOW TO COMMUNICATE, since it is part of their jobs.

But that’s crazy talk. So go with the actors. We need the work and most of us are leftist anyway, so what the fuck.

 
 

What we really need to do is have a total party, with all of us, D Sidhe and mikey and everyone, hanging out in the park with a blanket on the grass and a couple of six-packs.

I’m back home after a visit in East Texas with the 80+ year old mom; serious mixed feelings about that. And I just put my spouse on a plane for a visit with HIS 80+ year old mom in Florida.

so here I sit, all by myself if you don’t count the geriatric Rottweiler, drinking and listening to my ITunes and singing along at the top of my lungs. Anyone remember Sergio Mendes and Brazil ’66? that’s good shit. Of course, so is Bootsy Collins, George Clinton and P-Funk (I like my funk uncut!).

 
 

“What we really need to do is have a total party…”

Oh, I definitely wanna be there.

 
 

What ever happened to our Boston Sadlython?

 
 

Many of us have already died, youngster. We’re just waiting for our opportunity to lay down and rest…

mikey

 
 

Iraq is so damn successful that Turkey is about to invade Iraq because it is a safe haven for Kurdish terrorists.

-GSD

 
 

Socraticsilence: Afghanistan is not Iraq. But the policy at present is a counterproductive disaster. I can’t even try to make a joke. Unless advising people to Kipple counts.

 
 

Oh, I definitely wanna be there.

Well, we could do worse than to have a West Coast Sadly-fest, here in the wilds of Topanga – maybe at our wonderful Community House – in a grassy field up in the mountains, music, beer, art, and assorted vices.

Or at a certain property on a hillside in Malibu that I know. Only no marshmallow-roasting allowed during fire season.

 
 

My armadillo just died pokingly after nearly 138 weeks – he was the love of my batty life. I don’t know how he got stuck in that traffic cone. I’m sure you know an armadillo demands riches but I had no riches left.

 
 

g,
I just inherited some vinyl records by Sergio Mendes and Brazil 66. I’ve been listening to their greatest hits record a lot lately. I like their version of Scarborough Fair. My friends know I’m a record junky so everyone winds up giving me their beat up old record collections & I gladly accept them. Hope that you’re getting grounded OK after your trip.

 
 

“What we really need to do is have a total party…”

But we haven’t even had the angry party yet.

 
 

I could hold an angry heartland party during the GOP convention. My house is about a mile from the convention center and a block from the main road between downtown and the airport….

 
 

gbear – my spouse recently had the pleasure of meeting Lani Hall, the singer in Brazil ’66 – he’d had a crush on her since he was 14 or so.

I’m listening to Equinox, which has “Watch what happens” on it. I think Scarborough Fair is on a CD I haven’t downloaded yet.

Jennifer, let’s have both an angry party and a laid back party!

 
 

If anyone’s interested in a laid back party in Memphis, I could set that shit right up.

 
 

That would be cool, Jen. I like Memphis. I love the Orpheum Theatre there.

Of course, I’m pushing for the West Coast Malibu/Topanga Sadly-fest.

 
 

Iraq is now very close to being a stable orderly secular democracy like their negibhor, our powerful friend and ally Israel.

Which is news to Syria and Jordan, since they used to be situated between Israel and Iraq.

Wow, those neocons really did reorder the Middle East!

 
 

Can we make salutes?

And g’s right, we’re gonna need to do this on a beach.

If for no other reason than it’s a good way to make sure nothing important gets broken…

mikey

 
 

C’mon now. Killings killing. The size of the paycheck doesn’t change the moral calculation. Just the risk/reward calculation. If I’ll kill for eighteen five, why the FUCK wouldn’t I kill for two hundred?

Goddam it, I didn’t invent the system. Why shouldn’t I, or any other kid with skills go ahead and cash in?

Because the killing stops being in ‘self-defense’ and becomes ‘murder for pay’. The soldier stops being a “tool of the state” and starts being a ‘self-interested provocateur.’

