Surprise of the Decade
ABOVE: NRO’s Dan Foster (in the only uniform he would have worn had
he ever worn one, excluding, of course, ones he wore for “Trick or Treat”
People who read America’s Shittiest Website™ are, as it turns out, quite fond of a traitor and terrorist who murdered U.S. soldiers. Indeed some of them think that he’s America’s Best General. In a Memorial Day poll, a boatload of readers at America’s Shittiest Website™ voted for Confederate Robert E. Lee as America’s Best General
Given that an NRO editorial written by William B. Fuckley in 1957 cited the “cultural superiority of white over Negro” in explaining why whites were “entitled to take such measures as are necessary to prevail, politically and culturally, in areas where [they do] not predominate numerically,” the Confederate and racist yearnings of NRO readers should not, I suppose, come as an earth-shattering surprise.
The person responsible for putting together the poll, and including Lee as one of the choices, was armchair soldier and burning-hunk-of-man-flesh Dan Foster. He defended General Sherman’s exclusion and Lee’s inclusion because he didn’t want too many Civil War generals in the poll, an argument that would cut in the opposite direction unless you are a National Reviewer who gets all teary-eyed about the days when blacks worked for white people for free rather than scaring white people to death by walking around dressed in hoodies. I mean, why otherwise would Lee be on the list? He lost, he committed treason against the United States, and he fought for a shitty cause.
Personally my vote would have been for Sherman, had he been on the list, if for nothing else, for burning Atlanta to the ground.
Fritz!
I lost all respect for Lee when he started carrying around those inbred morons, the Dukes.
FUCK YOU.
On one hand, the poll is only asking (I assume, I ain’t gettin offa dis boat) to rate them for their generalshipness, eschewing their politics and etc. On the other hand, Lee was not a general of “America.” Unless you also allow for Isaac Brock, the Canadian General of the 1812 war as “American” by virtue of his being from North America as being an “American General.” Or Simon Bolivar for that matter.
I vote for General Mills.
Wait, I see a fairly important figure missing: Ike. Y’know, the guy who organized the Allies to destroy Germany. That guy.
This is clearly a scientamatific and well constructified poll and I think you are wrong to make fun of it just because they included a traitor, then 13% voted for him. Give them credit though; that’s still less than the 27%ers who think such leading lights as Michele Bachman, Sarah Palin and Rick Santorum are qualified to run the country.
Grant was actually the superior general in pretty much every way. He just had the problem of having a rep as a slovenly drunk (because he was) and butchering his own soldiers (because everyone did, but he did it with the biggest numbers. Lee, however, lost the highest percentage because he mostly thought to attack and use the Army of Northern Virginia’s reputation for invincibility and the troops’ morale to carry the day. That’s a good way to get a lot of people deadified). Lee was simply dignified and had a certain gravitas. He was also a very different general once Stonewall Jackson died and simply couldn’t win anymore after Chancellorsville. Contrast that with Grant, who cut Sherman off, took direct command over the Army of the Potomac, and just kept winning while his best subordinate also just kept winning, but with a completely different army a long distance off.
Lee, in fact, was a general in the US Army before the Civil War and founded, the US Army Corps of Engineers. For the life of me, I don’t know why Winfield Scott is in there; he was not particularly memorable despite the Mexican War. Eisenhower or Bradley would have been better choices than Scott. I am glad they didn’t include Douglas MacArthur who always considered himself God..
Eisenhower doesn’t count, he wasn’t a real Republican.
I believe Lee also had the benefit of a hagiographer/biographer in Jubal Early, who popularized the notion of Lee as the honorable gentleman and Grant as the slovenly drunk.
Visitors to Virginia can see the beatification of Lee in full swing. Someone unfamiliar with American history would be hard pressed to figure out that the South not only lost, badly, but that it fought FOR slavery.
In one museum, viewers are informed that Lee was adamantly against slavery, but that he was troubled over the economic instability that freeing the slaves would cost. He supposedly favored a gradual ending of the institution. So, hundreds of thousands of people were killed because of a disagreement over timing? Yeah.
<Lee, in fact, was a general in the US Army before the Civil War and founded, the US Army Corps of Engineers.
Nope. The highest rank he ever had in the US Army was Colonel. Winfield Scott offered to make him a full general and put him in command, but he went to Virginia instead, where he pushed a desk around for a while.
For the life of me, I don’t know why Winfield Scott is in there; he was not particularly memorable despite the Mexican War. Eisenhower or Bradley would have been better choices than Scott.
Hell, I’d choose Winfield Scott Hancock over Winfield Scott. Scott’s success in Mexico was largely based on the fact that his subordinates were, y’know, Lee and Grant and Longstreet and all those other guys. That may well have been one of the greatest collections of junior officers in military history.
Sorry to go OT so soon, but since this thread is going to be a massive pile of war pron I’ll just drop by this delightful alternate Time cover and then run away.
It doesn’t redeem him but the following story is a bit mitigating.
Unless it’s apocryphal, which could well be.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2001/09/0907_smithgenlee_2.html
Pershing and Patton? Really?
NRO continues to show that its writers consider education an impediment ot success. I’m kinda surprised they didn’t include Petraus as one of the choices along with the only other generals they had ever heard of.
Well at least they had enough of a grasp of reality not to include Custer.
Crazy Horse was a better tactician than any of them.
And where the hell is Nimitz? C’mon for some Navy love (V?R).
OBS, that is wonderful and horrible and can’t be unseen.
Pershing and Patton? Really?
I’ll agree that Pershing has no purpose on that list, but, um, Patton? He beat Rommel at his own game in Africa, then took Sicily, then pissed off his commanders so much that they sidelined him, but put him in command of a paper army made up of inflatable tanks that so terrified the Germans that they diverted a massive number of divisions away from the Normandy coast.
Then, when the Allies couldn’t push out into France, they brought Patton back and he ate up the French countryside like Gengis Khan and pushed the Nazis back so hard that Eisenhower’s only option was to stop sending him gas.
Yeah, I’d say Patton belongs on the list. If I was engaging in any sort of mechanized warfare I’d make him a top pick in the general draft.
Hell, if we’re talking navy where is John Paul Jones? (not the Zeppelin one)
Well, if we’re allowing generals who were generals before the founding of the United States to be “American Generals”—and I guess we are, because Washington’s on the list—then my choice isn’t on there. (And Uncle Billy isn’t there, either? WTF?)
If you had to credit one single general with the success of the American Revolution, there could only be one choice: Benedict Arnold.
(BTW: Hi, everybody. I’ve been taking kind of a mental health break from political news, trying to prepare myself for the last months before the election. Doubt if it’ll work, but oh, well.)
Does receiving a post hoc promotion to brigadier general count as being a general? If so and we’re including revolutionary war figures, why isn’t Kosciusko on the list? Or for that matter Pulaski?
Didn’t a certain GOP (although they are trying to deny that now) president once remind us not to forget about Poland?
Not to mention the fact that Lee, you know……………lost.
That should rule him out right from the start.
Pupienus–
The communion story is of dubious origins. It may have been one of Jubal Early’s embellishments. I’m not sure the provenance has been established beyond doubt either way.
In neo-Confederate lore, Lee is always presented as being against slavery and as more honorable and chivalrous than Grant or Lee. This story would definitely have played into that depiction.
Thanks for the shout-out to Sherman — my personal hero. I would probably still vote for Grant as the “greatest” on an overall basis, although the only real criticism I have of Uncle Billy is that he forgot to sow the ground of Atlanta with plutonium, so the friggin’ town is still there.
OBS, that is wonderful and horrible and can’t be unseen.
in the last thread where i was talking TO MYSELF i was bitching about he perfectly hideous taco salad i had for lunch (again, meat should not be in pellet form and wtf? with the random piece of bacon in it)…after looking at obs’ *offering* i really, really feel icky…
If you had to credit one single general with the success of the American Revolution, there could only be one choice: Benedict Arnold.
I hear he had a killer recipe for eggs…
I credit Cornwallis with winning the Revolution for the colonists.
From the very weird Michael Walsh item:
I guess the greatest commander-in-chief, then, doesn’t get to be FDR.
I guess the greatest commander-in-chief, then, doesn’t get to be FDR.
It must be Jefferson Davis.
I’m surprised at the dissing of Winfield Scott in this thread. Scott took a barely trained army and overcame a numerically superior Mexican enemy on its home ground, despite having to deal with jealous subordinates and superiors who treated him with outrageous shabbiness, even denying him supplies.
Granted, the cause for which he fought was not much better, from a moral standpoint, than Lee’s. But for sheer military accomplishment, I would stack him against almost any of the other generals discussed here.
And not having Ulysses S Grant is really just stupid. As well as Macarthur. Who I don’t even like, but who was a great general.
A Duh-Day of fail.
There were ten generals on the list, but I don’t think the NRO site contains the whole list any more.
I love that Washington won the poll. That pretty much tells you everything you need to know, doesn’t it? Of course Scott is on there so the Grand Unified Civil War Narrative can be preserved (inferior US generals defeated by CS equipoise).
As for pissing down Pershing’s leg – you really think Pershing couldn’t take Washington? Bitch please. We only really have the one significant general from our ill-considered sophomore turn as a colonial power; we might as well have the proper respect. With that in mind: why Washington and Pershing and Scott yet no George Dewey?
OBS, thank you for bringing that to our attention.
I think.
~
I think Omar Bradley should be on the list.
The idea on Polk’s part being to prevent any big damn heroes from emerging from his war crime. The joke’s on him, of course – that’s precisely what happened.
War is more than a just a blood-soaked chess match. Washington’s big accomplishment wasn’t so much in his military acumen, but his perseverance. He kept the army together in the face of serious defeats by the greatest military power of all time.
Oh, you’re very welcome.
It’s unfortunate that it’s just a drawing — a photo-manipulation would have had that perfect touch of vomit-inducing realism.
This is precisely why I’d vote against Washington – pretty much every idea he had about the war, except ‘I should prevent my men dying of smallpox in droves’, was an unforced error. His main function was to fill out a uniform handsomely and to be well-liked by his countrymen. There’s a certain corrupt pomo appeal to the idea that the ideal general is one who looks good for history – whether or not he, you know, wins – but it’s not the conventional measure of success.
And if we’re measuring the ratio of good PR to military accomplishment, Washington should in fact win out of the list we’re seeing – but Dewey, or maybe in a pinch Schwarzkopf, would be an improvement.
For the love of Jesus, don’t give the people here who actually are good at that stuff any ideas. There are certain things that just really shouldn’t be looked at.
