In Which Brad Replies to Various Comments
Warning: circle-jerkery ahead. I shall place it below the fold.
karen schell said,
July 10, 2006 at 22:07
You still don’t get it, do you?
Your (and others’) total & complete inability to _unequivably_ denounce Frisch and her shameful attacks is almost as despicable as her attacks.
Again, here is what I wrote:
What Frisch did was vile. We condemn her for it. All of us.
And then I wrote some stuff about Jeff being an asshole. The reason is because Jeff is an asshole. And just as no discussion of Frisch is complete without mentioning that she is an unhinged lunatic who should be condemned for making such evil comments about someone’s children, no conversation about Jeff is complete without discussing his assholishness. (For more on this subject, see the thorough documentation written by my colleague, the esteemed Perfesser Retardeau.)
Your promotion of her as both Saint and Poor Innocent Victim is beyond the grasp of any intelligent, reasonable person, whatever their political leaning may be.
Find where any of us did that, por favor. Frisch’s words and actions disgusted me. But what I object to primarily is people like Michelle Malkin who say that “THE LEFT!!!” dislikes Jeff because “his bold eloquence, sharp wit, and willingness to engage the other side have gotten under their skin.” Well, no. We dislike Jeff because he’s an unseemly, bullying pervert.
That said, no one deserves to have such horrible comments made about their children. Just like no one deserves to have this said about a family member:
Incidentally, Tim? I touched your sister in her secret places. Lots.
Posted by: Jeff G at November 17, 2005 10:42 PM
Is this too difficult to understand?
Next:
I’m simply saying it would have been classier to simply condemn Frisch and leave the partisanship for another post. Instead, Gavin’s point about Frisch was to make a partisan point.
Not exactly. Gavin was actually responding to a piece by Confederate Yankee. The title of his piece was, “A Proud Member of the Toddler-Threatening Community.” It went a little something like this (my emphasis):
It was disgusting a year ago when Daily Kos posters were all for attacking the sexual orientation of four-year-old Jack Roberts, the son of then Supreme Court nominee (and now Chief Justice) John Roberts. I thought it was disgusting, abhorrent behavior by deranged individuals, and I thought I’d seen the lowest of the low.
Then came University of Arizona psychology professor instructor Deborah Frisch.
Deb Frisch is living proof of my tagline, that “liberalism is a persistent vegetative state.”
No partisanship there!
So clearly, Gavin should have responded to CY’s post by writing not only that Deb Frisch sucks but that she is symbollic of liberalism as a whole.
OK, that’s all the circle-jerking I can take for the time being. I will be back later to post a crappy video and/or a funny Renew America column.
And with this clean new thread, commentators, please have a decent long shower before you write anything. Wash all the aphids off. Because you know, when you drop aphids everywhere, someone has to sweep them out again.
Bob- aren’t you still farming Substance D? Or did you get out of that racket?
The fact is Brad, you and the rest of “the left” are enabling child molestation. Jeff Goldstein was merely pointing out with his estemed eloquence that cannot be matched anywhere in “the left” how he had reached the heart and soul of poor deluded tim’s sister and converted her to the truth. It’s a sad, sad day when “the left” cannot hope to properly denounce one of your own without putting words in St. Goldstein’s mouth.
Next you’ll be suggesting that his obsession with roosters means something else entirely.
Um, I guess I’m late to the party.
So, some adjunct prof. that no one heard of before yesterday posts some dispicable crap and suddenly the SadNoes (and the rest of us, I presume) are supposed to do… what, exactly?
Why are you even giving Goldstein the time of day on this? How are you even remotely associated with whateverthefuck some mouth-breather who represents no one but herself said in a comment to his site? Why play his game?
So, some adjunct prof. that no one heard of before yesterday posts some dispicable crap and suddenly the SadNoes (and the rest of us, I presume) are supposed to do… what, exactly?
Condemn her. Which is what we did.
But peeps like Paterico want us to give Jeff a hug to boot.
But peeps like Paterico want us to give Jeff a hug to boot.
God knows he could probably use one, but I still don’t get how you are in any way accountable here. That you would step forward to condemn the comment is already going the extra mile.
I’m not sure a hug would cover it at this point – I think the ante’s been upped all the way to Spin the Bottle, or Three Minutes in the Closet.
Glad I’m not you guys.
Patterico is laser-beam focused on the single line of Gavin’s post where he says:
Patterico’s point is that there is no evidence the quotes were made up, aside from her own say-so (and she certainly seems unreliable), while Goldstein has presented IP logs and such to document that the quotes in question were legit.
I guess he has a fair point, in a sense, although he’s certainly overlooking the larger issue of the post in order to focus on that one throwaway line. But hey, that’s the Internets.
But you didn’t just condemn her. She has claimed that she didn’t write the stuff about French-kissing Goldstein’s son — which appears to be a lie based on Goldstein’s IP address research. Yet Gavin wrote that the comments “seem to be made up.” Then he admitted on my site that he really had no idea. So he has, in fact, taken her side in this on that issue — and in the face of the evidence.
Also:
“Just like no one deserves to have this said about a family member:”
Well, when one follows the link, one sees it’s in response to this:
“At least Roger has an Oscar nomination and Charles Johnson was a professional musician. But Jeff Goldstein and Security Mom? Who the fuck are those no talent jerks, and why would anybody pay them to write awful boring derivative unfunny suckass posts?”
So Goldstein comes back with a “yo’ momma” type comment. Sure, nobody deserves to have their mother dragged into the argument, and it’s a damn shame when it happens. But the guy was asking for a slap back, and he got one. Hard to cry over that.
It’s a shame you don’t have a food column on the side. Then you could make up and have a guest blogger.
Oh wait. That’s been done.
Patterico- so making a snide remark about someone’s lack of talent justifies “joking” about molesting their sister.
Got. Cha.
Well, also, looking at the whole post, you see this:
Look at this righty outrage!! And this one! Etc. etc. etc.
Oh, but they’re making such a big deal out of this. And sure, it’s pretty bad. But it’s nowhere near as serious as these pictures of wounded and dead children.
That, is portrayed as condemnation. Well, I suppose. But if I had “condemned” Ann Coulter that way, I bet plenty of lefties would claim I had tried to minimize her comments. In fact, when I condemned her, I did so without reservation. It would have been nice to see that here — on a site that has been rude to Goldstein in the past. “Hey, we hate his politics and don’t like a lot of things he’s said, but bringing his kids into it is beyond the pale. That is all.” It’s an opportunity wasted.
“But you didn’t just condemn her.”
-Patterico
“What Frisch did was vile. We condemn her for it. All of us.”
-Brad R.
Give Goldstein his hug, now, Brad. Give Patterico one, too.
“And then I wrote some stuff about Jeff being an asshole. The reason is because Jeff is an asshole.”
Yes. And no matter what anyone else may say or do, he will always be an asshole. The one fact that can never be diminished is that Jeff is a paste-eating asshole. The Frisches come and go, and what remains is the one abiding truth: Jeff is an asshole.
Brad, it’s sad that you and the rest of the moonbats fail to see that if some obscure twit made a vile remark about Jeff’s child, then he has achieved sainthood, and you must worship him. You must also kill the twit to return balance to the universe, or else the crops will fail this summer. That’s how it works.
So was your entire diatribe, patt
that’s what happens when a decent guy stands next to a doucebag.
on a site that has been rude to Goldstein in the past.
The poor dear. It’s not like he’s ever been rude to anyone else.
I’m not sure “rude” was le mote juste. You should have gone with “uncouth.”
“Patterico- so making a snide remark about someone’s lack of talent justifies “jokingâ€? about molesting their sister.”
He didn’t say he molested her. I read it as saying that it was with her consent, actually. It’s like the schoolyard taunts about screwing yo momma. Yeah, it’s juvenile. But I think Jeff would readily admit he’s often juvenile.
In any event, it’s hard to see how it’s relevant to a discussion about someone’s comment talking about someone shooting one’s two-year-old son. The two examples are quite different.
And Patterico- you still haven’t responded to my point that Gavin was responding to an article that tried to paint Frisch as “the face of the left.”
He didn’t say he molested her. I read it as saying that it was with her consent, actually. It’s like the schoolyard taunts about screwing yo momma. Yeah, it’s juvenile. But I think Jeff would readily admit he’s often juvenile.
Look: Jeff had no idea how old this guy’s sister was, if he even had a sister. The guy could have had a sister who was 8 years old ferchrissake. Certain things should be off limits. Saying you touched someone’s sister in her secret places is a vile and gross thing to say. It should be condemned.
This is standard wingnut rhetorical bullshit. First they distort what you have said, then they demand repeated loyalty oaths, or some such bullshit, for breathtakingly obvious points. And it doesn’t matter how many times you repeat the oath, you still get criticized for not repeating it with enough feeling.
Case 1: Supporting the troops. First the wingnuts assert that opposing the war means you don’t support the troops. Then, no matter how many times you say you support the troops, they keep throwing it in your face.
Case 2: Blogging ethics.
Case 3: Dr. Frisch.
This is nothing more than an attempt at intimidation, designed to stifle any meaningful thought or discussoin. What is especially aggravating is that the wingnuts are vastly worse on these points than anything the left can dish out. They have to dig to the most obscure of obscurities to even come close.
While accusing the left of not supporting the troops, the wingnuts support putting the troops through a meat grinder, without proper armor or helmts, without proper medical care when they come home. And yet the wingnuts accuse the left of not support the troops. Assholes.
Wingnut bloggers, including and especially Pasty, wouldn’t know an ethic if it bit them in the ass. But they constantly call out the lefty bloggers’ ethics. Dickheads.
And then there’s Dr. Frisch. She is a nobody who said some things that are more or less equivalent to crap you hear from the right all the time. Everyone on this blog has denounced her. But that’s not good enough. Denouncing her == portraying her as a sainted victim. Hey, shitheads, I’ll type it slowly, so you can understand — we all denounced Frisch.
Now fuck off, cocksuckers.
In place of the pointless group-hug, can we please just have more Tiny Tim videos? It hurts less.
Ya know, if that threat to Goldstein’s kid is serious, why can’t he take some sort of legal action on it? Seriously. If it’s actually a serious, credible threat, surely there’s some sort of legal remedy. Is there nothing the law can do for a hard-working*, law-abiding white man in America anymore?
* I never did get an answer if the goofy bastard has gotten a new job to deal with his housing situation.
Seriously, who gives a shit?! Right this fucking minute I’d wager that there are some neo-Nazis somewhere discussing whether firing squads or gas chambers should be used to exterminate Mexicans. I also guaran-fucking-TEE you they are all, without exception, right-wingers. On the same side of the political spectrum as Jeff Goldstein, albeit perhaps a bit farther out in the fringe. And you know what? I honestly couldn’t care less what a couple of inbred racist fucks are saying in Kudzu, Alabama. They have no voice in the mainstream political discourse (um, well, at least at this point), I don’t see Goldstein et al. posting a condemnation every time a new item appears on the National Socialist website, and I don’t expect him to. So why on earth should we fly into an orgy of tsk-tsking and solidarity with poor Pasty whenever some voiceless dipshit on the Left says something nasty?
Saying you touched someone’s sister in her secret places is a vile and gross thing to say. It should be condemned.
Obviously you’ve missed out on the long history of “molestation as bonding humor” in the wingnut world. It’s sorta like how dudes greet each other with insults, you know.
First wingnut guy: “Hey, man. You’re Chosen Sports Team certainly stunk up the playing field/court last night!”
Second wingnut guy: “Screw you, dude. I touched your sister in her most secret places!”
FWG: “Man, it’s Miller Time.” And then buys him a beer.
Not necessarily the case. I think Goldstein’s IP log only shows who initially made the post. (Most comment tracking programs keep track of the IP of who initially makes the post, not who makes changes to it afterwards). My guess is Goldstein could edit the post all he wants, and the IP address would remain the same.
Disclaimer: I am not saying that Goldstein did or did not edit that post. I am just pointing out that this piece of evidence isn’t as damning as it seems to Patterico.
Y’know, I like this game of Pattricio reading whatever the fuck he likes out of comments. I think I’m gonna start doing it too.
To start with:
He didn’t say he molested her. I read it as saying that it was with her consent, actually. It’s like the schoolyard taunts about screwing yo momma. Yeah, it’s juvenile. But I think Jeff would readily admit he’s often juvenile.
I didn’t read this as Pattricio saying that he thinks it’s just schoolyard taunts. Instead, I read it as a blanket apology for rape of all kinds. All sorts of rape. Date rape, rape tartar, rape a la mode, rape rape rape. Pattricio is objectively in favor of rape, because I read his statement as such. And because he mentioned Goldstein, and Goldstein has yet to denounce my reading of what pattricio might have said, I can only assume the entire right-wing is in favor of rape.
Man, this is fun.