I hope in the future you’ll refrain from your ‘war horror’ stories? You see, “War is Hell, unless I can make a buck or two” really makes those all ring hollow…

 
 

Goddam it, I didn’t invent the system. Why shouldn’t I, or any other kid with skills go ahead and cash in?

Cool.

Just one thing – am I expected to show any sympathy when your legs get blown off?

 
 

I think the boston sadlython was remained Sadly, never!
I’m still debating the merits of Sadly, single!, tho I think being able to refer to the SS here all the time would be a big plus.

 
 

The mom thing –

Well – My dad died on February 1, 2006. He and mom, after living in the northeast all their adult live, retired and moved back to Texas where they were raised, choosing a small college town in East Texas to live.

It seemed like a good place – medical centers, culture, within driving distance of their relatives and big cities.

Only mom has a tendancy towards reclusiveness, kind of a mild agorophobia. Dad was the one who was the social initiator for them.

When he died it was kind of sudden (pneumonia) and mom really had a hard time adjusting.

Now, 6 years later, she is living by herself in a town where she has fewer and fewer friends; her children live in distant cities; she doesn’t get out much and it’s difficult to visit her. She is very very lonely without Dad – I honestly think she wishes she’d die soon and join him (she’s said as much). As an atheist, she takes no comfort in a church or anything like that. She also resolutely refuses to do anything to improve her mental and emotional state – she doesn’t believe in psychologists or counselors or support groups or therapy or anything like that. She also isn’t interested in volunteering or taking classes or anything at all like that.

so she sits in her house and does nothing other than crossword puzzles, sudoku, and reading books.

She complains about various problems in her life, but if you try to talk to her about how to solve them, she shoots down your ideas, so that I’ve learned that she isn’t really interested in solving them, only in complaining about them.

All I can do is spend time with her and listen to her – but its actually really hard, It’s depressing and isolated and fruitless – and although I love her and am willing to indulge her, it isn’t something that anyone can do for a long period of time.

So I just spent about 4 days with her, and now I’m back home, and feeling a combination of duty done, frustration and annoyance at the experience, sadness that I can’t do anyhing to help her, and relief that I’m the fuck outa there.

My spouse is visiting his mom. she is the same age, and also isolated – the difference between his mom and mine is that his mom still loves life; my mom can’t take any pleasure in life. That is so sad.

anyway — WTF? Let’s plan the party!

 
 

I hope in the future you’ll refrain from your ‘war horror’ stories? You see, “War is Hell, unless I can make a buck or two” really makes those all ring hollow…

Oh yeah? Reckon so. Sure.

Hokay.

But lemme ask you something, owlbear1. Straight up.

You ever kill anybody? You ever have the pleasure of watching the life go out of their eyes? Did you ever come home with that memory? Not the vague shapes falling when you shoot them. The ones close up. Hard. Ugly.

Now. If you did, tell me how you decided whether that was a killing or murder. No, seriously, I’m all ears. ‘Cause I don’t know anybody who has that kind of all encompassing certainty.

Killing is killing. Go ahead. Tell me it’s not. Tell me where the line is. Tell me why I wake up crying and sweating at night. Tell me where the PTSD comes from. Give me the benefit of your greater wisdom.

I’m gonna go ahead and use your words.

I hope in the future you’ll refrain from passing judgment on people in extremis. Combat makes it’s own rules, and until you’ve had to make those kind of decisions? I appreciate your participation, but fuck off, ok?

mikey

 
 

Just one thing – am I expected to show any sympathy when your legs get blown off?

Hmm.

Not sure I’d give a fuck one way or another.

Guess that would be up to you.

What do you think?

mikey

 
 

Whoops I got the date wrong. Dad died in 2002.

 
 

Well, I’m gonna crash.

But I want to leave you with a rumination on moral certainty.