Is there no love for Major General (and twice awarded Congressional Medal of Honor) Smedley Butler?
I’m glad the consensus is that the lack of Sherman is hilarious and stupid. I’d favor Longstreet over Lee (not requiring a Lost Cause hagiography to avoid going to his grave in infamy, for one) and Eisenhower over Patton, but that might just be my distrust for the flashy bastard.
Also, I imagine the wingnuts are furious and sad about the lack of Jackson and Forrest, while we’re on the Late Unpleasantness.
General Apathy is our most formidable foe. Now let me get back to my nap.
Great general = military intelligence = every other oxymoron you can think of.
EVERY general in the history of civilization was a complete glory hound and total sociopath (at least in executing their duties as a field marshall). The attraction to them as “great” people is really fucking sick. Sort of like thinking Hells Angels and mafia families and old west outlaws like Billyl the Kid are cool. They’re not. They’re shit people who are shitty. Hell, some people think MacArthur was a “great” man. I mean, he did smoke the shit out of a pipe and ham it up for the media while his marines were making the Bataan Death March. Then there’s the whole ‘nuke the chinks’ thing…yeah. Real fucking great.
IIRC, the Iroquois called Washington the “Town Burner”
Also you got to give Ike credit for keeping Monty and Patton in line and letting Bradley run the show for the most part. Politics in a situation like WW2 with multiple allies can be as important as tactics.
If you could combine my skillz with Substance’s predilection for making disturbing graphics, YOU’D CREATED A MONSTA!
I rate for General Anaesthesia.
Pfft, it’s obviously General Ripper. Dude got shit DONE.
George Marshal. Breaking things is easy, rebuilding them is hard.
Thanks for the shout out, Helmut, but the smedley household ain’t got no butler.
Also you got to give Ike credit for keeping Monty and Patton in line
i read that as ‘monty python’ which made me say ‘whuh?’
Why not give this one a touch-up?
General Buck Turgison!
Actually, that’s pretty
disgustinggreat as is.General Hooker gave us, well, hookers. That’s got to count for sumthin.
George Marshal. Breaking things is easy, rebuilding them is hard.
One of the many, many things that piss me off about Joe McCarthy is that he destroyed, through slander, the career of George Marshall, who did more to retard the progress of Communism during any randomly selected week of the Cold War than McCarthy accomplished in his entire wretched career.
The people who cheered and enabled McCarthy were the ancestors of today’s Tea Party (if not, in more than a few cases, the very same people). We spend entirely too much time in this country listening to utter fools.
General Hooker gave us, well, hookers. That’s got to count for sum thin.
Frank Miller declined to comment.
i got this from the comments on dildo dan’s post:
can you find the fail?
It would seem we haven’t had any outstandingly tactically wonderful generals since the end of WW2. We haven’t had any outstanding successes since then either (Grenada doesn’t count!). The only general I liked was the one who got the various battalion and unit commanders off my back when I was being a problem child, back in my Army days, in Germany. A very cool dude.
OBS, you are a bad muthafukkah for whipping that foulness out, here in front of your peers and all. The really disgusting thing about that bit of artwork, is, that it’s true.
One of the many, many things that piss me off about Joe McCarthy is that he destroyed, through slander, the career of George Marshall, who did more to retard the progress of Communism during any randomly selected week of the Cold War than McCarthy accomplished in his entire wretched career.
This. Not the first or the last career professional destroyed by the Red Scare; as I recall one of the reasons we were blundering around in the dark all through Vietnam was that most of the State Department’s Southeast Asia experts had been purged during the Red Scare.
A pattern repeated today, by the way, with the occasional attempted scandals from PJMedia alleging that the FBI and CIA and other alphabet agencies have been penetrated by the Muslim Brotherhood using its Political Correctness Powers.
The people who cheered and enabled McCarthy were the ancestors of today’s Tea Party (if not, in more than a few cases, the very same people). We spend entirely too much time in this country listening to utter fools.
And this.
Thank Christ we didn’t have these guys around in World War Two. I can just imagine Eisenhower spending the run-up to the D-Day invasion in Congressional committee hearings trying to explain to a bunch of mouth-breathers that despite the name “Eisenhower,” yes, he really is an American, no, he is not a secret German practicing taqiyya, etc etc etc.
Its no surprise to me that the outliers of society would choose the losingest general to admire the most.
It would seem we haven’t had any outstandingly tactically wonderful generals since the end of WW2. We haven’t had any outstanding successes since then either (Grenada doesn’t count!).
It’s hard to be a field general when your entire battle consists of lobbing metal at targets, then plowing the roads with troops.
It says a lot that the most brilliant military “strategy” of Iraq was pouring 50,000 more troops on the fire. (Odierno)
Regarding the accusation that Lee was a “traitor”. He had to choose between being a traitor to his local home or to his larger home. One might compare it to choosing to side with the US against the UN should the US decide one day to secede from the UN.
If by “the fail” you mean the fact that the UN isn’t a government and that officers swear an oath of loyalty to their country, not to their state or to the UN…
You know, it’s funny how wingnuts diss the EU as a futile and inherently inefficient exercise in “transnationalism,” yet they really want to go back to an era when the States of the Union interacted like thirteen separate countries vaguely bound together, rather than like one united nation.
It would seem we haven’t had any outstandingly tactically wonderful generals since the end of WW2. We haven’t had any outstanding successes since then either (Grenada doesn’t count!). The only general I liked was the one who got the various battalion and unit commanders off my back when I was being a problem child, back in my Army days, in Germany. A very cool dude.
Why wouldn’t the Gulf War be an outstanding success?
As for “tactically wonderful generals,” communications equipment being what it is these days, it seems to me that the generals out in the field in our day and age have much less automony than they did in the old days, and that the folks back home involve themselves a lot more in managing the battlefield than they used to. We’ll probably never see a Washington or a Grant or an Eisenhower again.
If by “the fail” you mean the fact that the UN isn’t a government and that officers swear an oath of loyalty to their country, not to their state or to the UN…
indeed…
also too, the bit about the both generals’ actions at the beginning of the war being commendable…i see nothing commendable about the south’s position…
Eh, what can I say? My folks taught me to share.
i see nothing commendable about the south’s position…
You don’t value personal honor above people’s lives and welfare? What kind of ‘merkin are you?
Why wouldn’t the Gulf War be an outstanding success?
That wasn’t a war – it was more of a beating.
Indeed, Suh. Ah demand satisfaction.
You don’t value personal honor above people’s lives and welfare? What kind of ‘merkin are you?
sirrah! i am not a ‘merkin! i am a mrcian! have a care!
You might put “military” in quotes there, too. It was solidly an occupation by that point. There was no opposing army, per se.
I think it’s unlikely America will ever have any noteworthy generals again because I think it’s unlikely America will ever be in another shooting war with a country that can fight back. (We’ve become craven and shitty in our dotage, like Britain.) While communications technology does reduce autonomy somewhat, it’d be silly to say it completely removes the capacity for generalship; Eisenhower and Zhukov won a war in which it was theoretically possible (if practically impossible) for their C in C to have direct two-way communication with their tank crews, and they did it with sufficient panache that there are now statues of them.
It was still pretty surprising to lose so few people in the course of an invasion.
Wikipedia says 139 American and 33 British casualties. Between then and 2009 in Iraq there were eighteen electrocutions in showers.
It was still pretty surprising to lose so few people in the course of an invasion.
We expected to lose quite a bit more than that. I had heard estimates as high as 15,000.
We got lucky. Either we were a lot better than we thought, or the Iraqis were a lot worse than we thought.
General Horner told us (4300 Provisional Bomb Wing) to expect to lose 6 aircraft (heck of a pep-talk).
We ended up losing just one – to mechanical failure.
The KC-135s were told to expect 20% losses on the first night.
Aircraft loss rates in the Gulf War were actually pretty close to Vietnam. It’s just that Vietnam lasted a heck of a lot longer.
What about that car insurance general? He has lots of stars and a penguin!
Wow, bbkf is renowned Irish show jumper Mr. Cian O’Connor!
Aircraft loss rates in the Revolution were quite good.
Is it because the folks who were making the estimates thought the Iraqis maintained the same level of readiness and training as the US forces? I mean if they thought the Iraqis were as well trained and as experienced as US air crews, they certainly would have thought they could put up more of a fight. In the first Iraq war, how many planes were brought down by Iraqi aircraft, How many were brought down by ground fire, and how many had mechanical problems?
One of my contemporaries in the Gulf War was complaining that his RF-4 was built in 1967.
I said “Oh, you have one of those new-fangled ones. My plane was built in 1957“.
We got lucky. Either we were a lot better than we thought, or the Iraqis were a lot worse than we thought.
At the risk of slandering an entire region, the Arab world isn’t exactly renowned for the quality of its regular armies (their governments have made sure of that, and not by accident).
Is it because the folks who were making the estimates thought the Iraqis maintained the same level of readiness and training as the US forces?
No, but we expected them to be close to the level of the Russians who trained them and provided most of their equipment.
It was also based on their performance during the Iran-Iraq War.
I’m not sure how many, if any, air-to-air kills the Iraqis achieved. Most planes were brought down by missiles or old-fashioned AA guns, which they had lots of.
Even so, if you get upwards of 200000 people running around with weapons and other dangerous equiment in an unfamilar place for a while I’d be surprised if there weren’t 172 deaths by mishap.
Okay, this is one of the few times I will be serious, if for no other reason I am a military history buff…
Robert E. Lee was an incredible general who was vehemently against slavery and a split in the Union. His hand was forced when the Southern politicians, who were hell-bent on denying that slavery was being dissed by every major nation at the time, decided they were going to secede from the Union and form a government no longer beholden to Northern interests. (As it turns out, their mindset was very similar to BushCo’s little Iraq fiasco in that they had no actual game-plan in place for if they ever were successful in seceding. Of course, it turned out there was no need as the Confederacy got their asses handed to them.) Lee’s home was in Virginia and he and his family stood to lose everything: It is one thing to be moralistic when the state isn’t threatening to confiscate your land and imprison you and your family over a principle (albeit an incredibly important one).
Now, I will be the first to admit that I’m pretty sure the NRO readership took NONE of this into consideration and were voting purely based on conservative principles. This is evident from the fact Pershing scored so low (I get the feeling the readership took a look at that and said, “Who?”) That said, calling Lee a traitor who killed Americans is way off base: He was screwed from the get-go.