Brad,
“And Patterico- you still haven’t responded to my point that Gavin was responding to an article that tried to paint Frisch as ‘the face of the left.'”
I think that’s a legitimate thing to respond to. She’s the face of the fringe left. Almost by definition. But there is a fringe right, too. Pat Robertson and Ann Coulter are some of its faces.
If he’d left it to that, and a simple condemnation, that would have been fair. But the post as written really mutes the condemnation — especially by taking her side on the comment alteration argument. Just another chance to take a slap at Goldstein. It wasn’t much of a condemnation, really. I think he called her comments “pretty bad.” This wholesale “We condemn it, all of us” language — wasn’t that in comments somewhere? I think the post itself called her comments “pretty bad.”
And for what it’s worth, if you bring in molestation of female, possibly younger siblings into a game of the Dozens (“yo’ momma” jokes for you what ain’t got the culture) with most social groups, you will get your nuts caved in.
OK, Patterico, here’s one more. Let’s see if I can make my point completely sparkling clear.
Imagine if I had said something like this about Michelle Malkin:
But that wasn’t really the point of my bringing up Michelle Malkin’s post. Which was this: Michelle Malkin: hot or not?
Me, I kind of like the ironic / blase sneer and the angst pirate affectation.
Or maybe she’s just sitting on cucumber.
Either way, the fact that she’s a vicious right-wing partisan is just so damn sexy. And even if she turns out to be a total bitch (which, how likely is that), I could just close my eyes and imagine myself getting a dirty sanchez from Margaret Thatcher.
Now: you would probably say I was a disgusting pervert for saying such a thing (and not just the part about Margaret Thatcher- I mean the parts about Malkin “sitting on a cucumber” and giving me a dirty sanchez), especially because my animosity toward Malkin is well-known. The entire passage, as posted above, is a disgusting fantasy intended to demean someone of the opposite sex and make them feel powerless.
Now replace “Malkin” with “Lindsay Beyerstein,” and you’ll see that’s precisely what Goldstein wrote.
Uncle !
I’ll do anything …. recycle cans and bottles, panhandle, —
hell, I’ll get a goddamned job if that’s what it takes,, but,
please, tell me, how much money will it take to finally
hear the end of this nonsense ???
Maybe Gavin should email you his posts first, so you can approve their structure and full content, before he posts.
jesus christ this is what you are reduced to Patterico?
why don’t you spend your time condemning Conferderate Yankee for his post on this issue, which is what Gavin was responding to anyway?
name your price
What you’re missing here is that it’s wrong to minimize the vile nature of the comments themselves, but it’s not wrong to minimize the significance of the comments or their author, in the context of bloggers like Goldstein and Confederate Yankee trying to use the incident to score points against the entire Left.
The point is not just “That’s disgusting.” The point is, “That’s disgusting, but we’ve never heard of this nobody commentor who made the comments, so would you please stop trying to paint this unknown person as the Authentic Face of the Left for the umpteenth time?”
I think you can fit this incident into the larger context without pretending like the comments themselves were anywhere close to acceptable.
There was no condemnation.
There was condemnation, but it was muted. Or possibly mooted.
There was condemnation, but it wasn’t much of a condemnation.
It’s like watching a catepillar transform into a boootiful butterfly.
“And you know what? I honestly couldn’t care less what a couple of inbred racist fucks are saying in Kudzu, Alabama. ”
You should, a bunch of them are probably just back from deployment, and maybe a little maladjusted. It only takes one crazy screwball, enabled by a paste eating reactionary douchebag, for it to go horribly wrong.
either way, Patt would defend the paste eater to the end, and probably accuse you of intellectual dishonesty for not mentioning 9/11, or somesuch.
Patt. You forgot Poland.
just saying
AAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!111!!Eleven
Gee, guys, I’d love to stick around and explain how we condemned deb frisch and have them tell us how we didn’t do it right and then we’re all yeah we did and then they’re all you couldn’t condemn hitler and we’re like oh yeah well so’s yer old man and they go you are objectively pro child molestation and we’re—ahh, never mind.
I gotta go call Deb Frisch and find out what I’m supposed to do tomorrow. Catch ya…
mikey
Patkin,
What did I read out of comments?
I think you guys are reading things *into* comments — such as insisting that “touched her in her secret places” necessarily means unconsensual molestation.
The school yard “I screwed yo’ momma” chants imply the momma is willing.
Calling it molestation is simply the umpteenth example of people on this site twisting what he said to make him look worse.
There was condemnation, but it wasn’t much of a condemnation.
is that some sort of haiku?
And they accuse lefties of moral relativism…
I think you guys are reading things *into* comments — such as insisting that “touched her in her secret places� necessarily means unconsensual molestation.
Patterico- (and this is my last response for a while, since I have work to do) my point is that unless you specifically know that the guy has a sister that is of consentual age, it is not appropriate to make such a disgusting comment.
The school yard “I screwed yo’ momma� chants imply the momma is willing.
Except it’s not “yo’ momma” but rather “your sister.”
I’m just wondering if Patterico would like it if someone suggested that they touched Patterico’s sister in her secret places and he would rule out molestation immediately.
Dude, this sorta hypothetical “well what Jeff really meant was” that rules out any sick/embarrassing connotations is, well, fucking retarded
What did I read out of comments?
I read it as saying that it was with her consent, actually.
That! That fuckbone! You read that out of the comment! YOU FUCKING SAID YOU READ THAT OUT OF THE COMMENT! You read that it’s schoolyard taunts, not a sexual slur, which is what yo momma jokes fucking ARE, FUCKBONE.
And now, what I decided to read out of your reply.
“I, Patterico, think molestation is awesome so long as Jeff Goldstein says it.”
And yet the ironic thing is, my read is closer to the truth.
Brad,
Joking about liberal women in that manner is okay, because they’re all feminazis, therefore they both hate men and are total sluts. Bernstein’s was asking for it by espousing an opinion counter to a Conservative Male. It’s like a good molestation joke – and everyone loves molestation jokes, donchaknow, we used to tell ’em all the time at the ol’ school yard – it’s too be expected as it’s a Right-Wing privalege. Just how it is.
Maybe it’s just me, but the “secret places” language sounds like its calculated to imply an underaged girl — because it echoes childish language.
But what indication is there that Jeff would ever post anything vulgar like that?
Whatever. A woman in an argument with someone she disagrees with makes comments about that person’s son — his age, his gender, where he lives — and makes remarks about violent things happening to the son. Shootings. Kidnap and murder. Sure would suck if that would happen.
And Gavin writes a whole post minimizing it. Not as bad as this! or this! or this!
Pardon me if I don’t find it admirable.
Patterco.
You are arguing simple semantics. That’s um…. droll.
semantics aside
You may be a fine guy, and a cunning linguist, but Jeff is a douchebag, and you are standing next to him acting the Master Debater.
I can’t keep up with you people. Now the thread I just posted on is dead.
Patterico – please see my comments at the end of the other thread.
But there is a fringe right, too. Pat Robertson and Ann Coulter are some of its faces.
Well, fine. But Ann Coulter sure gets a lot of media appearances for being so fringe, right? I don’t remember Matt Lauer saying “Ward Churchill, always fun to have you here.” Maybe you think Rush Limbaugh is a fringe jokester like Coulter, maybe you think he’s a serious purveyor of conservative thought, but one way or the other, the Vice-President of the United States makes regular appearances on his show. That’s pretty mainstream. Then you have guys like Jerry Falwell – completely fringe, no? – who actually get calls from the White House soliciting input on Supreme Court nominations.
What’s the fringe left? Once you get past Michael Moore – who hardly gets a lot of talk show bookings as a mainstream liberal voice – you have a right-wing noise machine straining to create these scary liberals out of whole cloth. Ward Churchill? Come on. And now Deborah Frisch makes Ward Churchill look like O.J. Simpson when it comes to relative fame.
No one knows who any of these people are on the “fringe left.” They’re utterly irrelevant in our political climate. And so we get tired of well-meaning folks like you saying “well, there’s a fringe left and a fringe right,” as if there’s some kind of equivalence. The point is that we live in a country where the fringe right actually gets treated as mainstream in a lot of ways, and that’s fucking scary, and the constant attempts to obscure that fact by bringing up the totally anonymous fringe left couldn’t be any more of a non sequitur.
Maybe it’s just me, but the “secret places� language sounds like its calculated to imply an underaged girl — because it echoes childish language.
That’s what I thought. OK, gotta go work for real this time.
“FUCKBONE.”
Commenter #3 who it’s not worth talking to.
Well, it’s been fun.
And Gavin writes a whole post minimizing it. Not as bad as this! or this! or this!
Well, you’re defending the implied molestation/possible rape of an opponent’s sister as nothing more than a schoolyard taunt*. Pardon me if I’m not blown over by your moral superiority.
Is Frisch politically active at all? Do we even know her party affiliation?
How in the world is she the face of the left, or the fringe left?
She was a complete nobody, and her current notoriety has nothing to do with her politics.
Now: you would probably say I was a disgusting pervert for saying such a thing (and not just the part about Margaret Thatcher- I mean the parts about Malkin “sitting on a cucumber� and giving me a dirty sanchez), especially because my animosity toward Malkin is well-known. The entire passage, as posted above, is a disgusting fantasy intended to demean someone of the opposite sex and make them feel powerless.
Alas, Brad, I fear based on what I’ve seen Patterico posting here so far, that you are simply going to be told that you lack a sense of humor.
After all, it’s funny to threaten people – male or female – with sexual violence, isn’t it?
I tried taking the reasonable role. I’m done. As a general rule, I avoid talking to people who feel that dickslapping “jokes” are somehow funny.
If I were God, I’d make each and every human being on the planet who finds anything even remotely entertaining in JG’s repeated sex-soaked violence fantasies spend the rest of their lives working in homes for emotionally disturbed children, or as guardians ad litem in the courts. Just so they can see firsthand how totally unfuckingfunny it all is.
And then, I’d force them to watch reruns of “Full House” and “Growing Pains” whenever they weren’t at work – but I’d be a really mean God. 😉
Who’s talking? Am I suppose to want an open dialogue with you? Am I coming over to your sites and calling you fuckbone for being one? No. Oh dear Lord in Heaven, how will I live without conversation with Patterico? With his apologies for molesting a commenter’s sister under schoolyard taunts, as if we’re not old enough to have grown out of a fucking schoolyard.
Go get fucked, Patters.
C’mon, guys. Seriously. Patterico doesn’t work for a DA’s office, does he? I mean, a guy who works for a DA’s office, acting as apologist for Dickslap and his commentary?
Not a reassuring thought.
[…] The fun is at three threads, here, here, and here. Go say hi. […]
mdhatter said,
Patterico,
You are arguing simple semantics. That’s um…. droll.
You may be a fine guy, and a cunning linguist, but Jeff is a douchebag, and you are standing next to him acting the Master Debater.
A fine guy? Patterico? Nah, he’s just another right-wing asshole.
[Shudder] Next time the phones are open on Heavenly Idol, I can’t in good conscience vote for you Jillian. I know people who think that joking about molestation is for some reason, funny are deserving of a cruel fate. But haven’t you ever heard of mercy? Ten minutes of Kimmy Gibbler causes permenant insanity. A lifetime? Who knows what mosters you would create.
Gray gooooooooo. It’s everywhere.
Roxanne- your obsession with my obsession with The Grey Goo is disturbing. Don’t tell me you’re under its power too!
“Someone has said something nasty and untrue about me on another site, so naturally I am republishing it by linking to it. Fly, my poo-flinging pretties, fly!”
yeah, Patterico, it sure does suck when someone minimizes the vile things that someone else says, doesn’t it?
oh, and when you refer to us as a “snake pit,” it really does make your holier-than-thou, I-am-so-concerned-with-an-honest-debate comments here that much more laughable. and they were pretty laughable laready, so nice work.
I actually prefer the wingnut trolls, because at least they are honest with their crazy bullshit dishonesty.
In sum, you sir embarassed yourself today.
Oh, hell. He’s unleashing his minions. Considering he’s an apologist for someone as indefensible as Goldstein, I am not at all confident of the level of debating skills we’re about to see representing the Wingnut World. Be like arguing with one of those later Hapsburg kings, the ones who forhead sloped down over their noses.
Sorry, His Grace.
I could be a very merciful deity for just about everything except this.
You know, I just thought of another way to demonstrate how totally out of line JG’s sister-touching comment is.
If it really is the sort of thing that just about anybody could interpret as a joke, then JG ought to be able to walk into any bar in America and casually drop that line on some guy at the bar. Right? I mean, it’s funny – they’d laugh about it, and the guy would totally buy JG a beer or something.
(As an aside, and because I really *don’t* like violence – sexual or otherwise – I really wouldn’t encourage anyone to try this particular experiment. I predict it would lead to a massive ass-beating.)