You are lucky that it’s so clear. For many, including me, it’s just been so goddam muddy. Don’t listen to me, or anybody else. Your heart, your experience, your compass. You KNOW. At least right up until you don’t.

I admire your certainty, your ability to designate the good ones and the bad ones from afar. I have to admit, it’s just a little to damn simplistic for me, for what I know, but if it works for you, well, sit back in comfortable judgment.

I mean, if you look at it up close, what could possibly be wrong with that formulation?

mikey

 
 

Goodnight, mikey. have a good sleep, and wake up to another good day. We all do our best.

 
 

mikey–

You might want to ease up on the non-soldiers (like myself).

I’m a former VA doctor, so I know what it’s like to see someone in the agonies of combat wounds.

I know what it’s like to have a vet describe the horrors they witnessed and inflicted.

I know what it’s like to see salty stone hard former combatants completely freak out and lose it.

The rest of the commenters, not so much.

They can’t understand your PTSD, your midnight sweats, your night terrors.

You might want to cut them a tiny bit of slack.

Just an opinion.

I’m sorry for your loss.

Cheers.

 
 

No, Mikey. I’ve never killed anyone but I have watched a family of 5 slowly bleed to death, trapped in their car. Seen a drunk driver so intoxicated he didn’t realize he had cut himself in half. Carried body parts in garbage bags and retched at the stink of bodies whose muscles have completely relaxed. All of this before I was 9 years old.
My father was a police officer in a rural area and often took me out with him on the weekends.
So no, I’ve never killed anyone but I think I have first hand knowledge of the tears.

Where is the line between murder and killing?
How’s this for a line? Going back for more killing in the name of a bigger paycheck, and only a bigger paycheck.

Now for PTSD. Mine comes from being completely helpless to stop a horrible situation and feeling extreme guilt for it. It comes from being SO terrified I gave in and did what I was told and the shame I feel for those actions. It comes from having survived. But I’m sorry. You are going to have to face your own demons, in your own way.

And as for passing judgment? I didn’t. I said talking about how horrible war is and also saying you’d go back if you could make a lot a money at it really undermines the narrative. How much money does it take to make it so the killing and death is not a horror?

 
 

So I came home from a few bevvies at the pub, to discover a problem with the drains. Have just spent quarter of an hour unblocking the toilet. Suffice to say that in terms of fragrance, Mikey has nothing on me.

 
 

Namestealers need writing skill.

 
 

I think what mikey’s getting at is that, after having been to war and killed a whole bunch, is that it becomes somewhat normalized. And yet, one is aware of what one has done, and that it cannot easily be reconciled with “normal” society.

So, why not re-up at a much higher pay rate? After all, one has already committed many acts of killing. Is doing it because you’re told to by a military really any better of a reason than for pay?

In other words, if you’re already condemned to Hell (either in the traditional religious sense, or in a psychic – secular sense), why not collect a decent paycheck before you get there?

 
 

Sorry about the plugged toilet, Smutclyde. I had to deal with that when I came home from Texas.

 
 

something tells me bears and pumas would be dead meat in iraq since neither have the capability to fire machine guns and throw hand grenades. But hell, at least you could get the humane society and the spca involved in hating this war. the more on that bandwagon, the merrier.

 
 

I still say you can’t trust the Puma’s!!

 
 

Well, hey, everyone. I either have to go to bed or open another bottle, and I think the former is better than the latter. I’m also starting to listen to the same songs over and over – a sure sign of drunkeness.

It’s raining outside, and my old dog is already nudging me the way he does, telling me HE’s going to bed, why don’t I go too? (God, he’s just like my dad was!)

So – everyone sleep well. Bless you all.