I also take offense that you should be such a great admirer of Sherman and his march through Georgia. His actions may have hastened an end to the conflict, but only in the same way firebombing Dresden in World War II did: Through indiscriminate killing and needless suffering of innocent people. If you want people to view us as somewhat superior in our reasoning, you need to make sure you don’t make idiotic comments like those you did in support of Sherman. The conservatives do the exact same thing with their heroes Eric Rudolph et al.
Major Kong:
I remember that exact same “pep talk” and couldn’t believe we might lose some of our aircraft. When all of them returned that first night, huge celebration. Slightly smaller celebration after the second night. By the third night we had to ask ourselves, “Did this ‘combat’ get a little over-sold to us?” By that time we knew the Iraqi air defenses were pretty much non-existent and that this would become a land war.
???
Leaving your country and leading an army against it seems pretty fucking traitorous.
I’m not a big Scooby Doo fan, but this made me smile.
Wow, bbkf is renowned Irish show jumper Mr. Cian O’Connor!
i’m not sure about these ‘horse’ people…this letter i found on his site has some disturbing passages:
omg…all this talk of pony clubs and registering ponies makes me fear this young lady is heading down the wrong path…see what happens when there’s talk of legalizing ghey marriage?!?!?
Definitely smile worthy.
Some vans aren’t as cool.
I’m not a big Scooby Doo fan, but this made me smile.
ha…our hospital’s entry in local parades for the past few years has been a scooby doo theme…one of the docs donated his old hunting van which was turned into the mystery machine by the high school art classes and there were costumes of all the characters…their slogan was, ‘it’s no mystery where you should go for health care!’
now they have a dog for a mascot and are currently running a contest to name the dog…i was quite peeved earlier today when my clever entry was denied because i am TOO OLD!!! bah…anyhoo, i will always think of the mascot as ‘doggie bowser, md’…
Some vans aren’t as cool.
a while ago on ‘wait, wait, don’t tell me!’ there was a bit one of the panelists made up about a failing tv station and some of the segments they tried to get ratings…’the manly man stalker van’ was one such failed segment…
War is hell and to get people to stop fighting it, the support structure needs to be undercut. Hence Sherman on the list.
The firebombing of Dresden didn’t do what Sherman did.
sigh.
It is one thing to be moralistic when the state isn’t threatening to confiscate your land and imprison you and your family over a principle (albeit an incredibly important one).
This is the first time I’ve ever heard that the Confederacy threatened to imprison Lee and his family. As for his land, leaving aside the fact that he would certainly have got it back after the war, I’m sure that a Union general (which he could have been) could have adequately provided for his family in terms of finding them a place to live.
Lee put loyalty to his state over loyalty to his nation, not to mention over simple humanity regarding slavery. Pardon me if I find that less than admirable.
Substance McGravitas said,
May 31, 2012 at 20:51
If you could combine my skillz with Substance’s predilection for making disturbing graphics, YOU’D CREATED A MONSTA!
Why not give this one a touch-up?
Holy Guacamole!
I coulda used one almost like that for my Pantload-Kraphammer post.
~
I toured the Museum of the Confederacy in Richmond. Pretty interesting stuff. What really struck me was just how small most of these guys were.
I think I could have fit into Jeb Stuart’s uniform when I was maybe 12.
Why not give this one a touch-up?
Jan Svankmajer deserves more credit.
I toured the Museum of the Confederacy in Richmond. Pretty interesting stuff. What really struck me was just how small most of these guys were.
I think I could have fit into Jeb Stuart’s uniform when I was maybe 12.
this is why i usually haz a sad when i find vintage clothing…one of my fave things to wear! i no longer have the petite build for them, so they are few and far between…
If you’ve ever toured the tower of London, you’ll think the same thing about the suits of armor they have on display.
Why isn’t Horatio Gates on that list? Or Nathaniel Banks? Or Lloyd Fredendall? Or William H. Winder?
We’ve got the best military idiots in the WHOLE FUCKING WORLD!
A reasonably exact moral analogy but an off-base political one – which is to say it works, but only on exactly the wrong level. One of the legal principles of the Union army (which Lincoln occasionally demoted or relieved generals for ignoring) is that “the Confederacy” was a legal phantom, its army essentially an enormous brigand camp and its occupation of 11 US states and change what would answer to a “crime against peace” in the pre-Geneva era. The destruction of American infrastructure was de jure a political and not a military act, no more or less criminal or illegal than shuttering a highway or demolishing an old skyscraper – or, for that matter, hanging seccessionist francs-tireurs and jailing pro-CS agitators.
Yes, on a moral level Sherman did in fact kill and impoverish civilians, that’s the level on which the analogy functions – he was invading a territory ruled by a criminal conspiracy to hold human beings in slavery in defiance of the law. We’re not obligated to be happy that Sherman destroyed people’s lives and in so doing rescued those of others, and I agree that to a degree the celebration of Sherman’s most famous act is unseemly (he certainly thought so), but it’s going over the top to consider him a monster.
More broadly, Sherman’s scorched-earth masterstroke is mainly held in contempt as a way of softpedaling the case that the whole reconquest was illegal – here’s an obvious bastardry against Southern virtue, and now let’s talk about that butcher Grant. Ech.
Not vehemently enough to do anything personally about either, unlike a great many of his contemporaries. (And much less than modern history holds him to have been against either – other people have made the point about Early’s historiography.)
This is fundamentally a misstatement. Until 1860, Slave Power was not only in power but effectively had a monopoly on power so extreme that it frequently turned to extralegal methods to suppress the free-soil culture. History has often been written after Slave Power propaganda, and as such with the view that the CS seccession was a faction left in the cold being outraged once too often and splitting ways with its government – but the last decade had been a series of increasingly outrageous and illegal provocations. by Southern partisans. (Hell, the Popular Sovereignty doctrine was effectively a pre-Confederate invasion of free soil by Slave Power.) The secession was a scheme to remove the pliable, moderate Lincoln out of power no more sophisticated than Andrew Butler’s scheme to remove Charles Sumner – just bigger.
That’s the beauty of representing the power structure: you don’t need a master plan. Bush et al prospered immensely by the botched, disastrous invasion of Iraq (although Bush only with a guaranteed second term and the et al with more tangible gains), and they didn’t really have to lift a finger for their “people” or their “nation”. Similarly, I sincerely doubt Jeff Davis or even Robert E. Lee cared a great deal whether the pineys unwillingly dragged along in their illegal long-form coup lived or died – because by God, Slave Power was what was best for everyone.
And by “lose everything”, I’d like to make explicit what you don’t – a comfortable upper-class existence maintained by African slaves, both his own and inherited from his wife’s wealthy if debt-saddled family. I don’t doubt he would have freed the ones he liked in his will; that’s customarily the least noblesse can oblige. Lee would have been the only man of his military or economic stature I’m aware of to remain loyal to his country rather than his US senator, but as Lincoln’s shitty little veep makes clear it’s not the war of Southrons versus Yankees it’s made into now – it was a civil war fully in the modern sense of the phrase, and that most Southerners chose the wrong side doesn’t make it a matter of being born in the wrong culture, it makes it in part a matter of making the wrong choices.
Lee was a man who did bad things for a bad cause. He may have been a nice man, and an effective man, but refusing to condemn him is churlish at best and disingenuous at worst.
you’ll think the same thing about the suits of armor they have on display.
I’m pretty sure I could fit into Henry VIII’s armour, along with a couple of friends.
It is one of my favorite things that “swagger” has reestablished itself in the lexicon, and refers to the attitude in which Henry VIII had his portraits painted.
It is one of my favorite things that “swagger” has reestablished itself in the lexicon, and refers to the attitude in which Henry VIII had his portraits painted.
not only did he swagger, he was quite proud of his shapely calves…
[Checks Body Monstrosity Index…]
how Henry developed from a strapping and strong young athlete to an obese and flabby monster
they gotta cut the dude some slack…in later years he had some sort of boil or some such on his leg which was quite painful and inhibited excercising and other ‘activities’…also, he had a lot of shit going on…who hasn’t slacked off when there’s religious rifts to create and wives to behead and all the other mayhem and conspiracies of the court…
an obese and flabby monster
A few sentences later the author notes that Henry was sufficiently muscular to carry around upward of 45 kg when he swaggered around in his armour. Journamalism at its best.
Major Kong:
Were you on board a KC-135? My father-in-law flew on one in ‘Nam (well, way over ‘Nam).
has anyone heard the voicemail that was left at the sacramento rivercats’ front office from the old lady all pissed off about manny ramierez’ long hair? it is hi-larious…she links long hair to laziness, steroid use, gay marriage and abortion…it’s classic…but i can’t find it online except on the espn 1500 podcast from the show i originally heard it on…
Congratulations on not getting fit in 1540!
armchair soldier and cross-burning-hunk-of-man-flesh Dan Foster
Fixed that fer ya…
Henry VIII’s armor is also known for the ridiculously large codpiece.
Major Kong:
Were you on board a KC-135? My father-in-law flew on one in ‘Nam (well, way over ‘Nam).
I flew KC-135Rs in the Air National Guard from 1993 – 2006.
During the Gulf War I was flying B-52Gs.
Before that I was a T-38 instructor.
Congratulations on not getting fit in 1540!
Henry VIII aside, your average knight circa 1540 was probably in fantastic shape. They were like top athletes of today, training constantly. All that armor didn’t slow them down as much as you think it would.
The English species of journamalist is uniquely vile. Suffered a loss of RSS feeds recently so I’ve been downloading OPML files rather than gathering things feed by feed. The file of 348 English newspaper feeds here (which are mostly working) produces grotesque results.
All that armor didn’t slow them down as much as you think it would.
I vaguely remember reading somewhere that many suits of armor were not much heavier, and in some cases lighter, than a modern soldier’s gear.
GENERAL Lee?
My mistake. I thought somebody said SARA Lee.
I saw a lot of concerts with my buddy General Admission.
Er, Sir Craig, this is a *comedy* blog. When I say that admired Sherman for burning Atlanta, I’m not really saying that I approve of mass murder and property destruction, or that Atlanta should be burned to the ground again. It’s just a way of saying that I don’t like Atlanta or, for that matter, the rest of Georgia.
Of the six generals on this woefully inadequate and truncated list, I vote for Grant. The Vicksburg campaign was classic in its conception and execution.
———
Perhaps the excessive casualties estimates before the Gulf War were predicated on possible Iraqi used of chemical weapons. (Doesn’t explain the air mission estimates, of course. Iraq began the war with a modern and sophisticated air defense system, which had to be systematically taken apart.)
———
In my opinion the assessment of ‘generalship’ should be evaluated independently of political issues (e.g. whether Lee fought for preservation of slavery is immaterial to his skill as a general.) Keep the focus on the military situations and military decisions.