I just caught John Dean on Countdown tonight. His new book, Conservatives Without Conscience comes out in a couple days. In it he cites a massive study, involving hundreds of thousands of people that has been going on for like 50 years, of the “authoritarian personality”.
Basically, the scientific research shows that massively, overwhelmingly, authoritarian cultists are conservatives. He estimated that about 25% of America consists of conservative “authoritarian followers”. On the left, he estimates no more than about 1% (those of the very far left) are authoritarian.
The book comes out tomorrow. I’m looking forward to it. This is going to be fun. 🙂
Here’s the moral of this deceased horse: Next time the ever-dwindling and ever-more desperate wingnut mob fixate on some silly bullshit like this, for God’s sake just ignore them. That will really piss them off.
Whatever. A woman in an argument with someone she disagrees with makes comments about that person’s son — his age, his gender, where he lives — and makes remarks about violent things happening to the son. Shootings. Kidnap and murder. Sure would suck if that would happen.
And Gavin writes a whole post minimizing it. Not as bad as this! or this! or this!
You missed a step, namely “Confederate Yankee writes a post claiming that the incident with this woman proves that ‘The Entire Left’ is objectively ‘pro toddler killing’ because they haven’t stepped up and ‘unequivocally condemned’ this woman’s comments en masse.”
See, with that critical step inserted, the point of Gavin’s post becomes “CY’s post was unfair and hypocritical: unfair because because no one’s ever heard of this woman, she has no influence on or claim to speak for ‘The Left’, and no one had any way of even knowing what she said before CY started complaining about it. Hypocritical because what she said really does pale in comparison to the eliminationist rhetoric and open calls for the extermination of Muslims, journalists, and liberals from mainstream, popular commenters on the right, and no one on the right is expected to condemn these people.”
Meanwhile, Patterico comes over and condemns Gavin for not condeming Frisch unequivocally enough, which proves he supports her comments and is objectively pro-toddler murder. And if the commenters don’t immediately condemn Gavin for not condemning Frisch enough, Patterico will declare us “not worth talking to” and take his tiny balls and go home.
Which kind of proves Gavin’s original point: Unfair. Hypocritical.
And don’t forget “assholish”.
The next day’s protein wisdom post would be something on the order of “Leftist Thugs ruin my night out”
“I went out to a local drinking establishment and told a very humorous joke. Those poor idiots on the left couldn’t get it and rather than discussing things in a civilized manner they engaged in fisticuffs. I then tried to sooth their wounds by telling my favourite rooster related joke, but alas, they refused to engage in any real debate.” JG
Then Confederate Yankee, Patterico and the rest of them would write scathing denunications on how the liberal blogosphere has infultrated Jeff’s favourite watering holes and we need to apologise to him and our lack of not showing up to protect him from our own thugs is a sign of our own collective guilt.
Patterico’s Pontifications » Patterico Descends Into the Snake Pit Again said,
Patterico’s Pontifications? Doesn’t that have a bit of a “Devastatin’ Dave” ring to it?
Well, my name is Patterico and I’m here to say…
The right blogosphere is right to demand that you and others condemn that woman without resorting to pointing out things their bloggers have said. ‘Cause, I mean, they do that all the time, right? Devote a days’ posts to condemning one of their own, without mentioning how evil the left is by comparison.
I’m sure they can come up with a number of examples of this.
Though, suffice to say we’d settle for one.
I was a bit amused to have this whole thing hung around my neck before I knew what was going on. It’s my fault somehow though I didn’t know what the hell was going on.
Brad, regarding the gray/grey goo:
It’s better than being obsessed with your obsession with K. Grogan.
What Porgy said. As “fun” as this has been, the best way to defuse this bullshit is to ignore it. If anyone had outright condemned Frisch, it would have been an implicit agreement with the “Frisch as the Face of the Left” folderol (Generally, you condemn people you work with or for – not random nobodies who happen to share your beliefs).
Next time this happens, ignore it. The right blogosphere will go through their whole tantrum/fainting routine but will end up burning out because no one’s there to watch.
Is this the line to register for the Summer Getaway package?
There’s this guy that lives at Funfzehnhundredneunundachtzig Karlmarxstrasse in Flat 2B in a small village about fifty kilometers south of Berlin who ties firecrackers to the tails of cats and puts flaming bags of poo on his neighbor’s porches. He’s also voted Green three times out of the last six regional elections, making him a certified Lefty.
I just want to go on record saying that I condemn his behavior. Alois Heinrich Schellburger, shame on you! I distance myself from your horrid behavior.
Me thinks this has been a diversionary tactic devised by The Editors. While Sadly, No! has been engaged in this debate, the Poor Man Institude has crafted a celebratory history of its own victory in the Great Annoying Video War and unilaterally declared the peace.
NO! We can’t ignore them! If some angry (and maybe slightly demented) “liberal” says something really horrible about children or the president or the troops or the president’s children or the troops’ children or the children’s president or the president’s children’s troops or the First Lady’s special Independence Day recipe for apple pie (that she made for some children or for the troops) and we don’t respond immediately – ALL OF US! – and condemn these comments, then it means that we support them one-hundred percent and that we want the terrorists to win!
And saying things like that – and not condemning them! – is so much worse than supporting a war that has killed and maimed thousands of REAL CHILDREN!
WON’T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN! (Even the ones born in Iraq, and Afghanistan, Vietnam, Nicaragua, El Salvador, Panama, Guatemala, and all the other regions blighted by our proxy wars.)
(Oh, I forgot, all the children killed in those wars were worse off under the bad people we were fighting – even though they were still alive before US involvement!)
Patterico says: It’s hard to see how it’s relevant to a discussion about someone’s comment talking about someone shooting one’s two-year-old son.
A constant theme in Patterico’s carping has been, “But we’re talking about a child!” She’s part of a phenomenon I noted at my own blog: as far as I can tell, in her writing, she has remained absolutely silent about the following high-profile conservatives:
— Brian Doyle, fourth highest ranking official the United States Department of Homeland Security’s public affairs office [arrested for pedophilia]
— Political consultant Carey Lee Cramer, the Republican consultant who created ads for Republicans in Texas [convicted of aggravated sexual assault of a child, two counts of indecency with a child by contact and one count of indecency with a child by exposure]
— The infamous former Mayor of Spokane Jim West [who lured underage boys to his city office]
or, for that matter, any of the former Republican office-holders, party officials, and activists listed at this site
Well, as the far-right Confederate Yankee so ironically put it: “Welcome to the new face of the most deranged members of our political opposition, the toddler-threatening community.”
Patterico insists that we liberals have an obligation to denounce–immediately–anybody who represents the left and who makes threatening noises about children. Yet she herself has had weeks and months to denounce the representatives on the right who have actually assaulted and raped children, but you’ll find
{crickets chirping} silence.
So, Patterico, please do as you preach: denounce, individually, each and every one of those Republican and conservative child molesters listed above and on that site–all of them a matter of infamy and public record. Actual pedophiles, mind you–not crazy women making empty threats.
And, per your rules, when you offer each of these condemnations, do it without mentioning liberals or Sadly, No!, or any of the Democrats or, least of all, a crazy idiot like Deb Frisch.
Maybe when you’re done with this little exercise, you’ll understand how ludicrous you’re being.
walk into any bar in America and casually drop that line on some guy at the bar. Right? I mean, it’s funny – they’d laugh about it, and the guy would totally buy JG a beer or something.
OK, here’s the problem. It’s the goddam allstar break. There’s no baseball on. Hey, I love Rachel Rae as much as the next guy, but the TVs for watchin baseball, and there ain’t none. So I’m hittin the scotch, havin a toke and readin the blogs. Drunk and melancholy, mostly Brad and Gavin’s fault, and so I got to thinkin about Jillian’s post. And yeah, it’s gonna go off topic. ‘Cause the topic is played out dryer than an old woman’s corn on the cob (betcha didn’t think I was gonna go there, didja?).
So about 27 or so years ago, when I was pretty sure I wanted to die, but just didn’t know how to go about getting there and didn’t even have the skills to have the internal conversation to figure it out, I used to go into bars and do shit like that. I’d climb up on the hood of a camaro or corvette and piss on the windshield. Kind of a physical manifestation of goldstein’s fantasies. And yeah, you know what? When you’ve got six or eight local good old boys in some small town in new mexico beating you senseless, it’s weird, but you do have a kind of clarity. It’s when you realize that where you fucked up is you ENGAGED. The violence was cathartic, but ultimately senseless, much like this whole imaginary issue. When they hit you, it doesn’t hurt (at the time) and when you land one, and break a nose or bust a tooth, gawdam but it feels good.
Is there a point? Not really. I wanted to write something here that wasn’t a silly backnforth with mindless drones. I was thinking about those days from jillian’s post, and then I was thinking how glad I was I found…well, the shit I needed to begin to get it. And I wanted to leave you with an obscure musical reference that’s kind of where I am tonight:
“C’mon Jack, the sonofabitch is coming…”
Hope a few of you recognize it….
mikey
C’mon, HG, you should know that people on the meds that Jeff is on aren’t allowed to drink. On the other hand, that might explain the erratic behavior that Pasty displays with every other post or comment. Ol’ Rooster Cockburn is probably just having a bad reaction.
I just googled Deborah Frisch and WOW! A very disturbed woman, completely lacking in civility and honesty and integrity and taste.
I think she is the Ann Coulter of the Left. And we, to our credit, have not given her or any of her kind a platform or any encouragement.
(She should change sides. She would make a fortune.)
All of the above is, of course, of the most vital importance to
Mr Goldstein and Miss Frisch … but would someone/
anyone please explain to me how it can possibly
matter to you?
Maybe we should just lock Jeff and Deborah in a room together until they eat or slap each other to death. The are both pretty yickee, the deserve each other and we need to get on with our lives.
Like bad videos from the 80’s! Now that is something the world needs more of!
oh crap, “slap each other” ?? now, I’m stuck with that image of Goldstein
cock-slapping the good Doctor …
in his Napoleon-drag, of course
Xavier (and others, you know who you are)…
You know, If Jeff is obsessed about his cock, well – that’s one thing…
But you S,N! folks obsessing about his obsession about his cock?
That’s just gay (and not the good kind of gay either).
And just think – all this argumentation could have been avoided if S,N! had begun and ended a post with “Deb Frisch is a reprehensible toddler rape/murder fantasist idiot” and given a link.
And then you could have devoted the next post (all 500 words of it) to how Ann Coulter calling the 4 leftist political activists who shield themselves from criticism behind their husband’s deaths as “witches” is going to be the end of Western Civ and how Rethuglikkkans are all evil, etc.
No one but your fellow travellers would have believed you, but at least you could have avoided touching this particular tar-baby
(no racial imagery implied in that last statement, or maybe there was, I am a conservative, after all…)
mikey,
“Desperados Waiting For A Train”, written by the great Guy Clark. The version by The Highwaymen (Willie, Waylon, Kristofferson and Cash) from their ’84 album was my pappaw’s last favorite song before Alzheimer’s took ’em. He’d sing that opening line – “I played the ‘Red River Valley’/And he’d sit out in the kitchen and cry” – in his deep, rumbling, resonating voice over and over, just because he liked the way it rolled around the room. To this day, that tune will catch me unawares – not as into the Texas troubadour thing as much as I used to be – and I’m not ashamed to admit I will flat-out bawl, son.
I spent a lot of time working various sides of the music biddness and got to meet a whole lot of real famous people, and once you’ve smoked a number with Willie Nelson, there ain’t much to the rest of ’em. But I met Guy Clark once and I will say the experience shook me a bit. Big man, big prescence. I told him about that song and Pappaw, and I thought his flace would split from grinnin’.
well, since you admit to being a conservative, i will be …
compassionate. pointing out the absurdities of absurd
creatures like Mr Goldstein and Mr Frisch is all just
good fun
by the way, you and YOUR “fellow travellers” could very well be the end of Western
Civilization, if you were in any way competent…. fortunately for the sane majority
you are
not
“She’s the face of the fringe left. ”
Oh bullshit. Nobody ever heard of her until this weekend.
Yo, Matt T. Thanks man, Guy Clark needs a little recog. I sat at his table at Willie’s 1976 “Return to Panther Hall” in Fort Worth after they had closed it for YEARS to Willie. Dood, they sold longnex by the fucking CASE but nobdy thought to bring in an opener!! Charly Cole opened 48 bottles of beer that nite with his fucking TEETH!! What a moment in time…
mikey
I’m on record here many times as disapproving the argument that you need to condemn everything out there. I say only that *if* you’re going to discuss Frisch’s actions here, you should condemn them.
Yet several people here act as though I made that argument.
You really just don’t seem to give a shit about responding to what people actually say.
disapproving?
or: disproving?
or a combination of the two?
so, if one non-entity condemns another , then,
all’s right with world?
come on, it’s not like any of us … including Miss Frisch and Mr Goldstein …
matter in this non-matter
Mr./Ms.? Xavier,
Fantasizing about child molestation is not absurd – it is dangerous. Underage children should never be used as debating points in any argument; I hope you will agree and we can leave it at that.