 
 

The big story in the local rag yesterday morning was about this soldier from Conyers or Covington or something like that who was accused of murdering some man in Iraq. Him and a couple other soldiers were all accused of killing some poor bastard and apparently no one was sure if he was supposed to be killed or not. I forget the details and it’s late and I’m stoned and far too lazy to look it up. Anyhow, the local boy was charged with assault and not murder, and all I could think was how funny it was. The guy was this close to being condemn possibly to death by a government that sent him over to kill Iraqis in the first place, but he had to go and kill an Iraqi improperly.

I mean, really. Is that not just fucking stupid or am I asking too much from what I’m told is the greatest country on the planet? Doesn’t matter if they do it for cold, hard cash or something friggin’ silly like patriotism, we still have people who get paid to kill the fucking shit out of other people, most of whom just happened to have the audacity to be living their lives like they always had, and y’all, that tells me we have seriously fucked up somewhere down the line.

Almost ten-thousand years of recorded civilization and we still have soldiers. I could almost deal with it if we actually took care of our soldiers once we don’t need them, particularly, to kill folks anymore, but we can’t even do that properly. I sometimes wonder about the disconnect I’ve always noticed about that amongst the vets I’ve known well enough to judge such things – such as my old man, for instance – but I’m worried I’m just being too cynical, so I don’t know where to go with that. Still. Guy’s supposed to kill the other guy, that’s his job, just as long as he does it according to the rules. That’s friggin’ goofy and I really don’t think I’m wrong about that.

 
 

What’d rhinos ever do to you?
They are contagious.

I love the smell of Drano on the evening air. Smells like… victory.

 
 

That the wingnuts can’t comprehend PTSD or a vet being bothered by killing or the atrocities he or she has witnessed speaks volumes doesn’t it? Can you imagine being the offspring of such people and coming home from that war or any war?

That shrieking heartless harpy Dr. Laura is always telling wives, girlfriends, and mothers of vets not to try and talk their men out of going over, not to get teary-eyed, or scared for them. She calls soldiers warriors as if they’re robots in some video game. Why isn’t she over there? She’d be perfect for the job since she lacks any capacity for remorse.

 
 

Get a snake, Smut Clyde. That’s the only thing that really works.

 
 

Bears and pumas??? Maybe if it was Cougars and Pumas…

 
 

Dependable Renegade rocks Bush’s trip to Africa. That man hasn’t made a single dignified public appearance.

 
 

Get a snake, Smut Clyde. That’s the only thing that really works.

Hi. My pet snake just died after 3 hours of being stuffed head-first down the toilet to unblock the drain.
[Gratuitous reference to trebuchets]
[Implausible claim about consumption of akvavit | Shuggoth Old Peculiar | dried leeches]
[Several garbled metaphors | figures of speech]
That pet snake needed live mice, but I had no live mice to give her, because Mehitabel the Abyssinian kills them all.

Now I’m tempted to translate myself into Backus-Naur Form.

 
Qetesh the Qaveat Qat
 

Now I’m tempted to translate myself into Backus-Naur Form.

Eeeeeeeek! I thought I’d left all that behind me! Thanks, Smut. Thanks a bunch.

Bloody Kiwis (growls).

 
 

Which brings us to the question: do we really want those who speak for teh left (or what passes for it in the media) to be shrieking eels?

I say we give Those Who Speak for Teh Left tasers. Then the fReichtards will be the shrieking eels. And they won’t be able to press charges complain, because they have told us repeatedly that tasers are just “control devices”, nothing more than a little sting, unless you’re a sissypants librul. We can call press conferences as announce that the sissypants fReichtards are trying to confiscate our “personal protection”, and that we shall be contacting the NRA posthaste.

O’Reilly and Hannity won’t know whether to shit themselves or go blind. Glenn Beck *will* shit himself, live and on camera. Ann Coulter may try to sue us for schtick infringement, unless of course repeated taserings have already sent the bony Coulter-carcasse into permanent asystole. It will be good clean fun for all!