——–
Thanks to Tintin for providing a good hook for a different discussion than the more typical Sadly topics.
First time I went to Atlanta was in the ’70s and I thought it was a nice, friendly, cheap & livable city.
Been back maybe 10 times since then and didn’t really find it changed all that much. However, the last time I was there was 8 or maybe even 10 years ago…………..what’s been going on?
I took that post more seriously and at greater length than I normally would have because it exemplifies a position I disagree with, see made a lot, and wasn’t being made stupidly or dishonestly (or else why bother), but this gets closer to the heart of the matter.
To wit: the March to the Sea happened 148 years ago. Anyone old enough to have known people old enough to have even been alive at the time is now in their dotage: conceivably some people born in the 1930s might have hazy, distant childhood memories of beyond-senile relatives who knew who Lincoln was while Lincoln was alive.
So however tragic it was, for all intents and purposes it’s completely outside of the boundaries of living memory. And it’d be more important as a symbolic tragedy if there were anyone actually interested in burning Southern infrastructure to the ground except Southern state governments.
Should I be relieved that Nathan Bedford Forrest isn’t on that NRO list?
I am surprised they don’t rate for William Westmoreland.
Doughbob would have listed General Mills in the poll.
I mean, the lying, the total FAIL, its right up their alley.*
*mmmmmmmmm could be
In that same vein, General septicemia.
General Electric is the greatest EVAH!
Meh, who cares?
The General.
We don’t care what you think, and we don’t have to.
~
alec, I thought you stated the case well.
My favorite Sherman factoid is this: the song “Marching Through Georgia” followed him everywhere he went, and he hated it (less I gather because of his notorious distaste for what had to be done to win the war and more because he thought it was a shitty song). Genteel 19th-century political etiquette meant that everywhere he went people had to play it for him, and whenever they did he had to grimace through the whole thing and then thank his tormentors.
I vaguely remember reading somewhere that many suits of armor were not much heavier, and in some cases lighter, than a modern soldier’s gear.
Smut sez 45 kg., I think the average Yankee pig-dog baby-killer sports about 100 lbs. worth. And after research I find:
And it’s hurting them.
That’s nothing. Hell, it coulda been “Sweet Home Alabama”.
If St.Ronnie had ever played a general in the movies, he would have won the NRO poll.
Before that I was a T-38 instructor.
I hear those T-38s are tough to train, ’cause they just won’t listen.
Talking out of ass mode ON: It might also be that yer knights and such as were getting more protein to eat than the rabble they were chopping to pieces. If they grew up in the elite they might be bigger and more powerful to start with.
It might also be that yer knights and such as were getting more protein to eat than the rabble they were chopping to pieces and eating stir-fried.
Fuqqst.
getting more protein Heh-heh.
Oh, also: Probably pretty damn likely. The nobility reserved hunting “rights” to themselves, & I believe the penalty for poaching was often death. Your typical peasant was probably lucky to get a couple eggs worth of protein a wk.
Carbs for thee, meat for me, suckah!
Well, wait a minute, deus lo vult, right? You can’t disagree with that. That’s class warfare.
Help, help, it’s a jacquerie!
Alec deconstructed Sir Craig’s post better than I ever could, but I’m still in disagreement about one aspect of it. The portrayal of Sherman as some sort of monster committing untold atrocities as he marched through Georgia is pure Confederate revisionist bullshit.
The problem with most Confederate atrocity stories are that to anyone who’s lived through the 20th century, they just don’t sound all that atrocious. They all boil down to the fact that he didn’t “respect private property”. He was supposed to march a federal army through the heart of rebel territory and leave the populace perfectly free to continue growing crops and making munitions for the Confederate war effort. Can anybody reasonably expect this to have happened? His whole purpose was to make the war insupportable for the general population and destroy materiel that could have been used to support the rebellion.
The destruction caused a lot of suffering in the affected areas, but to accuse Sherman or his army of “indiscriminate killing” is just a lie. I’m not saying there weren’t unfortunate incidents here and there, but it was 1864, not 1964. Property destruction there was in abundance, but “indiscriminate killing”? No. This is part and parcel of the Confederate mythology that they’ve fed generation after generation with down there, but there is no reason for us to accept it just to keep them happy, like we have been for the last 150 years. They’re not happy, they’re never going to be happy living in a civilized country, and the sooner we stop enabling their lying bullshit, the better.
Really the Civil War was pretty “civil” by modern standards. The only atrocities that would fit the modern definition were committed by the rebels against black troops, by Nathan Bedford Forrest and others.
The portrayal of Sherman as some sort of monster committing untold atrocities as he marched through Georgia is pure Confederate revisionist bullshit.
I blame Gone With the Wind, and no I’m not joking. The image of feral Union troops looting got fixed in everyone’s head with that endless revisionist bore of a flick.
Fiddle-dee-dee.
Fiddling the dee-dee.
GWTW isnt that bad. At least Lloyd Marcus gets his face slapped when he starts losing his shit about not knowin nuthin bout birthin babies…
GWTW isnt that bad.
To be fair, I’ve never watched the whole movie. I always pass out from dehydration induced by projectile vomiting.
Smut sez 45 kg
The Guardian journofluff mentioned 42 kg. for the “foot combat armour made for 28-year-old Henry”, but according to the Royal Armouries that was twice the weight of ordinary war armour.
I hear those T-38s are tough to train, ’cause they just won’t listen.
You could certainly die in one easily enough.
Get a little slow and that tiny wing stops making lift and you drill a nice hole in the ground about 1/2 mile off the end of the runway.
Really the Civil War was pretty “civil” by modern standards. The only atrocities that would fit the modern definition were committed by the rebels against black troops, by Nathan Bedford Forrest and others.
It wouldn’t surprise me at all if Union troops had committed all kinds of crimes against civilians when they were down there. Not saying they were ordered to, but that’s what armies of occupation do. There’s no nice way to occupy land, and it provides opportunities for abuse that wouldn’t normally be there in civilian life.
What I find funny is that the same people who can’t shut the fuck up – one hundred and fifty years later – about the atrocities committed by DamYankees in their own country, apparently can’t bring themselves to believe that American troops might be behaving the same way in some of the countries we’re occupying now (or that it might be a bad thing if they are). These are the same guys who call you a traitor or accuse you of spitting on the troops if you so much as suggest that there might have been bad behavior from some of the American troops in Vietnam, Afghanistan or Iraq.
As for what happened to the South after the Civil War – certainly it wasn’t nice, and certainly innocent people suffered, they always do in war. Take it up with the pricks who decided to start that war, a group that didn’t include Sherman, Grant or Abe Lincoln.
I’d also be interested in seeing a comparison between the way Union troops behaved in the South and the way Confederate troops behaved on those occasions when they ventured onto Northern soil, like for Gettysburg. Somehow I suspect those Officer-Gentlemen weren’t always quite the humanitarians they’re remembered as, and not just towards black people.
Get a little slow and that tiny wing stops making lift and you drill a nice hole in the ground
I keep meaning to write a post for my blog about how physical forces and processes are inexorable and don’t care about human intent, and I keep getting distracted. You want to pinch hit for me on that?
I blame Gone With the Wind, and no I’m not joking. The image of feral Union troops looting got fixed in everyone’s head with that endless revisionist bore of a flick.
That and the entire Western genre. And other films too. Confederate Revenge Flicks may be the single most overdone blend of politics and action in the history of Hollywood. Shit, it seems more acceptable in the movies to criticize the U.S. Army than the Confederate one.
GWTW is a gorgeous movie and a classic for a reason, even if it is at times incredibly offensive.
Civil? To that I say “Andersonville.”
1964 was full of goodness for the American military.
GWTW is a gorgeous movie
True.
and a classic
One man’s Mede is another man’s Persian.
it is at times incredibly offensive
I’d have to be capable of watching it without my eyes spinning in their sockets to be offended by it.
True enough. I was thinking of operations, mainly. To be fair, some of the prisons rebel prisoners were kept in were no picnic (are they ever?) but at least they were—you know—indoors!
But at least they didn’t shoot Barbara Fritchie.
We were told to expect the biggest tank-on-tank (HAWT) clash since Kursk 1 & 2… That also didn’t happen (with a few exceptions), so that made us feel pretty good. About not dying.
Also, good Sherman story:
Friend of mine was traveling through Georgia with some college friends, when they got stopped for speeding.
State Trooper went “No-body speeds through MAH state like THAT!”
Voice from the back seat replied, “SHERMAN did.”
Trooper face turned red. Issued ticket.
Probably the best tactical general since World War II is Russel L. Honore’, who finally started fishing New Orleans out of the water, and didn’t blow shit up.
I rate for this guy
I keep meaning to write a post for my blog about how physical forces and processes are inexorable and don’t care about human intent, and I keep getting distracted. You want to pinch hit for me on that?
Sure. Happy to. Just let me know what you want.
Whoooaaa, there, wingnuts!
What about Leonidas, he was all about the democracy and the endlessly deeply wells and smiting the homos who weren’t Spartans and rippling pecs and such. And he spoke ‘mercian, it was in the documentary, so he was probably from Nashville…
To be fair, some of the prisons rebel prisoners were kept in were no picnic
I think Camp Davis near Chicago was about as bad as Andersonville. At least the Confederates had the excuse that even their soldiers were starving.
Just let me know what you want.
At the moment, onion and anchovy pizza.
For the blog, the idea I’ve been kicking around concerns the average person’s unfamiliarity with the way momentum, friction, and gravity (and turbulence, and overstress, and corrosion…) actually affect real objects. I first realized this while reading 9-11 truther crap, but it’s everywhere. Off the top of my head, I’d say that your experience as a pilot makes you as aware – if not more aware – of physical reality than me, and you probably have nice graphic stories about it.
My public email is NB64NB at gmail. I can make you (temporarily or permanently, as you wish) a collaborator so you’ll get your own byline.
Aw, he’s no fun.
Whale Chowder said,
May 31, 2012 at 18:19
Wait, I see a fairly important figure missing: Ike. Y’know, the guy who organized the Allies to destroy Germany. That guy.
WC, I’m sure that someone’s addressed this already (not read full thread yet), but the Allies were doing some sterling work on their own before the US showed up. Y’know, like the Poms and the Rooskies and the Frogs and so forth – they weren’t all milling around waiting for A Fine Amurkin general to lead them to victory.
Not to piss on Ike’s memory or anything, because from what i read he had some fine qualities, but he wasn’t solely responsible for the Allies’ victory.