I’ll assume your last word in your last post was “aren’t.” and there wasn’t a longer piece inadvertently missing or cut off by the HTML Faery – just to keep the volley going.
“…sane majority…”
You have to win an election before you can even start making noises about “majority”.
And you have to present positions that make sense before you can even start making noises about “sane”.
The President (with some big help from the U.S.’s allies) seems to be doing a pretty good job of bottling up Norko and the Mullahs, so WC appears to be in good hands at the moment.
Didn’t really want to open this up to a catholic debate about U.S. domestic and foreign policy; the Ann Coulter bit was just a “ferinstance”.
[…] The fun is at three threads, here, here, and here. Go say hi. […]
Patterico calling in reinforcements.
What a tool.
are you suggesting “though-crime?” is that your issue now?
I don’t particularly care what you or anyone else fantasizes about….
as to making crude remarks on-line, what? you think it’s something new?
I’m sorry to have to tell you, I just don’t have the capacity for a good fit
of self-righteous outrage every time someone abuses a keyboard
See, I don’t believe that. I don’t believe for one instant there was a room full of Texans and none of ’em had a bottle opener. I’ve known way too many Texans to swallow that. I will, however, believe one just decided to use his teeth.
Last time I saw Guy was years ago at a folk festival in White Oak, Florida. My then-current pelvic affiliation gave me a sugar cube and I do believe it had something in it. I don’t know if I’d recommend the experience to just anyone, but I must say there’s something very vivid about that sort of songwriter when one is in the midst of a magic carpet ride. Keep your Pink Floyd and your Radiohead, I prefer Roger Miller and Ray Wylie Hubbard when it comes to the total destruction of my mind.
sorry… thoughT-crime…..
al-though …..
Nobody wants to come here, so don’t worry.
I’ll take Felice & Boudleaux Bryant
They know better than I do the chances that they’ll run into someone honest. There have been one or two here, among many.
“Patterico calling in reinforcements.
What a tool.”
From what I’ve read here so far, he doesn’t need any.
Reinforcements, I mean.
Or tools.
Although, I must say, all the authentically angry leftists and liberals here throwing around the f-bomb doesn’t speak well of the forensic skills of the average poster here. It’s as many posters have forgotten the point. Or don’t want to remember it. Or be reminded of it.
I’m on record here many times as disapproving the argument that you need to condemn everything out there. I say only that *if* you’re going to discuss Frisch’s actions here, you should condemn them.
And they did. Repeatedly. Dumb-ass.
“I’m on record here many times”
Ad nauseum, I’d say.
“f-bomb”…. isn’t that a bit infantile. the word is fuck,
a perfectly respectable little Anglo-Saxon number
with a good Teutonic heritage…. i would think
a Republican would appreciate that.
and I’ve always wondered, why is the expression
of anger considered a psychological disorder?
I’m on record here many times as disapproving the argument that you need to condemn everything out there. I say only that *if* you’re going to discuss Frisch’s actions here, you should condemn them.
uhhh…
I guess we could write “We condemn Ms. Frisch’s actions and find them horrible.” 50000 times and it still wouldn’t be good enough for Patterico. Perhaps we need to make some sort of diarama,
on record ???
is this a glorified chatroom, or a grand jury proceeding?
I’ve known way too many Texans to swallow that. I will, however, believe one just decided to use his teeth.
Dood, c’mon, you KNOW there was some lady-impressin goin on at that table. Like I said, it was a moment in history…
mikey
let’s re-cap , and re-fine:
Miss Frisch typed comments that were crude and childish
to Mr Goldstein , who has mad his reputation (such as it is)
by typing crude and childish comments.
We now join our pogrom already in progress
oh, one more thing…. the sacred child in the midst of it all
is blissfully unaware of the foolish behavior of the
adults he is so foolishly depending on.
““f-bombâ€?…. isn’t that a bit infantile. the word is fuck,
a perfectly respectable little Anglo-Saxon number
with a good Teutonic heritage…. i would think
a Republican would appreciate that.”
I choose not to use the word in civil discourse because I don’t need to use it.
I would think a leftist would appreciate that … you know, freedom of choice.
If I want “a perfectly respectable little Anglo-Saxon number
with a good Teutonic heritage” I’ll go for a beer. Or a supermodel. Or a supermodel with beer.
“and I’ve always wondered, why is the expression
of anger considered a psychological disorder? ”
If you’re honestly asking, then the proper question might be “…WHEN is the expression of anger considered a psychological disorder?”
The answer of course being, but not limited to – severe displacement, rape fantasies about political opponent’s children. Not to caricature the debate, but; Anger is healthy. Threatening children is not.
Although, I must say, all the authentically angry leftists and liberals here throwing around the f-bomb
… and another winger gets the vapors upon reading some naughty words written by lefties.
Perhaps one of the same righties that praised Go Fuck Yourself Cheney for telling it like it is?
Although, I must say, all the authentically angry leftists and liberals here throwing around the f-bomb doesn’t speak well of the forensic skills of the average poster here.
Yes, we must all follow the “admirable restraint” of that eloquent wordsmith, Jeff Goldstein. We can taunt our enemy by suggesting we fucked their sisters, we just have to avoid using the word “fuck”. And we must also remain ambiguous regarding age and consent. For that is how you craft a forensically impressive retort.
Abraxas, I hope I just impressed your presumably Ventura-inspired self. I sure impressed your mother last night.
Next time you need to explain your moral revulsion at Frisch’s comments, I suggest using this. Eventually, we’ll find a medium which relays the message.
“I choose not to use the word in civil discourse”….
well, that says it all, now, doesn’t it?
if you can type a sentence like that with a straight face
I can certainly understand your horror of the word
FUCK
Patterico says: I’m on record here many times as disapproving the argument that you need to condemn everything out there.
This is disingenuous. As you well know, Sadly No!’s original post was made in response to that very argument (made by Confederate Yankee)–not to anything you said.
You can’t retroactively say, “You should have responded to the post I made later instead.” Neither Gavin nor Brad could have predicted that you would show up here and change the terms of the debate.
And, so, just like you have been challenging Sadly, No! to condemn Frisch without responding to Confederate Yankee’s (and others) smears against the “silence” on this blog, I’m CHALLENGING you to denounce each and every right-wing child molester. Why do you equivocate? Why can’t you simply condemn them without offering excuses for yourself? Is it really that hard?
wait —
what if we condemn everything anyone has ever said ?
Blam!!!
tabula rasa …. game over ….
re-Start
Gah.
Seriously, folks – sex is not an insult. If you think it is, then A.) you’re doing it wrong, B.) you need to take up a non-sexual hobby – I recommend golf, and C.) Please wear a sign or something, so those of us who don’t think sex is an insult don’t accidentally end up going home with your lame ass from a bar some night.
Let’s leave everybody’s sister, daughter, son, mother, father, and brother out of this. From now on, sexual insults should be reserved for only sufficiently removed consanguinal relatives – I’m holding out for fourth cousins, twice removed.
I would like to say, on record, that I will never, ever, ever, ever, again get into a lit crit debate on the internet.
I promise.
Although, I must say, all the authentically angry leftists and liberals here throwing around the f-bomb doesn’t speak well of the forensic skills of the average poster here.
Fuck off, fuckstick.
Then, to take them in order, Mr. Xavier –
“… and another winger gets the vapors upon reading some naughty words written by lefties.
Perhaps one of the same righties that praised Go Fuck Yourself Cheney for telling it like it is?”
I don’t have the vapors, it’s just unimpressive that one needs to use such language.
And no, I didn’t praise Cheney; in fact, (in keeping with the theme of the evening): I unequivocally denouce the Vice-President for the use of such language.*
And dgbellak
“Yes, we must all follow the “admirable restraintâ€? of that eloquent wordsmith, Jeff Goldstein. We can taunt our enemy by suggesting we fucked their sisters, we just have to avoid using the word “fuckâ€?. And we must also remain ambiguous regarding age and consent. For that is how you craft a forensically impressive retort.
Abraxas, I hope I just impressed your presumably Ventura-inspired self. I sure impressed your mother last night. ”
If it suits you to find parallels between child rape fantasies and personal insults, well, nothing I say will convince you otherwise. If you meant to be ironic about attempting to insult a woman you’ve never met (my mother) by juxtaposing it with Jeff’s insulting of a woman HE’S never met – well – ho, ho. Or maybe you meant it to be risible?
And no, I didn’t take my name from a Jesse Ventura film (although thank you for the IMDB pointer, I’ll have to read more about that); it’s just that all the cool names were taken. Like dgbellak.
*please notice the absence of any “but they started it, Liberals are worse, etc.”
I long ago vowed to “never, ever, etc., again get into a lit crit debate”
anywhere ….
put a gun or a right-wing blogger’s cock to my head and I will not
debate the influence of Lucia Joyce’s schizophrenia on
Finnegan’s Wake …
not for all the lesbians in Arizona or Oregon
Shouldn’t we focus on the truly salient matter, that of Jeff Goldstein’s heroic interal struggle with his homosexuality and the attendant rage problems that have resulted from his longstanding suppression of said homosexuality?
The man likes putting his penis on other men; that’s gay. And gay is fine. But for Jeff, gay is shameful, and so Jeff redirects the anger he feels about himself for his intense sexual desire for me, outward, everywhere. It’s gotten so bad, he needs drugs to control it – dangerous, addictive drugs.
Whatever whoever that woman was that nobody’s ever heard of before said or did, it’s been condemned, and that’s fine. Now, let’s focus on Jeff’s real problems. If we all treat him with love and respect, if we let him know that it’s OK to be who he really is, maybe we can make a breakthrough. Let’s help someone!
abraxas is part of the incantation that zeus uses to get rid of the flies in the Satre play, “Les Mouches”.
abraxas gallo gallo tse
you’re welcome. 😉
“needs to use such language….” …. “such language”….
say it out loud…. can you hear yourself, Mzzz Scarlet?
But you S,N! folks obsessing about his obsession about his cock?
That’s just gay (and not the good kind of gay either).
Look, a toady of a Jeff Goldstein toady. Way to stick up for your homey Patterico. Now we shall use you as a pinata for the remainder of the time you choose to post here. Welcome.
you know, Abraxas, would you like to see some really filthy language?
how about:
collateral damage …. traumatic amputation …. war crime ….
do those give you “the vapors?”
I condemn Frisch to triple infinity times googol plex.
and i condemn JK47
tag — you’re it ….
dammit, Abraxas, it was your turn to condemn someone
get in the game, honey
crap …. I hate when “the Bible” comes back to me ….
aren’t Republicans the Xtian party?
wouldn’t they remember the punch-line
“let he who is without sin cast the first stone” ?
(you know — when J.C. was trying to talk them out of
stoning his wife to death for cheating on him)
phleabo said, Shouldn’t we focus on the truly salient matter, that of Jeff Goldstein’s heroic interal struggle with his homosexuality and the attendant rage problems that have resulted from his longstanding suppression of said homosexuality?
Don’t even try go. If JG* were gay, then the right-wing would insist he’s on my team. And then Confederate Yankee and Malkin will insist that I have to apologize for his insensitive statements and ominous threats. And then I may have to become straight.
Not. Gonna. Happen.
* That other JG was enough horror to deal with for one decade, thank you very much.
If it suits you to find parallels between child rape fantasies and personal insults, well, nothing I say will convince you otherwise.
And that’s the other big issue that doesn’t seem to get through to the “Not the children!” crowd. Though none of us can say for sure (another point lost on many) I think most people here don’t actually believe her comments construed a child rape fantasy, or that she was a pedophile or any such things. When you see huge amounts of juvenile banter (no offense, Gavin, Brad & co….er…rock on!) taking place on both sides of the blogoshpere, it becomes so difficult when things get personal to differentiate between what’s serious, what’s a threat, what’s sensibly touchy, what’s batshit insane…well, it loses its shock and awe pretty quickly. The only things that truly offend or disturb are trends that are sociopathic, noticeable patterns of such behavior…well lookee here!
Point being, in a world of vile, disgusting quips, one set of boundary-crossing remarks to one fucktard does not a child molestor make. So pardon those who fail to rush to “unequivocally condemn” such a person.
“needs to use such language….� …. “such language�….
say it out loud…. can you hear yourself, Mzzz Scarlet? ”
I tend to write the way I would speak to you if we were standing face-to-face. I don’t think that Leftists and Liberals and Conservatives etc. can’t speak to each other, not as enemies, but as opponents. (yellow flag – too many negatives on the field). Let me be clear, that’s my personal ethos, not a plea for anyone else to adopt that sentiment.