 
 

I say we give Those Who Speak for Teh Left tasers. Then the fReichtards will be the shrieking eels. And they won’t be able to press charges complain, because they have told us repeatedly that tasers are just “control devices”, nothing more than a little sting, unless you’re a sissypants librul. We can call press conferences as announce that the sissypants fReichtards are trying to confiscate our “personal protection”, and that we shall be contacting the NRA posthaste.

Here is one of the taser products listed by NRA’s Member Discount list, which helpfully can be selected by your state:

http://www.protectyourhomeandfamily.com/

Or teh lefties could start their own NTA, and see how electric weapons should hold more of the national conscience than traditional chemically fired pellet weapons.

Oooo — and we can launch an eco-taser product line made from recyclable products and able to be solar charged and hand-cranked!

 
 

… so she sits in her house and does nothing other than crossword puzzles, sudoku, and reading books.

Actual, serious suggestion, G: There are beaucoup free and cheap internet puzzle sites, featuring crosswords and sudoku. Some of these sites have chat functions. There’s almost certainly Yahoo boards for puzzlers, because there’s Yahoo boards for every damn timewasting hobby that’s ever been a part of human history, including that jackal-and-hounds game played by ancient Egyptians and medieval Vikings. When I am not swapping profane exhortations to violence with fine people like the Sadlynauts, I am enjoying virtual tea parties with nice ladies like your mamma who share my specific interests in America’s Most Popular Collectible. There are times where it has been a soul-saver for me to go where I can admire pics of Londa’s newest grandbaby and cheer Jannelle’s final chemotherapy session, in between reviews of the latest Borgcorp offerings and the new line from Twee Industries…

Does your mom have internet access? Believe me, the kind of sites I’m talking about don’t require advanced HTML skills (although you’d be surprised how fast ‘unlettered’ granny ladies can move themselves up the skillz curve when it comes to sharing Cuteness photos or selling on eBay). Find a nice accessible chat site for her, where she can correct the n00bs who are doing suduko WRONG, or messing up the crosswords dictionary, because we all know from bitter experience there is nothing so addictive as correcting people on the intertoobz.

 
 

because we all know from bitter experience there is nothing so addictive as correcting people on the intertoobz.

Don’t be surprised if a cadre of board-game geeks turn up here in the course of the night to complain that Tafl was nothing like jackal-and-hounds.

 
 

Yesterday my gorilla Chitters was killed. Just this side of Rome is a place called Rainbow Bridge. When a gorilla dies that has been flatteringly close to someone here, that gorilla goes to Rainbow Bridge.

 
 

Yesterday my pronghorn Vampira was killed. My question is to Odin… Why did it have to be my Vampira?

 
 

There is something about dying pets… cracks me up every time.

 
 

Actual, serious suggestion, G: There are beaucoup free and cheap internet puzzle sites, featuring crosswords and sudoku. Some of these sites have chat functions. ……Does your mom have internet access?

Anne Laurie – Mom does have internet access but she refuses to participate in certain active ways due to an overly advanced paranoia about identity theft. So – she visits some sites but she doesn’t post. she also has a deep disdain for all things Teh Cute.

Believe me, for 6 years we’ve (my siblings and I) tried to get her to connect to human beings more. She steadfastly resists every attempt.

Oy. I have a headache this morning, and my Ipod playlist has an unholy amount of newly-downloaded Broadway show tunes. Gah!

 
 

Oy. I have a headache this morning, and my Ipod playlist has an unholy amount of newly-downloaded Broadway show tunes. Gah!

There’s nothing quite like Ethel Merman offering someone a rubdown with a velvet glove.

 
 

Gentlewoman said,

February 22, 2008 at 6:44

Which brings us to the question: do we really want those who speak for teh left (or what passes for it in the media) to be shrieking eels? That’s a serious question, BTW — I’m honestly conflicted about the answer.

The simple answer: Actors. From theater, not movies. People who have trained voices and are trained TO BE HEARD (without shouting) no matter what the fuck else is happening on or off stage. And believe me, there’s always shit happening on and off stage, usually in the middle of your soliloquy.