For the life of me, I don’t know why Winfield Scott is in there
George C. Scott, maybe?
the Allies were doing some sterling work on their own before the US showed up.
Having just spent a holiday with my in-laws, let me repeat Alison’s point in a different manner: don’t EVER say to a Russian that the US was the reason for V-E. The Russian memory of losing 20 million people on the eastern front will last a long, long time.
I blame the Red Army for killing the thread.
You did specify that black people don’t count (because duh) but for my money it’d be pretty much impossible to beat the chivalry displayed by those gallant gentlemen at Fort Pillow.
I’d sort of imagine both sides would behave similarly. Gettysburg is an apples-to-oranges comparison because it represented the Army of Northern Virginia at close to its most poorly-supplied as an organized fighting force; the rules of war made pretty liberal allowances for forage, which ranged in niceness from paying fair prices for goods in specie to stealing at indirect gunpoint. This was considered basically unremarkable – in the literal sense, as in no one really felt fit to remark on it (unless it was to demand restitution from the authorities).
More uncommonly, outright pillage was condoned in the East by the odd general. My personal favorite case is in fact a Union brigadier-general, Ivan Turchaninov, who famously addressed his troops as they occupied Huntsville, AL with this simple statement: “For the next two hours, I close my eyes. I see nothing.” Controversial, but lauded by Lincoln and after his example by the Republican press.
Pillage was the rule out west rather than the exception, because the Western Theater was a hideous, ugly guerilla war which didn’t really fully end until the 1880s.
Long story short: it’s 90%+ about need. The remaining 10% was remarkably mild Union state terrorism and the horrible demons of the Confederacy unleashing themselves.
Most grimly, I would point out that the Confederates’ victories pretty much inevitably resulted in black people being reenslaved. They didn’t even necessarily have to be absconded or freed by the Union advance – someone in the CS army would inevitably and gladly take the opportunity to make a quick couple hundo selling a freedman with papers down the river to an auctioneer who didn’t ask too many questions.
The Russians certainly are in the right about that. If Stalin hadn’t purged their officer corps they would have kicked Hitler’s ass even faster.
No, Field Marshal Zhukov would have done just fine too.
The defeat of Nazi Germany was a joint effort between the ideological resources of international Communism and the deep pockets of centralized semi-market capitalism. De Gaulle cut a fine figure in his London flat, but the party of the 75,000 executed did a lot of legwork for him before he rode into Paris on an American tank.
Also, while the US obsession with their own role in liberating Europe has produced a lot of underestimation of the Russian war role, the Russians at the time were more than happy to see German armies tied up and German resources cut off by the advance of Allied forces, which proceeded at about the quickest pace militarily feasible. It’s an open question exactly how much more punishment the Red Army could have taken than it historically did.
Hitler was a purge-in’*, also. Too.
No pushy politician likes an uppity general.
~
Are you kidding? It’s one of those unhappy but tacitly accepted facts of history that Stalin’s officer purges created the climate in which Stalin’s insane defensive war was feasible. A kinder, gentler Stalin would have faced an officers’ putsch well before 1944 – you can’t just get an army in its right mind to give up a thousand miles and eight million men and keep struggling to advance.
It’s an open question exactly how much more punishment the Red Army could have taken than it historically did.
Not to mention, every jeep or boot or can of SPAM that arrived via Murmansk freed up a Soviet factory worker to build another T-34.
The Soviets did most of the dying, and most of the killing, but it isn’t at all clear that they could have won all by themselves.
On the other hand, I don’t think there’s any reason to believe the Western Allies could have won unless Hitler was busy bleeding himself white in the East…Well, at least they would not have won without Dr. Oppenheimer’s little science project.
If’n it weren’t fer American industrial might (General Motors) all them furriners woulda been up shit (or Nazi) creek.
It’s an open question exactly how much more punishment the Red Army could have taken than it historically did.
Not to mention, every jeep or boot or can of SPAM that arrived via Murmansk freed up a Soviet factory worker to build another T-34.
The Soviets did most of the dying, and most of the killing, but it isn’t at all clear that they could have won all by themselves.
All true, but in the context of generalship, I don’t rate delivering Ford trucks and Spam as highly as leading the guys with the rifles.
DOUCHE BURGER.
DOUCHE BURGER.
YOOOESSSAYYYY!
Fucked up the link and the joke still works.
MORE DOUCHE BURGER.
All true, but in the context of generalship, I don’t rate delivering Ford trucks and Spam as highly as leading the guys with the rifles.
Agreed.
Comparing generals is tricky, though. A US general, in 1944, contemplating a fortified objective would say, “Hmmm. It would cost us 10000 men to take that hill. We better find a way around, or call in air support.”.
General Zhukov, contemplating a similar objective would say, “Hmmm. It would cost us 10000 men to take that hill. ALLRIGHT BOYS, OVER THE TOP!”
Even among the Soviets, Zhukov seems to have been unusually bloody-handed, especially towards the end. Then again, he did save the world from a terminal descent into the rule by a monstrous barbarism, so I’m prepared to cut him a lot of slack.
Therein lies the problem with war fiction – that’s how wars are won and lost is Spam. After that comes political wangling, and then after that comes mooshing dudes with guns into each other. (Or, sometimes, ladies with guns. Ho there, Lyudmila Pavlichenko!) But first and foremost is Spam, and getting your gun-carriers to avoid shitting where they store it.
Also you don’t want any sexy people with an interest in the Eastern Front (ha ha ha) to hear you saying that trucks are less important than knowing where to put dudes with guns. In any other war, maybe, sure, but certainly not the war that made “mechanized infantry” a big ol’ meme.
I hadn’t thought of it that way. The Russian winter really helped them as well. All I know is that they lost a hell of a lot of people.
It’s the same as Grant, really: all Zhukov had an unconditional advantage in manpower. The last thing anyone who isn’t a fan of slaveries / holocaustings / Sandpoint, ID wants is for the right side’s one big useful advantage to be chivalrously tied behind their back.
Did you guys ever get that ‘thank you’ note we sent? Our mails is sometimes slow.
In more “diversity is teh debbil” news we have this: http://world-o-crap.blogspot.com/2012/05/minorities-are-disease-selwyn-duke-is.html
No Marshall? No Eisenhower? No Bradley?
Forget it, Jake – it’s
Chinatownthe NRO.Meanwhile … DOMA takes a gutshot.
Huh? Tacitly accepted by who?
How about General G. I. Brassbottom, “the greatest general since electric” courtesy of Roger Ramjet.
I hadn’t thought of it that way. The Russian winter really helped them as well. All I know is that they lost a hell of a lot of people.
Yes, they did lose a hell of a lot of people, which explains the Iron Curtain and the satellite states. American politicians, media, and the educational system have all ignored that fact for the past 65 years, but when you look at the Soviet war dead and the fact that the two most destructive wars of the 20th century were launched from Germany which is pretty close to Russia’s neighborhood, it’s immediately understandable why Stalin (and his successors) felt the need for a buffer zone. But it was easier to portray the eastern European land-grab as the result of EVIL and because the Soviets hated freedom than it was to just say, “this is understandable in light of 20 million dead, even though we don’t agree with it.”
I’ve never encountered someone who was confident the Red Army would have survived the no-retreat policy without everyone, top to bottom, being in mortal terror for their lives. It’s possible, probably even likely, that the war would have been prosecuted better by someone who wasn’t a paranoid fucking lunatic, but if Stalin had only spontaneously become a paranoid fucking lunatic in 1941 he would have had way less company.
¡El General!
You’ve never encountered anyone who thought it was a bad idea to shoot most of the best generals in the Red Army a year before the outbreak of the largest war in human history?
Maybe I’m not understanding you. Are you saying that there actually historians walking the earth today who defend Stalin’s purge of his officer corps? Who?
Speaking of shocking tactical blunders …
Oh no, not bubbles!
No, no. My position is that the purge and the war as prosecuted were two sides of the Stalin coin, and the Russian victory as it was won involved and required history’s most effective use of dictatorial terror. You have to remove Stalin’s purges and Stalin’s total war at a stroke, not just one or the other. I don’t know if that’d add up to a war Russia could win – probably, I guess.
A nicer Stalin would have done nobody any good and still would have killed a lot of people. (Trotsky and Lenin both have a lot of blood on their hands, but only for brief and exceptional periods convinced anyone they would be killed if they so much as showed fear.)
The other thing is that I’ve stacked the deck for myself by basically saying you have to remove Stalin to see a significantly different history, because it’s hard to see anyone making the mistake Stalin did by insisting on the inviolability of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact. It’s hard to even understand why Stalin did. That single blunder probably cost more Russian lives than if he had killed everyone over corporal and started the officer corps over from scratch in 1940.
The vuvuzelas seem over the top, but we all remember South Africa’s stunning upset victory in the 2010 world cup.
http://blog.mcnaughtonart.com/2012/05/mcnaughton-and-troy-talk-about-obama.html?tw_p=twt Talk with the “artist” about issues of war and birth certificates or not.
Did “The Forgotten Man” come before or after the painting of Obama burning the Constitution? Because I was hoping maybe the latter represented a move away from his seeming compulsion to throw literally everything into allegorical paintings at once. (One imagines if he had been commissioned to paint Washington crossing the Delaware he would have added George III with lady-parts emerging from swamp water labelled “TRAITORS”.)
I keep meaning to write a post for my blog about how physical forces and processes are inexorable and don’t care about human intent, and I keep getting distracted. You want to pinch hit for me on that?
History shows again & again
How nature points out the folly of men
I can’t help thinking that asking the NRO readership to rank historical figures in terms of military prowess is like asking a panel of small furry animals to choose the best quantum theoretician of the 20th century.
I’m not sure where it originated, but there’s an old saying in the military that “Armchair generals talk tactics, real generals talk logistics“.
Some tittyfucking idiot gave the kid next door a vuvuzela.
And you think you’ve got unbearable neighbours?
Scarcity, but not of spirit!
Busy week. This weekend is the rally, also, too.
Keep the faith, and pet the kittehs!
.
You know who’s a douche? SUBSTANCE “NOT HIS REAL NAME” MCGRAVITAS.
Because I got so damn engrossed in reading about the Douche Burger, I didn’t pay attention to where I was setting my coffee, and spilled it all over myself. GRRRRRRR.
In honor of logistics, let me nominate General von Steuben for his Revolutionary War work.
This weekend is the rally, also, too.
Looks like fun, JP!
Not sayin’ nothin’.
there’s an old saying in the military that “Armchair generals talk tactics, real generals talk logistics“.