And JK47 –
“Look, a toady of a Jeff Goldstein toady. Way to stick up for your homey Patterico. Now we shall use you as a pinata for the remainder of the time you choose to post here. Welcome.”
No one sent me here. I happened to end up here as a result of following the Frisch controversy. I had thought that this was a place with free-flowing debate, f-words (sorry Xavier) notwithstanding. Go ahead, pinata away. Either S,N! welcomes, and vigorously debates differing opinions or it does not. Either way, I thank the owners for allowing me to post thus far.
But in the face-to-face world F-you is generally not accepted as “vigorous debate”.
I apologize if my replies seem tardy, it isn’t a sign of disrespect, I just cannot type quickly.
I believe the children are the future ….
of course, if Mr Goldstein has his way,
they won’t have one
and I thank whatever-if-anything-is-behind-it-all
I never have the dubious pleasure of hearing
you speak to me “face to face”
This has officially reached the height of absurdity. Patterico is purposefully reading every condemnation in the least favorable light possible.
This is someone that had a near zero traffic blog, that wasn’t an active commenter except apparently for a few dust ups with Steve Verdon and Crooked Timber, until she got into it with Goldstein.
So now the Commissar, Rick Moran and Patterico decide to play these silly gotcha games.
“Say she’s bad or you agree with her”
“That denunciation isn’t strong enough”
“That denunciation also demonstrated a lack of civility toward Goldstein, who is the pinnacle of all that is good. I’m not all convinced that you don’t support child rape.”
“That denunciation is acceptable. Telling that it didn’t come until I pressed you for it.”
This is not a complex issue, consistenly the response from “The Left” is:
1. That Deb Frisch did something really bad.
2. But nobody knew who she was until a few days ago, so forgive us for not freaking out like It was a Talk Left post or something.
3. Just becuase it’s beyond the pale, let’s not forget that Goldstein is still a dick.
None of these are incredibly vague or complex ideas. Why some of these bloggers on the right can’t seem to follow them tells me that they are being fundamentally unserious about this.
I have a sneaking suspicion that the next time Goldstein or Vercingtorex or another of his commenters threaten a left blogger the response from the right is going to be “at least he goes after adults, you perverts. Enjoy the axe handle from the back and Jeff’s dick from the front.”
IOW, the right is preparing to give Jeff carte blanche to say or doanything he wants, so long as he doesn’t explicitly reference child molestation or child murder. Nice.
another thing not accepted in the “face to face world … as vigorous debate”:
bald-faced lies.
I find those more obscene than a few naughty words
Also, typing while on the phone causes typos. That or my UNHINDERED RAGE TOWARDS GOLDSTEIN. Blarrrrgggggghhhhh!
you don’t suppose Goldstein is a pseudonym borrowed from Orwell?
no, can’t be, he’s not that clever
we can still use it for Bush’s bogeyman:
Usama bin Goldstein
Xaveri says, another thing not accepted in the “face to face world … as vigorous debate�: bald-faced lies.
Come to think of it, exposing one’s penis is not something one would do in a face-to-face debate either. But that sort of action in virtual space doesn’t seem to bother Abraxas, now, does it?
Like I said earlier.. how do we even know her politics?
Why is she a lefty?
dgbellak:
After reading what she said, I firmly believe that she means that child harm. I’m not saying that to score points, or to contradict for contradiction’s sake. You can believe me or not.
She kept posting things such as the molestation fantasy. She kept doing it. Again and again.
Misunderstanding is one thing, we all misapprehend each other online all the time; the net seems custom built to hurt feelings and encourage vendettas. But you simply don’t bring a 2-year old into the mix in such a way. You don’t do it, you don’t joke about it and you don’t validate it. You simply don’t.
Unless there’s something wrong with you.
But one cannot take a chance. Now Jeff has to take measures (I hope) to protect his family that may include the acquisition of lethal force. It’s really a shame it went this far, but there’s only one person responsible for that, I’m afraid. Not a combination of people; not 30% her fault, 30% his fault and 83% Halliburton’s fault.
I don’t know that it can be put any plainer than that.
Anyway, I have to go take care of some business, thank you all for reading and considering, or reading and vilifying, or reading and saying “whatever…”
I’ll check back later if any would like to continue.
well, I don’t know, D., depends on what the argument was about …
whether or not “exposing one’s penis” would prove the
point
for fuck’s sake: i can sit here typing and mean any child in the world harm
and it is nothing without “means and opportunity”…. however–
if I order a 500 lb. bomb dropped on a neighborhood in Iraq,
or a missile fired into a neighborhood in Gaza,
then we might want to grab the kids and run for it
Either S,N! welcomes, and vigorously debates differing opinions or it does not.
I don’t know how the guys in charge of S, N feel about vigorous debate, but I personally can tell you that I hate you, hate all your right-wing buddies, and don’t give a fucking damn about you and yours.
So go fuck yourself and your passive-aggressive civil discourse, fuckstick.
For the Record:
I believe Patterico when he says that he did not approve or think it was funny that an anonymous commenter sexually threatened a two year old child.
but playing “king of the hill — take the high moral ground”
in this milieu is self-serving, and as hollow as Our
Dear Leader’s head
Also, am i wrong but did the fuckstick with a Batman villain’s name insinuate Goldstein has to get a gun now to protect his precious boy from… what, exactly? People on the Internet who actually aren’t the ones willing to do anythign criminal like release home addresses and identify children and where those children go to be educated?
Cause that’d be a super way to cap off my day of telling them all to fuck off.
you’re corrrect. but wouldn’t you assume Mr Goldstein
(considering his penis problem) would have already
over-compensated by acquiring a Big Gun ?
but hell, it would be just like shooting Phd’s in a barrel
I believe him, too, geoduck. Though I still think he’s a dick.
a “dick” obsessed with his own ‘dick’….
I believe him, too, but it’s amazing that believing Retardo to be a “liar” doesn’t wake one up to the fact that the similarly constructed “Left defends and supports Frisch” meme is ethical horseshit on its face. Simply amazing. How can one be, but the other not be? The Right are funny creatures. This has been exhausting.
Sigh.
….
….
….
I got TWO TICKETS TO PARADISE
Won’t you PACK YOUR BAGS – WE’LL LEAVE TONIGHT…
But you simply don’t bring a 2-year old into the mix in such a way. You don’t do it, you don’t joke about it and you don’t validate it. You simply don’t.
I’m sure that Jeff Goldstein’s commenters agree. Unless the 2-y-o is the daughter of a liberal. In which case, the appropriate course of action is to snuffle out all the private information on that child’s parents that they can muster.
This is not a complex issue, consistenly the response from “The Left� is:
1. That Deb Frisch did something really bad.
2. But nobody knew who she was until a few days ago, so forgive us for not freaking out like It was a Talk Left post or something.
3. Just becuase it’s beyond the pale, let’s not forget that Goldstein is still a dick.
And perhaps it’s accompanied by a sense of irony, and the bleak sense that the Goldstein collective”s capacity to dish it out like nutjobs only appears to meet its dark match from another nutjob.
Nutjob Wars: that’s why Tim Berners-Lee invented the web. Not.
And just think – all this argumentation could have been avoided if S,N! had begun and ended a post with “Deb Frisch is a reprehensible toddler rape/murder fantasist idiotâ€? and given a link.
Or if right wingers had sufficient reading comprehension skills to recognize that Gavin’s original post was all about Confederate Yankee’s idiotic attempt to tar Teh Left as Frisch-deifying toddler-molesters solely because Teh Left had not Risen Up As One to exile Frisch from their ranks Immediately And Forthwith as soon as her comment was recorded by manipulating magnetized particles within some server somewhere.
So let’s review the bidding, shall we?
Confederate Yankee posts something about how it’s all crickets when Frisch makes her stupid comments, proving that Teh Left is… uh, really really bad, I guess.
Gavin says, in essence: 1. Who is Frisch? 2. Those were some awful, stupid and awful stupid things she said. 3. In any case, if the entire Left is to be tarred by its “silence” about this unknown Frisch, then I guess we should tar the entire Right based on its silence about a whole raft of other stuff. Yes? Or are you just being a hypocrite, CY?
Friends of Jeff Goldstein drop by to, you know, say hi and, oh by the way, Gavin, pointing out Confederate Yankee’s hypocrisy means you condone, support and, in fact, agree with the terrible things Frisch said. You failed to condemn her stupidity the right way, or rather the Right way, and therefore you and the rest of Teh Left are… what? Eeeeeeevil? Toddler-molester supporters? Dorble flurken sneep? I don’t know. It’s all a blur now.
Oh, and in case there is any doubt: I don’t give a rat’s ass about what Frisch wrote. I know I am expected to jump up like I’m in a Whack-a-Mole game and spout something about how awful Frisch is, how horrible it was that she would write what she wrote, and blah de blah de blah. And I’m sorry if my refusal to spout that particular line gives the wingnuts proof that Teh Left really does support Frisch in her toddler-threatening, demon-summoning voodoo rituals, but you know what? I estimate that the number of stupid, vile, disgusting, outrageous, Absolutely Unacceptable comments posted to the Intarwebs is on the order of fourteen kajillion per femtosecond. Even if I wanted to pay attention to all of them, I couldn’t. And I’m not about to come across with what someone else thinks I should be saying about one of those idiotic comments, just because they think All Right-Thinking People Ought To Condemn It. This is the Internets, home of jumping to unwarranted conclusions, and anybody is free to decide I favor threatening children because I didn’t call for Frisch’s liver and lungs on a platter. There’s a damn good chance I won’t give a rat’s ass about that either.
And look, just for Abraxas, I got through a whole post without saying “fuck.”
Aw, shit.
I saw that somewhere, someone in the blogosphere just said something crass about a conservative. But I forgot where it was. And it’s just sitting there, undenounced! Sorry, y’all, my bad.
” I firmly believe that she means that child harm.”
Oh for fuck’s sake. What a drama queen you are. I have no doubt that she wanted to hurt and anger Jeff as much as she could, and went over the line to do it. But, please. the child was an abstraction to her – it was something to use to “get to” Jeff.
And as long as we’re talking about protecting the poor little child, what do you think about someone who blogs away about slapping people in the face with his cock, dog-fucking, fingering people’s sisters, smearing shit on people – and then on the very same blog brings up the subject of his toddler? The image of Jeff furiously typing away all these ugly fantasies while his child sleeps in the other room is pretty creepy, isn’t it?
I don’t think the authors would agree that that is the point of the blog. They seem to think they are all about intellectual honesty and such.
Brad! You wankers! Why didn’t you tell us? I feel so betrayed…
Abraxas said:
Although, I must say, all the authentically angry leftists and liberals here throwing around the f-bomb doesn’t speak well of the forensic skills of the average poster here. It’s as many posters have forgotten the point. Or don’t want to remember it. Or be reminded of it.
and then said:
The answer of course being, but not limited to – severe displacement, rape fantasies about political opponent’s children. Not to caricature the debate, but; Anger is healthy. Threatening children is not.
and finally said:
*please notice the absence of any “but they started it, Liberals are worse, etc.�
Translation:
This place is crawling with angry leftists and angry liberals, who have rape fantasies about opponents’ children, making them psychologically unhealthy. Because, of course, when Whatsherface made those comments to JG she was speaking for us all.
But, you’re right, there’s no “liberals are worse there”…none at all.
By the way, I wholeheartedly condemn whatsherface for her absolutely disgusting comments. Who cares if today was the first time I’ve ever heard of her? I mean, since I’m following the controversy I feel compelled to denounce all horrid, distasteful, sick liberals, cause I’m a liberal. And by extension that makes me the same as….
Gods, this shit makes my head hurt. Where the fuck was I? Oh yeah. It’s all my fault because I’m a liberal and I’m sorry so can you shut the fuck up already?
Now Jeff has to take measures (I hope) to protect his family that may include the acquisition of lethal force.
Seriously life-threatening to children: some commenter on JG’s blog that said despicable things about him and his kid, but has no idea where he lives, made no direct or implied threats, and in all likelihood lacks the intent or capability to do either of them harm.
Not at all life-threatening to children: A gun in the house. Under the control of Jeff Goldstein, who can barely form a coherent sentence let alone figure out how to keep it out of reach of kids.
Jeff should work on getting a job to support his children. I think this is more important to their welfare than “protecting” them from a nut in another state who said some nasty things about his family.
Hear hear, marky.
And the more I think about it, Jeff even bringing up the fact that he has a child, on his blog where he writes the shit he writes, is pretty disturbing. It’s kind of like a porn star bringing his kid to work.
And if I were Jeff’s wife, I would not feel very good about Jeff coming to join me in the marital bed after a long session of blogging.
Good Lord, FlipYrWhig! Don’t you realize that obscure commentators are the WORST kind! ZOMG!
Ahhh, Abraxas. He’s the type who could argue all day and never make a point.