A Bill O’Reilly could try to shout over me, but he probably wouldn’t be able to drown me out. And, like most female theater actors, I can be heard without using my high register so I couldn’t be accused of ’shrieking.’ Also, and this is the beauty part, most well-trained theater actors DON’T EVEN NEED A MICROPHONE, so if Billo cut someone off they would STILL BE HEARD.

Or, you know, politicians could FUCKING LEARN HOW TO COMMUNICATE, since it is part of their jobs.

But that’s crazy talk. So go with the actors. We need the work and most of us are leftist anyway, so what the fuck.
_____________________________________________________
That was great, Gentlewoman. I agree with you, and I think it’s no accident that one of the best liberal proponents I know of is Olbermann. He’s not an actor, but he’s very close.

 
 

Imagine that you had been told in 2003 that when George W. Bush finished his second term

Imagining … imagining … imagining … ok:

“Dude! Your jus’ messin’ with me bro’ … you mean that in 2004 we elected George ‘Wanker’ Bush for a second term? Please tell me you’re kidding! Please!?!?”

 
 

Anne Laurie said,

February 22, 2008 at 12:04

Best laugh I’ve had all day. And I agree, Beck WOULD soil himself. High strung, xenophobic fearmonger that he is.

 
 

Not that Mikey needs defense from a DFH like me–but the contractors in Iraq are no less official than the regular troops; they are paid by and work for our f’in worthless gov’t. They are there because 1) it’s another way for Bushco to move money from us to his buddies; 2) they can’t enlist enough troops for the job. Since us alleged liberal acknowledge, if not appreciate, that people can have different views, some of both the regulars and the contractors may well believe in the operation. Don’t blame the kids for the WPE’s bullshit.

 
 

I’m sorry for the tone. I didn’t mean to be an asshole.

(Hmm. Jeez, mikey, if you find yourself saying that more than once a month maybe it means you ARE an asshole.)

And for that matter, I’ve send bad things about Mercs in the past myself, and the few I’ve actually met I disliked and mistrusted.

My point, other than simple contrariness, I guess, was really pretty much what dAVE said a lot better than me. Once you carry “the stain”, it’s hard to get “dirtier”. So if you’re up for it and it’s an option, you can bring a lot of money to your family coffers in a relatively short time, albeit with significantly elevated risks.

So really, it’s hard to blame a guy if he chooses, instead of re-enlisting with the certainty of another tour, to muster out and make a whole bunch of money on that same tour.

Offer not available to Bears or Pumas…

mikey

 
 

Mikey, you can be as cranky as you like as far as I’m concerned. Or as apologetic as you like. Either are impressive.

 
 

Grammar skillz not happenin.

 
 

If you had told me in 2003 that Bush would have HAD a second term, I would have vomited.

 
 

mikey smells like shit said,

February 22, 2008 at 4:48

The fact is, the troop surge is working. No American soldiers have been killed in combat in months.

mikey smells like shit said,

February 22, 2008 at 5:01

Regardless of whether five soldiers died in Iraq yesterday or not, far fewer are dying since the brilliant troop surge began.

It took thirteen minutes for the Prozac to kick in…

 
 

remember We’re Sorry!?

Can’t think of another president who inspired such a collection of sorry Americans.

 
 

It takes days for Prozac to kick in. I’m guessing a speedball of equal parts protein drink mix, HGH, and Doritos(TM) Taco flavored chip dust.

 
 

G–

If you somehow read this: SM and Brazil 66 is what got me started in Brazilian music. I went from them to the American releases of Jobim, to the real thing–samba, bossa, MPB, etc.. I used to do a radio show in PA every other week.

Now I can’t abide their American hits, but their arrangements of real Braz stuff (Mais Que Nada, Chove Chuva, Roda, etc.) still click.

If you want to follow that groove let me know. It will be a revelation.