This. Logistics isn’t sexy. Spare parts, fuel consumption, ammo re-supply, combat loading, maintenance. B-o-r-i-n-g unless you want to drill down into the constraints of military operations. Logistics determine what is possible for a general.
What makes for a great general officer? Is it winning battles? Utilizing forces for the greatest impact on the war effort? Getting your troops to outperform expectations? Being judged by history in one’s ability to capture the imaginations of generations of admirers?
None of these. It’s WAR we’re talking about. Teh greatest general is teh one with teh longest PENIS.
That said, all Civil War generals suck and should be ranked near the bottom of the list. Far and away the greatest killers in the American Civil War were disease and infection. Deployment caused moar casualties than enemy action.
Example: In the Gulf War, the left flank armor assault was only possible because of the fuel and ammo stockpiles that had been painstakingly built- up in the desert behind the front.
Logistics assumes an even greater importance in inhospitable and/or poorly roaded environments. Stragetically, WW2 operations in North African were largely logistical battles, where the key weapons were lowly lorries and deuce-and-a-halfs. (But…but…but Tigers and Shermans are sexy!)
Current example: US logistics in Afghanistan is enormously expensive and vulnerable to both military and political interruption. The only ground supply route is through Pakistan and through the Khyber Pass…with the Pakistani Taliban’s lands running alongside for much of its distance. This route has been closed by attacks several times, and also by the Pakistani government when they’re pissed.
Much of the resupply is from airbases in countries north of Afghanistan; this route is also subject to political closure, as governments ‘renegotiate’ leases (i.e. blackmail for more $$$). Moreover, air resupply is enormously expensive. And the wear and tear on vehicles–especially from dust in engine parts–is high.
Logistics. Yet another reason to get the fuck out of Afghanistan pronto.
I always get a laugh at Washington being praised for his military acumen and skills. His only real achievement was the surprise Christmas Day attack at Trenton, a battle of little strategic value although something of a morale booster for the colonial army, or what was left of it. For the rest of the war, his “genius” mainly lay with avoiding battles with British forces which, in his case, was probably the best way to a avoid catastrophic defeat, while the French Navy trapped Cornwallis and starved his army into surrender. Even when the French had the British weakened and helpless, Washington could still not be talked into attacking to give the American forces at least an active part in ending the war. In the end, Cornwallis surrendered without a shot being fired. I suppose that was good for our side but the British never really felt defeated and another war had to be fought with them 30 years later to do that.
I suppose that was good for our side but the British never really felt defeated and another war had to be fought with them 30 years later to do that.
I thought we pretty much lost the War of 1812? Sure, we weren’t turned back into British colonies, but I don’t recall that being part of Great Britain’s war aims.
We got out butts kicked when we tried to invade Ontario and then Washington was burned in retaliation.
I think the only major battle we actually won was fought after the peace treaty had already been signed.
We burned LEAFS SUCK to the ground. I don’t think that counts as winning a battle, but it’s one we didn’t manage to lose.
All these. Losing battles is hardly a disqualification, though. (In my estimation, one of the marks of good generalship is the ability to conduct a retreat well.) I rate dependability and reliability high; brilliant but erratic doesn’t cut it (for me anyway). Ability to learn from mistakes. Motivating the troops–by whatever means–most definately affects my estimation.
I also distinguish between C-in-Cs and subordinates. For example, I wouldn’t apply the same standard to both Napoleon and his marshals.
((Best marshal, btw: Davout))
That said, all Civil War generals suck and should be ranked near the bottom of the list.
I’d say the same about pretty much every WWI general from any given country. It was just varying degrees of suckitude.
Haig was such a moron that he thought if he took 50,000 casualties in an attack that the Germans must have taken at least that many. For that reason he actually liked seeing high casualty numbers.
vacuumslayer said,
June 1, 2012 at 13:04
You know who’s a douche? SUBSTANCE “NOT HIS REAL NAME” MCGRAVITAS.
Because I got so damn engrossed in reading about the Douche Burger, I didn’t pay attention to where I was setting my coffee, and spilled it all over myself. GRRRRRRR.
He is history’s greatest monster!
~
He is history’s greatest monster!
Now that John Edwards has escaped the cliffotine.
We burned LEAFS SUCK to the ground. I don’t think that counts as winning a battle, but it’s one we didn’t manage to lose.
Whatever. You do realize that LEAFS SUCK was your consolation prize since apparently all y’all were too askeered to try for Kingston. That plus, I’d bet moar Canuckistanis than Mercians cheered teh burning of LEAFS SUCK. SRSLY, not that popular a town here in teh Grate White North.
I like LEAFS SUCK. It’s kind of like New York – minus the attitude.
doucheburger=eck
suezboo: awesome use of ‘tittyfucking’…well done!
also too, i agree with vs…gwtw is a GORGEOUS movie…but as a good liberal, i like to practice a bit of revisionist history and truly, truly enjoy this much better….
and just because i do enjoy it so, here’s the first part…
Sorry, Major: Nothing personal. but you’ve hit “pet peeve” here. The “conventional wisdom” most people absorb is that we pretty much lost the War of 1812, but that’s complete and utter bollocks.
The British tried to invade the US by four different routes. Commodore Perry annihilated them on the Great Lakes. This enabled an invasion of Canada which turned out to be a fiasco, and that’s all anybody remembers.
Then they tried Gentleman Johnny Burgoyne’s route down the Lake Champlain corridor and were completely defeated and turned back at Plattsburgh.
Next they tried to invade via Chesapeake Bay. They took one look at the forts at the entrance and decided to go on a little lark behind the lines and burn Washington—which wasn’t defended, being of no military value. When their fun was over, they still had to get back on their ships and try to pass the forts, in which endeavor they failed miserably.
Finally they tried invading up the Mississippi and had their asses handed to them by Andrew Jackson at New Orleans. The battle of course took place after the war was officially over, but no one there knew it. So that’s all anybody remembers about the whole war: “We won the Battle of New Orleans, but only after the war was over! Ha. ha, stupid Americans!”
The fact that the British failed completely in all their attempts to attack us, and the humiliation they suffered on the high seas from our frigates and privateers, makes it hard for me to understand how this legend developed that we effectively lost the War of 1812, but that seems to be the conventional one-sentence conclusion everybody learned in school.
Sorry, rant over.
I hear those T-38s are tough to train, ’cause they just won’t listen.
That’s what you get when you try to train a freedom fighter.
Obviously, the British won the War of 1812. We’re all speaking and writing in English, aren’t we?
Obviously, the British won the War of 1812. We’re all speaking and writing in English, aren’t we?
Fol për veten tuaj, mik.
Comic nerds–it’s ok. You can come out, now.
From the “artist” link: It’s difficult to simply throw out one sentence antidotes to heavy questions
An-TI-do-tees, Greek for anecdote.
The usual summary of 1812: The british won, the ‘Mericans tied, and the Natives lost.
Then they tried Gentleman Johnny Burgoyne’s route down the Lake Champlain corridor and were completely defeated and turned back at Plattsburgh.
I spent a week in Plattsburgh one day. That town could defeat anybody.
Omg, Carol Burnett. National treasure.
No longer pretending: http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/05/31/492796/white-supremacist-with-ties-to-neo-nazi-groups-elected-to-pennsylvania-county-gop-committee/
No longer pretending: http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/05/31/492796/white-supremacist-with-ties-to-neo-nazi-groups-elected-to-pennsylvania-county-gop-committee/
Waiting for Lloyd Marcus to explain to us how this is somehow still totally the party of Abe Lincoln and black people should be ashamed of themselves for not voting for it.
whoa…i clicked on tsam’s link and after reading about teh ghey green lantern (although, being gay, one would hope the green lantern would choose a different color than green …i was hoping for something like the jade lantern or the chartreuse lantern or even the kelly green lantern)…anyhoo, further down the page i found this item which might qualify as the most horrifying thing i’ve read ever:
MORE DOUCHE BURGER.
Shouldn’t a douche burger be spritzed with water and vinegar?
Just askin’…
Omg, Carol Burnett. National treasure.
and just to show what kind of a dork i was/am, in like 7th grade, my bestie and i NEVER missed carol burnett…we would imitate norma desmond (our fave) and just crack up…and ‘miss starlet! miss starlet! miss starlet!’ never failed us either…nor did ‘he’s completely holLOW!’
more than 30 years later, i could recite one of those lines and she would totally lose it…
people thought/think we’re weird…
I like LEAFS SUCK. It’s kind of like New York – minus the attitude.
What fucking attitude?
Shouldn’t a douche burger be spritzed with water and vinegar?
more importantly, it should relieve you of that not-so-fresh feeling…
bbkf – What about “Miss-us A-Whiggins”?
bbkf – What about “Miss-us A-Whiggins”?
omg…yes! she and mr. tudball! and of course, mama and eunice…geez…it’s just pure comedy gold, isn’t it?
tcbs was and remains the only ‘old’ show that i can consistently watch and still die laffing to…
In honor of logistics, let me nominate General von Steuben for his Revolutionary War work.
Don’t forget the big beer bash in Central Park.
You beat me to it, Fenwick— LOGISTICS.
A little known fact about the War of 1812 is the use of squirrel guns and alligators as weapons as is sung about in “The Battle of New Orleans”— a song written and performed by Johnny Horton (the guy who wrote and sung that song):
It doesn’t have the majesty of Tchaikovsky being performed by an orchestra but, as you can see in the video, country never looked so gay.
country never looked so gay.
indeed! but it has looked scarier… ala sherwin linton…
The innovative use of reptiles gave the Americans an all-important technological edge.
Sorry, rant over.
Uh, didn’t you guys declare war on us? That teh British were repulsed in their attacks on American soil really don’t make no nevermind. In fact, in regards to late 18th century, early 19th century cross-border shenanigans, wasn’t that mostly you guys exercising the sentiment that developed into Manifest Destiny.
Wiki tells me that impressment continued after the Treaty of Ghent. Also Wiki supplies this Jefferson quote:
I’m of the belief that there are no winners in War, but if there was a bigger not-winner in the years of 1812 to 1814 – okay Native Americans first. Followed by Napoleon. And that second point makes it really hard to argue that Britain ended up worse off than teh US.
Elsewhere on the toobs, TBogg asked for, and received, the long-anticipated shitstorm from FDL dead-enders.
The innovative use of reptiles gave the Americans an all-important technological edge.
Close the Gator Gap! Vote Pitt!
OT – we’ve been adopted by two cats. Wait, maybe I can make it topical by figuring out which one is teh better general.