Incidentally, when you attack someone for his or her choice of words, it’s generally bad form and/or dumb to try to defend your attack with “freedom of choice”.
But no matter.
I’ll say it again. Major left blogs need to condemn Frish the same way Fox News needs to condemn soap boxed crazy street corner guy.
Bonus: More Fun with Perspective!
While thinking of your favorite color, favorite animal, and what that animal would look like in that color, consider which of the two comments actually deserve more scorn:
“Hey guys, so Blogger X’s real name is Joe Kumquats, he lives at 123 Fake Street, and works for Acme Ballistic Missile Defense. If you’re in the area, and have some free time, why don’t you spot around and scream at him and maybe do some minor property damage?”
Door # 2?
“You’re a poopyhead, lol, n00b!”
Think it over to the relaxing tunes of Metallica: As Remixed by Yanni.
Someone touched earlier on about the difference between a “credible” and “un-credible” threat. I use this to dumb down her post to “poopyhead”. University professor who makes no attempt to hide her ID makes a batshit crazy comment on a high-volume blog about someone who lives in a different state, not so much with the worry.
This is the same thing that was done with Piss Christ. If the right (and probably some left to, to be honest) hadn’t raised such brouhaha over it, the artist would have gone back to the artistic tolerated obscurity he deserves.
*sigh* Anything to be the Poor Oppressed Little Minority Party, I guess. Don’t feel to bad, most people yurn to feel the Poor Oppressed X in some form. Hell, the Democrats self to be wallowing in the reality of it. But that’s a different rant.
Someone just sent me a vituperative, anonymous e-mail mocking my initial post by pointing out that Patterico is a “he” not a “she.” (The writer, oddly, thinks that this is an insult.)
Now I guess I could offer four equally lame responses:
A) My bad. I had never before visitied his site, and I didn’t check his profile.I’m new at this.
8) I assumed that Mr. Frey had adopted a pseudonym to protect his anonymity, so I’d thought I’d lend him a hand.
C) Given Pattycake’s promotion of his wife’s novel, I’d felt sure that they were a tag-team (a la Michelle & Jesse).
D) I was plagiarizing myself, and forgot to change the pronouns.
But, since I’m a flip-flopping liberal, I guess I’ll have to go with:
E) All of the above.
My apologies to Mr. Frey (or his wife) if he/she felt insulted.
I do agree that this is all getting a bit silly.
*flings poo*
Given Pattycake’s promotion of his wife’s novel, I’d felt sure that they were a tag-team (a la Michelle & Jesse).
You’re stilll missing it.
When it says at the top of the post: “posted by guest blogger Evan Maxwell,” that’s a hint. The hint is this: the post is by a guest blogger. Whose name is Evan Maxwell.
I ask guest posters to put this at the very top of the post, so that only the very stupidest people will miss it.
Ah, delightful! An infestation (if one can call “two” an infestation) of flying monkeys. Whot an *impressive* fit of sniveling, gents! Bra-veaux! clap. clap. clap. Say, do anagrams constitute ad hominems? I sure hope not, ‘cos here are some things you can make out of “Jeff Goldstein”:
JED TEFLONS FIG
JED TEFLON FIGS
JED ELGINS TOFF
JED SINGLE TOFF
JED GLISTEN OFF
JED TINGLES OFF
JED SINGLET OFF
JED TINGLE OFFS
JED GLEN SOFFIT
JED LONGEST IFF
JED SILENT GOFF
JED INLETS GOFF
JED LISTEN GOFF
JED INTELS GOFF
JED ENLIST GOFF
JED TINSEL GOFF
JED INLET GOFFS
JED INTEL GOFFS
JED LEST OFFING
JED LETS OFFING
JOSTLED FEN FIG
JOSTLED ENG IFF
JOLTED NEFF SIG
JOLTED FEN FIGS
JEDS GEOFF INTL
JEDS GEOFF LINT
JEDS FELTING OF
JEDS FEIGN LOFT
JEDS FEINT GOLF
JEDS FEINT FLOG
JEDS FELON GIFT
JEDS TEFLON FIG
JEDS GELIN TOFF
JEDS ELGIN TOFF
JEDS INGLE TOFF
JEDS TINGLE OFF
JEDS INLET GOFF
JEDS INTEL GOFF
JEDS LET OFFING
JEDS TEL OFFING
LED STIFFEN JOG
LED JESTING OFF
LED JETS OFFING
LED JEST OFFING
DEL STIFFEN JOG
DEL JESTING OFF
DEL JETS OFFING
DEL JEST OFFING
LEND SETOFF JIG
LEND OFFSET JIG
LEND JOSEF GIFT
LEND GOEST JIFF
OLDEN JEFF GIST
OLDEN GETS JIFF
ELDON JEFF GIST
ELDON GETS JIFF
LODEN JEFF GIST
LODEN GETS JIFF
ELDONS JEFF GIT
ELDONS GET JIFF
LODE JEFF STING
LODE GENTS JIFF
DOLE JEFF STING
DOLE GENTS JIFF
DOLES JEFF TING
DOLES GENT JIFF
SOLED JEFF TING
SOLED GENT JIFF
STOLED JEFF GIN
STOLED NEFF JIG
STOLED ENG JIFF
OLDEST JEFF GIN
OLDEST NEFF JIG
OLDEST ENG JIFF
LEDS JEFF TIGON
LEDS JEFF INGOT
LEDS JET OFFING
SLED JEFF TIGON
SLED JEFF INGOT
SLED JET OFFING
NED GEOFF JILTS
NED GEOFFS JILT
DEN GEOFF JILTS
DEN GEOFFS JILT
END GEOFF JILTS
END GEOFFS JILT
SONDE JEFF GILT
NODES JEFF GILT
NOSED JEFF GILT
DOESNT JEFF GIL
DOESNT GEL JIFF
DOESNT LEG JIFF
STONED JEFF GIL
STONED GEL JIFF
STONED LEG JIFF
NOTED JEFF GILS
NOTED LEGS JIFF
NOTED GELS JIFF
TONED JEFF GILS
TONED LEGS JIFF
TONED GELS JIFF
NEDS GEOFF JILT
ENDS GEOFF JILT
DENS GEOFF JILT
SEND GEOFF JILT
DENTS OLEG JIFF
DENTS LOGE JIFF
DENTS OGLE JIFF
TENDS OLEG JIFF
TENDS LOGE JIFF
TENDS OGLE JIFF
TEND OGLES JIFF
TEND LOGES JIFF
DENT OGLES JIFF
DENT LOGES JIFF
DOE JEFF GLINTS
ODE JEFF GLINTS
ODES JEFF GLINT
DOES JEFF GLINT
DOSE JEFF GLINT
DOTES GLEN JIFF
DOTE JEFF SLING
DOTE GLENS JIFF
TOED JEFF SLING
TOED GLENS JIFF
DES JEFF TIGLON
DES JEFF TOLING
DES JINGLE TOFF
TEDS JEFF LINGO
TEDS JEFF LOGIN
TEDS JINGLE OFF
TED SNIFFLE JOG
TED JEFF LOGINS
TED JEFF LOSING
TED JEFF SOLING
TED JOSEF FLING
TED JINGLE OFFS
TED JINGLES OFF
DOFFING JET LES
DOFFING JET ELS
DOFF GENE JILTS
DOFF GENES JILT
DOFF NESTLE JIG
DOFF JINGLE SET
DOFF GELIN JETS
DOFF GELIN JEST
DOFF ELGIN JETS
DOFF ELGIN JEST
DOFF INGLE JETS
DOFF INGLE JEST
DOFF ELGINS JET
DOFF SINGLE JET
DOFFS GENE JILT
DOFFS GELIN JET
DOFFS ELGIN JET
DOFFS INGLE JET
FIND FLEETS JOG
FIND FLEET JOGS
FINDS FLEET JOG
FOLD FEIGN JETS
FOLD FEIGN JEST
FOLD FEIGNS JET
FOLDS FEIGN JET
FOND FLEETS JIG
FOND FLEET JIGS
FONDS FLEET JIG
DIG JEFF ELTONS
DIG JEFF TELSON
DIG JEFF STOLEN
DIG NEFF JOSTLE
GILD JEFF TONES
GILD JEFF NOTES
GILD JEFF ONSET
GILD JEFF SETON
GILD JEFF STENO
GILD JEFF STONE
DOLING JEFF SET
GILDS JEFF NOTE
GILDS JEFF TONE
DING JEFF TELOS
DING JEFF STOLE
DING JOSEF FELT
DING JOSEF LEFT
DOING JEFF LEST
DOING JEFF LETS
DINGO JEFF LEST
DINGO JEFF LETS
DOSING JEFF LET
DOSING JEFF TEL
DOINGS JEFF LET
DOINGS JEFF TEL
DOTING JEFF LES
DOTING JEFF ELS
DINGS JEFF TOLE
DIGS JEFF ELTON
DIGS JEFF LENTO
GOLD TEENS JIFF
GOLD STEEN JIFF
GOLD TENSE JIFF
GOLD JEFF SENTI
GOLD JEFF INSET
GOLD JEFF TINES
GOLD JEFF STEIN
GOLDS ENTE JIFF
GOLDS TEEN JIFF
GOLDS JEFF TINE
GOLDS JEFF NITE
DONG SLEET JIFF
DONG STELE JIFF
DONG STEEL JIFF
DONG JEFF STILE
DONG JEFF ISLET
DONG JEFF TILES
DONG JEFF LISTE
GOD NESTLE JIFF
GOD SNIFFLE JET
GOD JEFF SILENT
GOD JEFF INLETS
GOD JEFF LISTEN
GOD JEFF INTELS
GOD JEFF ENLIST
GOD JEFF TINSEL
DOG NESTLE JIFF
DOG SNIFFLE JET
DOG JEFF SILENT
DOG JEFF INLETS
DOG JEFF LISTEN
DOG JEFF INTELS
DOG JEFF ENLIST
DOG JEFF TINSEL
DOGS JEFF INLET
DOGS JEFF INTEL
GODS JEFF INLET
GODS JEFF INTEL
ID JEFF LONGEST
LIND GEOFF JETS
LIND GEOFF JEST
LIND GEOFFS JET
LIND JEFF GOEST
LINDS GEOFF JET
LIDO JEFF GENTS
IDOL JEFF GENTS
SOLID JEFF GENT
IDOLS JEFF GENT
LIDOS JEFF GENT
SOLDI JEFF GENT
STOLID JEFF ENG
TONDI JEFF LEGS
TONDI JEFF GELS
DINT JEFF OGLES
DINT JEFF LOGES
STDIO JEFF GLEN
DOIT JEFF GLENS
OLD JEFF SIGNET
OLD JEFF INGEST
SOLD JEFF TINGE
DOLTS GENE JIFF
TOLD GENES JIFF
TOLD JEFF SENGI
TOLD JEFF SINGE
DOLT GENES JIFF
DOLT JEFF SENGI
DOLT JEFF SINGE
LTD OFFENSE JIG
LTD FEIGN JOSEF
NOD JEFF LEGIST
DON JEFF LEGIST
DONS TELEG JIFF
DONS JEFF LEGIT
NODS TELEG JIFF
NODS JEFF LEGIT
DONT LEGES JIFF
DONT GLEES JIFF
DONT JEFF GILES
DONT JEFF LEGIS
DO JEFF GLISTEN
DO JEFF TINGLES
DO JEFF SINGLET
DOS GENTLE JIFF
DOS JEFF TINGLE
SOD GENTLE JIFF
SOD JEFF TINGLE
DOTS ENGEL JIFF
DOTS ENGLE JIFF
DOTS JEFF GELIN
DOTS JEFF ELGIN
DOTS JEFF INGLE
TOD ENGLES JIFF
TOD ENGELS JIFF
TOD JEFF ELGINS
TOD JEFF SINGLE
DOT ENGLES JIFF
DOT ENGELS JIFF
DOT JEFF ELGINS
DOT JEFF SINGLE
OK, there were lots more–that was less than half. But I didn’t want the post to be *too* long!
I couldn’t give a shit about any of this, but.
1. JG put up a photo of DF and her family on his front page,
2. along with a weasely claim that he hasn’t “allowed anything” when the link first appeared in a comment thread
3. said comment thread contained, I note, more than one “threat” against DF that is at least as clear and direct as the “threat” she made against JG
4. JG says himself that he didn’t find her comments threatening–which should be the end of the “threat” accusation
5. At least one commenter in JG’s thread says things about DF’s kid that are at least as gross as what DF said. Some commenters say this is uncool, but JG lets the comment stand
6. DF says that she has received threats, real physical threats, via email
7. She has told JG–this too is on his front page–that she feels physically threatened by having her family’s photo published in the context of this blogwar
8. JG makes some comment about “can’t expect not to have people link to newspaper coverage”–no doubt, but it is also true that when one does newspaper interviews one does not usually expect later to be receiving email threats (and whatever one “can expect,” the fact remains that JG can easily remove the link)
8. JG says he broke the link, but then turns around and posts it on the front page to punish her for insulting him on his blog
So. JG says he does NOT feel threatened by DF’s actions. DF says she DOES feel threatened by one of JG’s commenters actions, and after she tells JG this, he does the very thing that she feels threatened by.