I’m in Studio City, so include me in in any West Coast Sadly festa.

 
 

Higgledy piggledy
Brown bears and pumas
Are slavering daily
For fresh human meat
Meanwhile the president
Looks to Petraeus
To work out new ways
To delay the defeat.

 
Smiling Mortician
 

I love a double dactyl in the morning, Bubba. Thanks.

Lesley, don’t know how I missed the “We’re Sorry” thing when it happened, but it’s great. I especially like how the map looks like a wolf eating its own thumb, if viewed from precisely the right angle.

 
White Male, Jew of Liberal Fascism
 

To work out new ways
To delay the defeat.

There is no such thing as ‘victory’ or ‘defeat’.

If the Iraqis do fight back, the occupation should continue.

If the Iraqis don’t fight back, the occupation should continue.

Bu$hCo don’t give a shit how many brown people live or die., and they don’t give a fuck about how many US soldiers live or die.

Bu$hCo thinks the occupation is a good thing as long as its corporate buddies are over there sucking up our tax dollars; that way we can’t waste them on education and health care.

 
 

There is no such thing as ‘victory’ or ‘defeat’.

You’ll hear something about defeat if a Democrat’s in office.

 
 

D. Sidhe said,

February 22, 2008 at 5:37

I demand the other bear and puma picture. You know the one I mean.

Do you mean the one here? (Found while looking for an amusing picture to accompany the suggestion of sending Bears in Pumas)

 
 

Imagine that you had been told in 2003 that when George W. Bush finished his second term, dozens of American soldiers and hundreds of Iraqis would be dying violently every month

I think my response would have been:

Second term? WTF? Are you shitting me? Second term?

 
 

[…] Bring Out the Gimp! Posted by grandmofftexan under Uncategorized   Via Froomkin & Sadly, No! […]

 
 

I do indeed, Jim. Thank you very much. It just makes me giggle.

I had a long, thoughtful post earlier on the subject of justifiable deaths, but my browser ate it as it sometimes does when I hold down the shift key a second too long after coming here from gmail. I have no explanation for this. But since it’s disappeared into the ether, we’ll pretend it was coherent and witty and brilliantly reasoned as well, okay?

 
 

“Which brings us to the question: do we really want those who speak for teh left (or what passes for it in the media) to be shrieking eels? That’s a serious question, BTW — I’m honestly conflicted about the answer.”

I would choose lesbians just for the psychological advantage.

 
 

Mom does have internet access but she refuses to participate in certain active ways due to an overly advanced paranoia about identity theft. So – she visits some sites but she doesn’t post. she also has a deep disdain for all things Teh Cute.

Sorry, G — I figured probably you’d already thought of this, but sometimes it’s the “obvious” stuff that gets overlooked. Maybe someday you can help your mom set up a Secrit Online Identity on an encoding server so she can educate misguided puzzlers about the illegitimacy of Teh Cute, because cliche as it is there’s nothing as viscerally enticing even to an Eeyore as the chance to correct someone else’s mistakes. Heck, maybe you should google her high-school classmates and let her know what you find…

 
 

P.S. Also, G, if you Left Coasters actually have a cool Sadlynaut Beach Party, maybe it’ll convince Brad to get off his duff and set up that Sadlypalozza…

 
 

Hell, Anne, if DA’s hosting with me, mortician and mencken getting drunk and breaking stuff, g keeping the peace and robert green and bouffant turning it into a screenplay, Brad will HAVE to come out for it…

mikey

 
 

Smiling Mortician said,

Which brings us to the question: do we really want those who speak for teh left (or what passes for it in the media) to be shrieking eels? That’s a serious question, BTW — I’m honestly conflicted about the answer.