The British refused to discontinue impressment as part of the peace agreement, but after 1815 they were very careful not to seize any sailors who claimed to be US citizens.
We burned LEAFS SUCK to the ground.
…………… & nothing of value was lost.
Heh heh … Toronto isn’t really known as LEAFS SUCK up here, you know – no, the term most Canuckistanis usually use is The Asshole Of The Universe (a derivative of the older & more affectionately sarcastic The Centre Of The Universe).
I’d bet moar Canuckistanis than Mercians cheered teh burning of LEAFS SUCK
I’d bet close to even numbers of us were either pitching in a few blazing torches ourselves or selling flints & kerosene – all at a politely discounted price, eh?
Pretty similar story as to the attitude in Yankee communities too, though – ye olde rabble on both sides really hated them some gentry pooftah fuckers VERY VERY HARD back then. Seems some crazy French had given the Lower Orders in many lands some very intriguing ideas about selective cranial estrangement as a performance-incentive for said gentry a while back. Also likely didn’t help much to pump up any patriotic fever that the War Of 1812 was – in its prelude, execution & aftermath – one of the most nakedly full-bore Graft-O-Tron™ put-up jobs EVAR committed by humans.
Just think: a few more Benedict Arnolds and the folks in the colonies to our south would have decent medical care. Mind you we might all share the blame for Celine Dion.
Item: Cats are not very good at Stratego. Am trying to find appropriately sized military uniforrms to see which one is more inspiring in full dress.
That was just as sad, sad, spectacle. Kinda sad/funny in the way watching somebody walk into a glass door is both sad and funny. Mostly funny though.
They tend to do better at “Risk”.
I tried playing Power Grid with my cat but he got bored with all the counting.
expecting an ahem, he said,
The NRO tools were probably voting for this.
Horton, a school administrator, wrote that song for pedagogical purposes. He was concerned US students didn’t know their national history well enough.
I don’t know how it could be channeled into a military strategy or tactic, but my cat is very good at racing me up the stairs, even after giving me a seven or eight step head-start.
Item: Cats are not very good at Stratego
You need a more fast-paced game of world conquest. Try “Blitzkrieg”
Cats are not very good at Stratego.
They tend to do better at “Risk”.
The only winning strategy at Risk is to seize Irkutsk as early as you can and hold on to it for dear life.
Start yelling “CHARGE IT!” as you do it. No wait, that was Wilma and Betty.
They tend to do better at “Risk”.
I have only just met these cats. If they end up eating game pieces and get their colons blocked with 10 army pieces, their previous human companion may return from upside-down land to exact revenge.
Thanks, bbkf, I keep trying to do my bit to keep it in the lexicon. “Paul” was triffic, no?
Re Tbogg’s Very Serious Thread : I agree, sad. Who are these strange “progressive” people? It seems to them it’s all an intellectual game such as we all played while still at college, instead of a genuine wish to have people’s lives made better by decent policies. They talk about the masses but don’t give a shit about people.
These things like elections are about Real Life (TM).
I should prefer NOT to discuss SAfrica’s government. *draws herself up primly*
The innovative use of reptiles gave the Americans an all-important technological edge.
I’d prefer to unleash the furry: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jpl3k/1992861119/
In honor of logistics, let me nominate General von Steuben for his Revolutionary War work.
His work with glass puts him at the top for me.
I’d prefer to unleash the furry
NOOOOOOOOOOO!.
I like Sherman’s style. He sent this to Lincoln upon taking Savannah: “I beg to present you as a Christmas gift the city of Savannah.” Savannah was evidently too beautiful to burn.
“The only winning strategy at Risk is to seize Irkutsk as early as you can and hold on to it for dear life.”
Even if you put that in terms a cat could understand: “Now listen up. You hold onto that mouse as if it is the last meal you’re going to get,” the cat is going to let that mouse go.
Savannah was evidently too beautiful to burn.
It still is. That didn’t stop his troops from trashing and mixing up a lot of the grave markers in the Colonial cemetary. They’re still trying to figure out where Button Gwinnett is… OTOH, not burning is good.
Mind you we might all share the blame for Celine Dion.
Did Substantial Gravy (IF that is his real name!) say…
Celine Dion?
~
Synchronicity.
PENIS. Or is it?Is it gravy or sauce?
What about General Atomics?
The only winning strategy at Risk is to seize Irkutsk as early as you can and hold on to it for dear life.
Wouldn’t you be better off with Greenland? That allows you to attack either hemisphere.
What about General Conduct?
Is it gravy or sauce?
Looks like there’s plenty of room for another entrepreneur to get started in the third storefront.
There’s gravy, chicken…hmm what else might fit? Rocky Mountain Oysters™?
~
Don’t forget General Jeff.
Observations thus far indicate that General Alpha Cat has good instincts and a masterful control of the ground game, unfortunately she has absolutely no appreciation for Air Superiority. General Other One on the other hand is leveraging special forces and the element of surprise to increase her Force Multiplier. Am beginning to think I have named them wrong way around.
DKW, proceed with caution. Sometimes the most alpha of kittehs will lull the unsuspecting into a false sense of security by being all purry and such. They are simply waiting for the opportune moment to unleash overwhelming power. (This usually involves massive hissing/snarling directed at other kittehs or equally massive cuteness unleashed on humans.)
General Strike and General Election?
General Mills and General Motors?
General Chaos and General Confusion?
General Issimo.
Okay, General Strike (for an alpha) and General Motors (for quickness and speed.) Also, General Anesthesia for longest cat-napper.
Also, I’ve often thought of purring kittehs as having their ‘motor running’. In any event, whatever monikers attach, let us know, okay?
General I. Sation
General Al Jenner
General Jenn Earl
General Court Martial
SRSLY, not that popular a town here in teh Grate White North.
Really? I’ve never been, but every American I know who has, comes away raving about the place.
To clarify, these are middle-aged kittehs. I suspect that I have missed teh window where naming them Alpha Cat and Other One would have any impact on them.
Really? I’ve never been, but every American I know who has, comes away raving about the place.
Truly, Canoodlians hate LEAFS SUCK with the passive-aggressive indifference of a thousand suns. We pretend not to notice, telling ourselves that they are just jealous, and then cry silently into the wee hours when we think no one’s looking while muttering “we are World Class” over and over again.
It’s all context. It’s a great city, but Canadians outside Toronto are bitter about it being the financial and cultural centre of the country. The various whiners have yet to put a place together that comes close to it in anglo Canada.
So it’s sort of the Canadian equivalent of New York City?
i was hoping for something like the jade lantern or the chartreuse lantern or even the kelly green lantern
I rate for celadon.
Ol’ Hickory said we could take ‘em by surprise
If we didn’t fire our muskets ’til we looked ‘em in the eyes
Obligatory xkcd.
Wait, I thought the financial and cultural center of the US was Lubbock?
Sure, while keeping in mind that New York City is the Canadian equivalent of New York City, and that there are no cities in the country outside of Montreal that can compete with Toronto for greatness. The US is full of cultural capitols of various kinds, while we have two and one of those represents itself in French.
If you’re an American living in a bunch of other cities outside New York there’s a whole lot to be proud of.
I used to travel to LEAFS SUCK for business pretty frequently. (My biggest client was a company I better not mention because you surely hate them and might blame me for some of their more heinous offenses) I always found it charming, in a provincial sort of way.
Montreal, hoo boy they really are (the average American sterotype of) French aint they? Only good thing about the town is Le Smoked Beef Sandwich at Schwartz’s.
I like Montreal and Toronto both very much: there’s a lot going on in both places. Especially Montreal right now.
Montreal, hoo boy they really are (the average American sterotype of) French aint they?
Are they nicer to you if you speak French?
I have never had a problem being an Anglo: been for business and pleasure a buncha times.
Are they nicer to you if you speak French?
There’s speaking French, and then there’s speaking Quebecois… Speaking the former wouldn’t necessarily help you in Montreal 😀
OT – we’ve been adopted by two cats. Wait, maybe I can make it topical by figuring out which one is teh better general.
speaking of cats and adoption, here is an idea of just what kind of hick area i live in…my mater and i were out shopping today and we were over in south dakota at the nearest “big town” which has a population of about 3,000? anyhoo, we went to one of the second hand furniture stores which is run by a religious outfit cuz we had never been there before and i’m in the market for some end tables…so, we pull up out front and the place looks deserted but there is a sign on the door which has 5 gallon bucket of gravel holding it shut…so i go up and see if they are open…yes, they are…not a soul in sight in the shop, but some kick ass furniture at freaking dirt cheap prices…the sign on the door said: please put bucket in front of the door…a pregnant cat keeps trying to get inside…ick!
Onwards with the letter B:
See Jungle! (Jungle Boy) ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Bow Wow Wow
Across the Alley from the Alamo | Bob Wills and his Texas Playboys
The Yodeling Ghost ||||||||||| Bing Crosby and the Andrews Sisters
Shaolin Style (Nero Remix) |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Bar9
Bodhisattva Vow ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Beastie Boys
Pad Sest Ekki Saetari Mey |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Björk
The Three Shadows (Part I) ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Bauhaus
I'm Gonna Love You Too ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Blondie
There Must Be Little Cupids... |||||||||||||||||||||| Billy Murray
Don't Lie To Me ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Big Star
Red Sky ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Baroness
Free At Last ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Barry Adamson
Vocal Outtakes (Bonus Track) ||||||||||||| Brian Eno & David Byrne
Beatnuts Forever |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Beatnuts
Trav'lin' All Alone |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Boswell Sisters
Absent Friend ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Bark Psychosis
Crash Burn |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Blues Traveler
Feed of Man |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| Billy Bragg & Wilco
Jack O'Diamond Blues ||||||||||||||||||||||| Blind Lemon Jefferson
Remix for P is Free |||||||||||||||||||||| Boogie Down Productions
I’ve gotten rid of a bunch of Blue Oyster Cult because they kinda suck.
I’ve gotten rid of a bunch of Blue Oyster Cult because they kinda suck.
SMcG is trolling again.
Dude! I’ve got all sorts of Birthday Party and they’re Australian like you!
No Bad Brains!?!
Dude! I’ve got all sorts
you have all sorts?!?!? save me some, please?
Hey, that Bjork one is a show tune.
Gee. You know, I’ve listened to a buncha Bad Brains and seen them live, but I don’t think I’ve ever owned anything by them. Good call.
Thanks! On the subject of “bad” I also rate for some Bad Religion too and also.
Got a bunch of Bad Religion, so yeah.
No Martin Bormann?