Given all that? There is NO ground for ANYONE to complain about DF’s actions or statements. None.
There is totally valid ground to complain about JG’s actions, which clearly constitute both an implied threat and callous indifference to the (alleged) existence of actual threats.
I hate even commenting on this thing. I despise JG and I hate these kind of idiotic blog spats. But precisely because actual threats against people’s families are, in fact, scary and should be completely off limits, it is absolutely fucking appalling to have people drumming up an offensive comment that is, nonetheless, obviously not a real threat while completely ignoring an actual existing threat that is countenanced and escalated by the so-called “victim.”
Hey, bitch phd!
You know Wally Hettle, right?
I think you do.
That would be the guy who threatened Paul Deignan in real life.
http://www.ada-vs.com/leftResponds.pdf
Oh — does everyone here condemn that? Because we’re all so into people not losing their real jobs and all.
I swear I’ll post the rest of those anagrams if that’s what it takes to kill this thread. Hell, I’ll even generate anagrams derived from “Jeff Goldstein’s cock,” if I have to!
Patterico,
on May 13, 1953, Eddy “The Lump” Bonifacci threatened to hit William McCastle in the kidney with a tire iron if Mr. McCastle did not provide him with the name of the young lady who had identified his employer, Carmine “Assface” Pugigigiglio, in a police lineup.
Do you condemn THAT? Do you? Do you? Or are you a fascist hypocrite? Huh? Huh?
Do you condemn genocide in Darfur? Do you condemn the Ribbentrop-Molotov Pact? Do you condemn the clubbing of baby seals? Do you condemn the eating of meat? Do you condemn the reading of “The Color Purple” by impressionable high school students who may not yet know that lesbianism is possible?
Will you shut up already?
Well, Patterico has now admitted to being a partisan whore. He is so fucking tribal. Paul Deignan? You total fucking putz. You could keep going with your “the left still refuses to condemn x, even though I begged them to,” but you brought up Paul Deignan. You ass.
Wally Hettle contacted Paul Deignan’s phd advisors to ask them to reign him in due to his being a total fucktard on bitchphd’s blog. That is all. Threatened? You seem to stretch the definition of that word when it suits you.
So it seems that Patterico believes that JG’s offspring was threatened by DF.
Patterico also believes that JG in his infinite cockdom does not threaten people with being slapped with his dick, it’s all fun and games when JG says it.
Oh, crap. Wally Hettle threatened PD! Same fucking wording. Patterico believes that it is a threat equivalence.
You know what I condemn? Assholes like you.
Patterfucktard.
DOSE JEFF GLINT
Oh, be careful Marq! That anagram could be read as both a veiled threat against Goldstein’s tyke, and a stab at his anti-anxiety medication. I’d hate to have to condemn you or anything…
Actually, Patty, PD is the person who threatened to sue and out me. And did so in vitriolic language that he kept up for weeks until he deleted all traces of it on his blog, presumably to hide his tracks. Do you condemn that?
In other words, bite me.
I think that’s a legitimate thing to respond to. She’s the face of the fringe left. Almost by definition. But there is a fringe right, too. Pat Robertson and Ann Coulter are some of its faces.
This is breathtaking in its ridiculosity.
On the one side, we have two well-known individuals with easy access to American mass media, who have large numbers of “followers,” or at the very least people who have expressed some level of agreement with the extreme views these two propagate.
On the other side, we have an adjunct professor nobody’s ever heard of, and who, in her first foray into the limelight of the political blogosphere, is universally condemned by the very people she is held up to represent.
Same thing, right? Totally equivalent. Sure.
(Sorry if this has already been addressed, but I knew if I waited until I read all 180 comments, I’d forget what I wanted to comment about. Too much airplane glue in the ’80s, you know.)
“Brad, it’s sad that you and the rest of the moonbats fail to see that if some obscure twit made a vile remark about Jeff’s child, then he has achieved sainthood, and you must worship him. You must also kill the twit to return balance to the universe, or else the crops will fail this summer. That’s how it works.”
Thank you, that was teh funny.
I suspect Patterico is doing this so he can wave the ‘martyr’ flag over his head and feel better about himself…now where was that copy of the DSMIV?
Actually, Patty, PD is the person who threatened to sue and out me.
With the enthusiastic support of none other than Jeff Goldstein. Why is it that whenever a blogfight gets totally out of hand, he’s somehow involved?
With the enthusiastic support of none other than Jeff Goldstein. Why is it that whenever a blogfight gets totally out of hand, he’s somehow involved?
Because he lives for the Blog Fight?
So Goldstein comes back with a “yo’ momma� type comment. Sure, nobody deserves to have their mother dragged into the argument, and it’s a damn shame when it happens. But the guy was asking for a slap back, and he got one. Hard to cry over that.
Once again, the arbitrary line:
jokes about sexually assaulting adults (or, people whose age is unknown) = ‘yo momma’-level, harmless
jokes about sexually assaulting minors = absolutely intolerable, turn off the internets
Patty, if you have kids, I hope they get anally raped (*gasp*)… when they turn 18! (relieved laughter).
The school yard “I screwed yo’ momma� chants imply the momma is willing.
You make up a bad analogy, and then claim that the original statement has to conform to the analogy *in every way*. You are damn stupid. I mean, really, genuinely dumb.
As dumb as: “bumblebees look like honeybees- therefore, bumblebees have stingers!”
As dumb as: “saying ‘fuck yo mama’ is the moral equivalent of saying ‘ go fuck yourself’. And fucking yourself is impossible. Ergo, it’s impossible to fuck your own mother.”
Commenter #3 who it’s not worth talking to.
translation: commenter number 3 who’s caught me in a transparent idiotic lie and fucked me up. Funny how you get tired of the conversation just about the time you’re picking up your teeth. Conveniently, you can now avoid responding to the substantive proof that you’re full of shit.
Abraxas,
I don’t have the vapors, it’s just unimpressive that one needs to use such language.
And where exactly did you dream up the “need” to use the word fuck? I use that word bc it’s a useful word, fuckball. If you perceive a need, that’s something about you…
You just wanted some cheap moral superiority, but I doubt that anyone was impressed. If cussing offends you so much, then fuck off to someplace else. Or stick around and argue- but stop fucking whining, either way.
If it suits you to find parallels between child rape fantasies and personal insults…
It does when the ‘personal insults’ are also sexual assault fantasies. And the child rape fantasies are also personal insults. The only differentiating factor here is sexual assault of a minor v sexual assault of an adult, despite the very different labels you apply in order to excuse the one.
And if you think that those two things are so different that one is suitable for a joke while the other is so horrifying as to be unmentionable, you are a moral idiot.
I tend to write the way I would speak to you if we were standing face-to-face.
Except for the flipping through the thesaurus part. You are like the millionth person in the history of the net to try the upper-class-Englishman-bowtie schtick- “my word old chap, I find these proceedings to be quite uninteresting, what with their repeated profanities and ad hominems!”
For the record, it wasn’t impressive the first 999,999 times, and it isn’t working for you, either.
I thought Abraxas was being nice. No need to be abusive to someone who’s not being abusive first, kids. For the record, I unequivocally condemn equivocal condemnations.
Goodness. The Indeignant? Wasn’t that blogspat about 5000 netyears ago?
Anyway, at the time, I condemned Hettle and so did plenty of others. PD was a shrill fool, but Hettle shouldn’t have taken a blustering blogspat offline to PD’s thesis supervisor by misusing his academic status.
This has been pressing on me so here goes.
The well-intentioned Patterico has been reminding me of nothing so much as my childhood abusers, who would babble similar rationalizations to me, to each other and to themselves in their desperation to justify their atrocities, dick-slapping jokes and the Majikthise fantasy were the soundtrack kids like me grow up with.
Evil feeds on secrecy but this American subculture is out there and some people here actually get that, and the fact that it entails the jokes/warnings and imminent reality that those jokes lead to.
I grew up a target of the sort of depraved bonhomie under discussion which I always and instantly recognize whether said by Goldstien or Frisch. To these people they’re just jokes, to others they are inflictions and what is inflicted is horrible.
The rationalizations for the jokes are much more more sinister than the jokes themselves, if you don’t get that then spend time thinking about why that is. I grew up being manipulated by that unctuous, evenhanded reasoning you, Patterico, remind me of, you an unwitting collaborator, will you leave here a knowing abdicator, using ignorance as alibi no matter how shaky the ground?
Those jokes are a language you may not recognize, because it’s never been inflicted on you, I doubt you would like it. The language may not always accompany actual physical abuse, but know that this is the language of abusers. Savor that, the connections we survivors make when we encounter it. Too bad, isn’t it?
Too bad how it triggers, bewilders and hounds you the rest of your life. You think liberals are just picking fights out of thin air? I don’t say “NO!” as fast as the sadly no crowd, I grew up afraid to interrogate my own indoctrination. After 20+ years of deprogramming by good, humanistic psychologists, I have a clue, a green light that says I may proceed to de-pacify, even though I’m afraid I’m going to get my ASS KICKED, I get to have a visceral reaction to jokes about dick-slapping and touching sister’s secret places.
What’s wrong here is, in wingnut circles, is my reaction, saner people just notice with an open mind that words can destabilize, retraumatize and even spiral some poor souls into brief reactive psychosis. You may think I’m being hyperbolic, but I’m the one who lives to make this small, smaller than you and smaller than my caregiver/murderers, because there is no squaring the evil in the acts they subjected me to. That’s what pasty’s defenders activate in me, my abusers who were my family, playing on my old fear and loyalty because using me made them happy and of course I asked for it, and my own resistance is all that stands in the way of making incest fun for me. Any hint of protest would lead to greater violation, and any problems I have reconciling all this means I also possess a failure to forgive.
That’s what brutal, sexualized language does, and that’s ok in all the unsafe people and places over and over world without end. It takes work to confront that, in part because admitting what semantics can activate in me is humiliating, and I’m trying to get passed humiliation.
To recover means to confront, to confront means saying no. The last couple days here are helping me do a kind of work beyond any small mind’s conception and to hell with anyone who would minimize that.
That’s really the point I was trying to make to Patterico, flawedplan.
You did it much better than I did, though.
Smug members of the privileged class like him, however, will never get it. But it never hurts to try.
And don’t let them drag you down – take care of yourself!
Jillian, you most of all gave me the courage to post this. Sorry sadly No! for the sentimental shit but this is a circle jerk after all!
Hello all!
Business concluded, I am back. The thread looks to have gotten stale since last night, but I did promise to come back and engage, so here I am.
In order then –
Xavier:
“for fuck’s sake: i can sit here typing and mean any child in the world harm
and it is nothing without “means and opportunity�
Xavier, you’re awfully brave with someone else’s child. The woman is now (thankfully) unemployed by her University. Plenty of opportunity for someone who has done little else with her life in the last week than sit and brood on how the other side has ruined her life, and now has plenty of time on her hands to … what? take a macramé class? Self-reflect? Plan revenge on some guy in Colorado by abducting his kid? I don’t know and neither do you. But reread what she actually wrote. From reading her blog, it seems evident she doesn’t let things go. Ever.
And it doesn’t take much means to harm a 2 year old. Any functioning adult can do it. Even halfwit liberal professors blinded by outrage.
And if you want to argue about Middle East policy – go argue about Middle East policy. It has nothing to do with the matter at hand, other than to serve as evidence of continuing moral equivalence on the part of Ms. Frisch’s political partisans.
Dan Someone:
Yes. Let’s review, shall we?
“Or if right wingers had sufficient reading comprehension skills to recognize that Gavin’s original post was all about Confederate Yankee’s idiotic attempt to tar Teh Left as Frisch-deifying toddler-molesters solely because Teh Left had not Risen Up As One to exile Frisch from their ranks Immediately And Forthwith as soon as her comment was recorded by manipulating magnetized particles within some server somewhere.�
Ok – so why do you think I made the suggestion that “S,N! … {begin} and ended a post with “Deb Frisch is a reprehensible toddler rape/murder fantasist idiot� and given a link.�
I’ll give you a minute.