I haven’t read the rest of the thread but I wanted to put my two cents in. I see only a couple of alternatives. One is the Johnathan Turly approach. You’ve probably see him on Keith Olberman’s show but I had a chance to see him talking with Bill O’Reilly and I was amazed at how he seemed able to disarm O’Reilly without shouting or abusive language. I’m not really even sure how he did it. Turley vs O’Reilly

The other way isn’t to out shout them down so much as you stop everything and demand to be heard. You would have to raise your voice repeatedly and interrupt or otherwise bring the show to a stop until you could have your say. I’m not sure this would work because what the producers want is a fight. They don’t want reasoned debate, they want a train wreck because that is what gets ratings.

Eventually TV will become more like talk radio than it already is. If you want to fix that then I suppose you need to bring back the fairness doctrine. Good luck with that.

Now that I think of it there’s a third alternative. You make TV shout fests and TV itself irrelevant. You move everything to the internet. One of my fantasies right now is that an enlightened tech savvy Dem administration (and congress) you could be doing a lot more through the internet. The usual story is that even though the press and politicians hate each other they also need each other. Well, with the internet as distribution channel you don’t really need the press quite so much any more.

In my administration I would tell everyone “you don’t talk to the traditional media any more (unless we have to)” I’d have the presidential blog, the presidential pod cast, the presidential forums, the presidential wiki. I would be streaming audio and video almost everyday. I would talk to ordinary people, why do I need to talk to pundits? Why do I need to talk to CNN or Fox when I can grab a cheap camera, go out anywhere, talk to anyone I please and put it out for everyone to see? The internet is a content distribution pipeline par excellence. Let CNN and ABC and MSNBC get their stories from my YouTube page. Let them wither and die.

 
Teh Shrieking Eels
 

We always grow louder when we’re about to feed on human flesh!

 
Your Grandfather or maybe Columbo
 

She doesn’t get eaten by the eels at this time. I mention that because you looked worried.

 
Teh Shrieking Eels
 

Damn. Thwarted again.
How about Bill O’Reilly? We cn eetz O’rly?

 
 

Hell, Anne, if DA’s hosting with me, mortician and mencken getting drunk and breaking stuff, g keeping the peace and robert green and bouffant turning it into a screenplay, Brad will HAVE to come out for it…

Whoa. I am IMPRESSED. And envious. And I’ll chip in for the video, assuming somebody stays sober enough to point the camera…

 
Smiling Mortician
 

assuming somebody stays sober enough to point the camera…

Don’t look at me.

 
 

Well, I was going to sulk that I didn’t want to attend your beach party anyway, but if there’s going to be videotaping I probably really don’t. No, wait, I don’t drink anymore, so I could hold the camera and–this is the important part–stay behind it all night.

 
 

Sidhe?

Are you west o’teh rockies?

Didn’t know. You shall from now on be included in california dreamin…

mikey

 
 

I hope in the future you’ll refrain from your ‘war horror’ stories? You see, “War is Hell, unless I can make a buck or two” really makes those all ring hollow…

I hope that mikey will not feel obliged to censor his history in order to avoid disturbing the mores of my bourgeoise sensibilities.

And as an incorrigible middle child I’m appalled that my first comment to owlbear1 is negative. So I hope I can make some ammends by offering a shorter Mo:

I take it you’re not a fan of Conrad, then?

 
 

Yup, I’m in Seattle. Dang, I thought we’d already decided that should the apocalypse go down in a way that involved zombies, you’d come get me for mikey’s militia. Otherwise, I’m pretty useless, but by God, if there are zombies, I’m your woman.

 
 

Some good passages, but unfortunately, he also throws in some of the usual Beltway bullisht about the surge.

 
 

Goddam it, I didn’t invent the system. Why shouldn’t I, or any other kid with skills go ahead and cash in?

I know someone who did and he came home early and the reason specifically given was “There is no form of combat training out there that can save you from an IED”. He said everyone competant and experienced came away with the same opinion and the ones that stayed were crazies and shooters. I think you are nuts but if you want the gig, send out some resumes. I don’t think a few felonies are going to matter at this point, it might be a plus.

 
 

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