Time’s up. The answer is: So that S,N! and it’s commenters would *not* be drawn into a silly “Condemnation War�. So Confederate Yankee made an assertion, and instead of proving him (her) dead wrong by doing exactly what they should have done had anyone been actually thinking instead of reacting (see suggestion above), S,N! proves him right by offering a thread with a host of moral equivalencies, which you in fact state admirably – pay especial attention to your point (3): “Gavin says, in essence: 1. Who is Frisch? 2. Those were some awful, stupid and awful stupid things she said. 3. In any case, if the entire Left is to be tarred by its “silence� about this unknown Frisch, then I guess we should tar the entire Right based on its silence about a whole raft of other stuff. Yes? Or are you just being a hypocrite, CY?�
And then there’s this choice bit: “Oh, and in case there is any doubt: I don’t give a rat’s ass about what Frisch wrote.�
Yet you continue to post a little less than 500 words about the subject. What happens to your keyboard when you *do* care about a subject?
g:
“Oh for fuck’s sake. What a drama queen you are. I have no doubt that she wanted to hurt and anger Jeff as much as she could, and went over the line to do it. But, please. the child was an abstraction to her – it was something to use to “get toâ€? Jeff.â€?
Please see my response to Xavier above.
“And as long as we’re talking about protecting the poor little child, what do you think about someone who blogs away about slapping people in the face with his cock, dog-fucking, fingering people’s sisters, smearing shit on people – and then on the very same blog brings up the subject of his toddler?â€?
Well g, I think more of them than I do of those who use the concept of someone else’s child to try to score cheap partisan points. Like you.
“The image of Jeff furiously typing away all these ugly fantasies while his child sleeps in the other room is pretty creepy, isn’t it?�
And here we start to see some serious equivalencies emerge: It almost seems like you want it to read a bit like – “Yeah, Deb did something wrong, but that GOLDSTEIN is a creepy ugly fantasist with a child! And we know what creepy ugly fantasists do to their children, don’t we?!?!? And to top it off, he’s a conservative! (crowd gasps) Call CPS! Get your pitchforks� Exeunt mob.
But that’s really not what you meant, is it g?
Ah, Gratis! my favorite response of the bunch:
“Translation:
This place is crawling with angry leftists and angry liberals, who have rape fantasies about opponents’ children, making them psychologically unhealthy. Because, of course, when Whatsherface made those comments to JG she was speaking for us all.�
Translation:
I can’t really find anything to argue with you about, so I’ll just pull together some of your quotes dealing with different questions, make them mean what I’m certain that you meant (you being a meanie conservative and all), and pretend there’s some standard of intellectual rigor in what I’ve done.
Or you could just be a University Psychology professor.
rj:
#1 – ibid response to Xavier.
“Not at all life-threatening to children: A gun in the house. Under the control of Jeff Goldstein, who can barely form a coherent sentence let alone figure out how to keep it out of reach of kids.�
Leaving aside your complete ignorance regarding the Goldstein household, a second amendment debate is not fruitful here. The law allows one to protect one’s family in one’s own home with deadly force. If you truly have a problem with that, there are alternatives. Like Cuba. As a bonus, I hear they have universal health care.
But again, different subject, different debate.
Kamrom:
“And where exactly did you dream up the “need� to use the word fuck? I use that word bc it’s a useful word, fuckball. If you perceive a need, that’s something about you…
You just wanted some cheap moral superiority, but I doubt that anyone was impressed. If cussing offends you so much, then fuck off to someplace else. Or stick around and argue- but stop fucking whining, either way.�
See, this is what I was talking about – you’re so busy being transgressive with all the profanity, you’ve completely missed the point. You *want* to sound like a tough guy, but what you *really* sound like is a 13 year old who just read “The Catcher in the Rye� for the first time last night.
Here’s where your reading comprehension fails you: I never said I was (nor have I been throughout my visit here) offended, nor have I presumed any authority, moral or otherwise. It sounds as though you want that to be the case, but you lose on that score Kamron.
“And if you think that those two things are so different that one is suitable for a joke while the other is so horrifying as to be unmentionable, you are a moral idiot.�
Oh – I take it back it *does* in fact sound a bit like the stench of moral authority … oh, wait, … those are your words. You do realize you’ve condemned most of your fellow travelers here with that statement, yes?
I’m sorry, but your point, however much heat it generates, doesn’t hold up to the light very well. You want to conflate High School locker-room humor with serious, serial threatening language. For what purpose? Moral Equivalence, it looks like.
And that is (have a friend help you out here) Exactly. What. Your. Opponents. Have. Been. Accusing. You. Of.*
“Except for the flipping through the thesaurus part. You are like the millionth person in the history of the net to try the upper-class-Englishman-bowtie schtick- “my word old chap, I find these proceedings to be quite uninteresting, what with their repeated profanities and ad hominems!� For the record, it wasn’t impressive the first 999,999 times, and it isn’t working for you, either.�
Ah yes, you have me there; I am indeed a bowtied, thesaurus-toting wanna-be Englishman.
Lo Ping Wang:
Thank you for the kind words. I did indeed try to be nice. Your expressions of gentleness are like unto dew in the desert, what with my vapors and all. And my bowtie. And thesaurus.
flawed plan:
Your post is the cherry on top. If the bozos posting here can read it and not understand the deep universal irony it reveals in all the profanity and personal insults that have preceded it on this thread, then no wonder they can’t distinguish between psuedo-tough talk and genuine existential threats.
I’m sorry if I missed anyone other than the obvious ad hominem slingers, but this will be my last visit here.
I wish everyone joy of their … um … philosophy.
*Sorry for the preposition, it seems my thesaurus was of little use to me there.
I’m sorry if I missed anyone other than the obvious ad hominem slingers, but this will be my last visit here.
Really? That’s so sad!
Really? That’s so sad!
Bite your tongue, jade! The “why don’t you move to Cuba” line is comedy gold!
Abraxas,
See, this is what I was talking about – you’re so busy being transgressive with all the profanity, you’ve completely missed the point. You *want* to sound like a tough guy, but what you *really* sound like is a 13 year old who just read “The Catcher in the Rye� for the first time last night.
This is just your failure to detatch your own personal frame from the interpretation. I actually say fuck a fair amount of the time in person, so it doesn’t have any of the Im-being-naughty nuance that you apparently attach to it. Which suggests that it is you who are the 13-year-old, but of the snitch variety rather than the smoking-in-the-bathroom type.
And *please* don’t start with the tough guy talk; unless this is your first post ever, you know that this can lead no useful end. That is to say, it’s very easy for you to insult my toughness when you know that your bluff cannot be called- it’s cowardly of you, in fact.
Here’s where your reading comprehension fails you: I never said I was (nor have I been throughout my visit here) offended, nor have I presumed any authority, moral or otherwise. It sounds as though you want that to be the case, but you lose on that score Kamron.
Pardon me for drawing the incredibly obvious conclusion from your sad little rant. Please confine yourself to posting about things that you actually give a fuck about, I suspect that will allow you to avoid dealing with this sort of problem in the future.
The fact that you’re keeping score IMO says it all- you’re not here to talk, you’re here because your self-worth meter is low & you think you can get a refill here. Using tactics such as this one, where you microparse meanings and then do a sad little victory dance.
[Why am I here? I like beating on assheads such as yourself when work is slow. For serious discussion of *anything*, Id be elsewhere.]
Oh – I take it back it *does* in fact sound a bit like the stench of moral authority … oh, wait, … those are your words. You do realize you’ve condemned most of your fellow travelers here with that statement, yes?
I am perfectly comfortable with taking a moral position on sexual assault. I am also perfectly confortable offering ridicule to those who want to act as moral policemen towards others’ language. Again, if you can’t see a difference between these two sorts of behavior, you are a moral idiot.
Also note that I didn’t suggest that both behaviors were unacceptable, just that attempting to draw a strong distinction between the two is morally bizarre. One might just as easily use my statement to support the idea that *all* jokes/flamewars are harmless (unless they become real-world actions, such as outing anonymous writers or posting private information). Which, as it turns out, is my actual position.
The fundamental point is that the sexual assault of an innocent adult is not substantially morally different than the sexual assault of a minor. Acting otherwise, for the furtherance of such a shitty little partisan point, is moral idiocy. It is taking something important (rape) and redefining it for trivial purposes (making political point in a blog comment).
I’m sorry, but your point, however much heat it generates, doesn’t hold up to the light very well. You want to conflate High School locker-room humor with serious, serial threatening language.
And you want to keep playing games, giving one kind of behavior one label and the other a completely different one, despite their basic similarity.
Only a delusional jackass like yourself could continue to maintain that the JonBenet comment was actually a threat. Even Jeff G says that it wasn’t a threat (please, fucking deal with that fact if you want to continue to claim that it was a serious threat). Everything the woman said indicates that it was not a threat- yet you want to classify it differently than cock-beating threats, and solely for rhetorical purposes.
In doing so, your trivialize genuine assaults and threats of assault. You cry wolf, and only because you have such low self-worth that you need to try to feel superior to others by making a point in a comment.
And that is (have a friend help you out here) Exactly. What. Your. Opponents. Have. Been. Accusing. You. Of.*
No one has accused *me* of anything, you pompous twit. Since my position is that all of this is a tempest in a teapot, that none of the statements were genuine threats, but that both JG’s and Fritch’s statements were in very poor taste, I fail to see how my position is threatened. Or even ‘accused’ of anything.
I shall offer you a tiny, tiny bit of help here: not all lefties think the same things.
That nugget of information will doubtless help you understand the world a bit better; in the future, you won’t make the mistake of believing that one of us speaks for the rest.
Of course, since that’s blindingly fucking obvious, the admonition wouldn’t be complete without the addition of ‘you fucking idiot’.
Ah yes, you have me there; I am indeed a bowtied, thesaurus-toting wanna-be Englishman.
What other kind of asshole would apologize for ending a sentence with a preposition? That’s exactly the sort of grammarian-authoritarian rule that your kind enjoys blabbing on about- it’s not even considered a fault except by the most anally-retentive:
http://www.bartleby.com/64/C001/050.html
It’s just a petty way of trying to feel superior to others, practiced solely by those who are overwhelmed by their own feelings of inferiority & deperately seek anything upon which to stake their self-worth.
[…] So. Some of the following I may flesh out here, or not. But this week I joined in thrilling conversations at Ilyka Damen’s blog, (about Dr. Helen , aka InstaStigma) a fantastic two-page thread at Icarus about the dangers of the biologic model of madness, a thread at Two Glasses on how far-right wingnuts keep me sane thanks to Buber’s I-thou dialogic, told Sadly, No! about my tragic childhood, oh and Libertarianism, where I come out of the closet regarding my misspent affiliation with Ayn Rand’s Objectivism, and the day I got fatherly advice from the truly heroic anti-psychiatrist Peter Breggin during my stint as tri-state Propaganda Director for 1980 Libertarian presidential candidate Ed Clark, what an eye-opener that was, and about which I would like to add this: […]
[…] I actually agree with Goldstein, that his remarks about the 700 Club and honeybaked ham should’ve been included. It does make his attempt at humor a little more clearly understood, if still underwhelming (honestly, Jeff, are threats of violence really such a reliable staple of humor?). However, having worked as a newspaper reporter, I’m pretty sure the end of that quote was removed by a skittish editor – likely to avoid offending 700 Club viewers and people who enjoy honeybaked ham. Seriously. Editors are scared to death of offending readers, especially the type who fit into the afforementioned demographics (hint: they’re typically elderly, and they have all day to write letters). It’s hardly suprising at this point that reporters such as Ms Everett-Haynes would go out of her way, seemingly, to turn a story about a woman made disparaging comments about my wife and child into a story that suggests conservatives are rabid vendetta hunters out to get poor misunderstood university teachers (and I was one myself, incidentally) who writes … in the course of an hour or so [vile (things that we) condemn her for … All of us].” […]
[…] Now, I have called people nasty names in the past- “raging ass-fuck monster twat” is my personal favorite. However, I do at least understand and recognize that my status as a foul-mouthed cretin renders me completely unfit to lecture others about the virtues of civility. I would like to think that anyone who gleefully calls someone else a “douche” and “pussy” would at least own up to what they are, instead of bringing out the tired schtick of, “My poo doth not stinketh but thine poo dost! Saying that thou didst touch some guy’s sister in her secret places lots is harmless grade school humour! But if thou callest someone a “wanker,” then thou the vilest knave e’er to debauch o’er the land! I am rubber, thou art glue, thy foolish scamp! W00teth!” […]
[…] “Can I touch your sister in her secret places? Lots?” […]
[…] Ah, Patterico, that staunch conservative ethicist who thinks it’s perfectly OK to joke about molesting someone’s sister. Truly, these right-wing blogs are society’s bastions of moral authority. Dan Riehl, another blogging Hussein doubter, responded today, “Fascinating. But let me be the first to say to the Left, before they lose themselves in glee, I don’t see that bloggers have anything to apologize for, nor do I see this story being at an end.” He and others now promise to check out Hussein’s record as a source — now that they have to admit that he actually exists. […]
[…] how far-right wingnuts keep me sane thanks to Buber’s I-thou dialogic, told Sadly, No! about my tragic childhood, oh and Libertarianism, where I come out of the closet regarding my misspent affiliation with Ayn […]