Got some Burzum if that counts.
So it’s sort of the Canadian equivalent of New York City?
But far less provincial in outlook toward the rest of the world. :-}
Also, even if Leafs Suck, the Blue Jays don’t. They just swept the Oreos.
No Beatles? No Byrds? No Band?
Now you’re just making stuff up, those can’t possibly be real band names.
Gram Parsons is no Bing Crosby.
Alice in Chains is no Alice in Wonderland.
Are they nicer to you if you speak French?
They’ve always been nice enough to me. Most of them are so bilingual that they would rather speak to you in English unless you’re very fluent in French.
I’ve heard them shift from French-English-French in the same sentence.
I’ve heard them shift from French-English-French in the same sentence.
My relatives from Greece would do that constantly.
I’ve been to Leafs Suck, Montreal, Quebec, Ottowa, Winnipeg, Edmonton, Calgary, Whistler, Vancouver and Victoria.
My favorites are Vancouver and Victoria. Vancouver is like a smaller, nicer version of Seattle.
Calgary looks like Denver and feels like Texas.
Winnipeg and Edmonton are OK in the summer but ass-biting cold in the winter.
Ottowa is beautiful in the fall. The foliage puts New England to shame.
Montreal has some great bike paths.
The old city in Quebec is really nice.
Leafs Suck feels like a nicer New York or Chicago.
This has been my 5 minute Canadian travel guide.
I meant they would do that in Greek, of course. Although I had an aunt from Greece who could say merci beaucoup and was very proud of it.
Just got back from Victoria, and visited the Royal Museum there.
They have on display a timeline of newspapers with articles about the island there, one of which features this assessment:
“Victoria is where old people travel…to visit their parents.”
Maybe that’s why we enjoyed it. I’m getting to be an old people. Weather was beautiful, people were friendly, food was good.
The best air show I ever did was at CFB Bagotville in Saugenay Quebec.
There was a beer in my hand before I ever made it down the crew ladder, and the beers just kept on coming for the whole weekend.
As a result the few youngsters produce a lot of weird or angry music.
OT backyard wildlife update: did you know that male squirrels have HUGE balls? Apparently they only fully descend when there’s a nearby female in heat, but when they do…they’re packing major cojones. I mean, so major that my tamest male looks like he’s got a butt between his legs when he stands up.
He’s putting them to good use, too. I saw a couple of them doing it in the back yard this afternoon, so about 3 – 4 months from now, there will be some little squirrelys running around.
My original squirrel, a young female, gets tamer and bolder. A couple of days ago she finally satisfied a bit more of her curiosity about the cat…cat was sitting with her tail lying straight out behind her on the patio floor, squirrel is walking around cat to come over to me, and stops to sniff the end of the cat’s tail. And this time, the cat let her do it – Eartha just watched her and never made a move.
The cat has been asserting her authoritah a bit more lately, though – she’s taken to making a crazy run around the back yard to scare all the squirrels up into the trees; yesterday she made a run at one, it went up a tree, and then Eartha decided to sharpen her claws on the tree – while looking up at where the squirrel was sitting. That squirrel barked and bitched about it for the next hour.
Another fun chipmunk fact: not only do they kill and eat snakes, they can climb way up in trees. While the squirrel was bitching at the cat, I heard a chipmunk join in with shrieking. Kept trying to see where the chipmunk was – finally spotted it sitting on a branch of the oak tree overhanging the garage, about 14′ off the ground, watching the cat and shrieking.
I do not remember anyone linking to the skwirl auto-fellatio story lately.
Squirrels watch Gabe Fenton porn!
This is teh Intarweebs. I’m sure everyone has seen teh giant nut bag squirrel photo.
Cats were settling in nicely yesterday, but are pretty sullen right now. I think they actually miss their other person. Not that kittehs can’t be loyal or affectionate, but it’s nice to know that these two might be.
That said, I now have a hole in my hand.
I’m sure everyone has seen teh giant nut bag squirrel photo.
Perhaps ZRM hasn’t. I should probably leave a comment at his blog bringing it to his attention.
This is teh Intarweebs. I’m sure everyone has seen teh giant nut bag squirrel photo.
this is the first i’ve seen it and i must say i am impressed…
That said, I now have a hole in my hand.
you cannot trust cats…i don’t know why you people love kittehs so much…they are devious and cause great amounts of pain at the drop of a hat…
i don’t know why you people love kittehs so much…they are devious and cause great amounts of pain at the drop of a hat…
Kindred spirits and all that.
Kindred spirits and all that.
which is why i will never let you sit on my lap…
you cannot trust cats…i don’t know why you people love kittehs so much…they are devious and cause great amounts of pain at the drop of a hat…
What were you doing at the time?
I don’t know if you’re a dog person or a cat person, but their body language is completely different.
Dog wagging tail = “I’m happy”
Cat swishing tail = “I’m getting annoyed. I’m going to claw you if you keep doing it”.
Cats generally don’t like their bellies rubbed like dogs do. It’s a sensitive area and most don’t like being touched there.
Cat laying on its side doesn’t mean “Rub my stomach” it means “I’m comfortable around you so it’s OK to let my guard down”.
What were you doing at the time?
i think this will explain my kittehfobia:
when i was about 9 my daddy got me a calico kitteh…which i loved…she was so sweet and so cute! i had her like all spring and summer…then came fall…and colder weather…one day when daddy was home for lunch, kitteh decided to go someplace warm…when daddy left to go back to work…uh-oh…kitteh all over daddy’s engine block…i was distraught…daddy got me a new calico kitteh…but this one was not sweet…she was mean and would claw and scratch ALL THE TIME…i was happy when this kitteh ran away…
also, i had a friend who had a siamese cat that would sit on your lap and then suddenly dig it’s claws into your thighs…
i sometimes have nightmares that i am locked in a room with a bunch of cats and they keep clawing me…
so, yes, to answer your question, i am a dog person…
Our cat P.T.Barnum has been in Valhalla for about 3 years now but he was a most excellent chap.Not a great one for lap sitting or such but always interested and good natured (except at pill administering time ai yi yi). Finding another cat like him would be difficult but worth it. Neutered male tabby I reckon.
Long story –
Around 14 years ago I was in a relationship with the woman I was certain was “the one”. Right up until she ripped my heart out and stomped it into jello.
I was in a pretty bad place emotionally. I thought maybe getting a pet and having something else alive in the house might help. I wanted a dog but decided they’re too high maintenance, especially living in a condo.
I went to the shelter and they had so many cats I couldn’t even decide on one.
This one 6-month-old kitten kept meowing and sticking its paw out of the cage when I walked by. I asked if they’d let her out and she immediately jumped up on my shoulders. I took her home that day.
That’s how I got Pookie-cat. One of the best decisions I ever made.
Around 14 years ago I was in a relationship with the woman I was certain was “the one”. Right up until she ripped my heart out and stomped it into jello.
some women are meaner than cats…and this one was dumb too…but it worked out well for mrs. kong…and, you obviously…
my dog is freaking right now…thunderstorm…
I can speak from experience that Canadians love them some beer, preferably combined with hockey. I used to love being able to get beer from the duty-free, I used to get a case of Labatts for fourteen bucks and for a short time they had Bass Ale for eighteen bucks. Good times and only three years ago.
imma just say it: evan williams is not a half bad bourbon…
altho i may have wanted to follow my first instinct and throw some bombay into my sparkly lemonade…i was going for a lynchburg lemonade for no odd reason…just a change of pace…anyhoo…it ain’t too bad…now imma go gussy up cuz hubbkf and i are hitting the town…
Although one will meet the occasional Montrealeur with an inexplicable chip on the shoulder it is a fun and interesting town and I always found Quebec City a terrfic place for a romantic weekend getaway.
Anthony Powell used Button Gwinnett as an ancestor of one of the (many) great characters in A Dance to the Music of Time, a book I can’t recommend enough.
i m wearing heels…i will update you on the hilarity tomorrow…
I’ve gotten rid of a bunch of Blue Oyster Cult because they kinda suck.
Post-1976, this is tragically all too true.
BÖC turned anemic & generic after Agents Of Fortune… so it was four years of goodness followed by 27 years of FEH.
i m wearing heels…i will update you on the hilarity tomorrow…
I’m wearing cads. SO THERE.
Please tell me your dad didn’t try to pass off the new calico as the old one, because that would make him an asshole on the scale of Jonah Goldberg.
Are they nicer to you if you speak French?
How the fuck would I know? I have no French. Merci is about it.
Highlights of Montreal:
Went to a “French” restaurant where I fucking swear the waiter was the waiter from Victor Victoria. “We have a red. We have a white. We had a rose but they used it in the salad.”
Montreal has … Later, I’m spifflicated.
All these comments, and no love for the greatest living American general? Jesus, people!
i m wearing heels…i will update you on the hilarity tomorrow…
well done, me…did not wipe out tontine…but my feet do hurt like a motherfucker…
Please tell me your dad didn’t try to pass off the new calico as the old one, because that would make him an asshole on the scale of Jonah Goldberg.
nope…straight upfront a new cat…we grew up on a farm so were pretty acquainted with life and death…
PENIS.
Apparently this is not a joke.
Screaming, batshit insanity, on the other hand …
she ripped my heart out and stomped it into jello
Still relevant — even though Snakefinger has been dead for 25 years, which is a titty-fucking long time.
I then asked him if, as he was sitting with the body of his wife, now separated from her spirit, but still “hers”, and promised to be reunited with her spirit someday through the Resurrection, if he at any point thought to himself, “You know, I’m a little horny. I’d like to climb up on her right here and have one more good hump for the road. She’s still warm. Why not?”
Then he busted my head with a chair.
Still relevant — even though Snakefinger has been dead for 25 years, which is a titty-fucking long time.
Damn, there’s no way I’ll be able to travel to Brooklyn for a delicious spleen sandwich today.
Then he busted my head with a chair.
Sadly, no.
I’ve known Ann Barnhardt for all of thirty minutes now, but I already love her so much.
I’ve known Ann Barnhardt for all of thirty minutes now, but I already love her so much.
Is she dead?
At my next delivery of this presentation, the audience again laughed at the reality of necrophilia in Islam.
I thought Islam expressly forbids going out for a cold one.
Alan Partridge’s finest moment.
“You’re alright with that, cos it’s a race of people and a food.”
Necrophilia And You – The Cold Facts
Apparently your window of opportunity is six hours.
Bob – “I think my wife may have died.”
Jim – “What makes you say that?”
Bob – “Well, the sex is the same but the dishes have been piling up.”
“Here is my Koran … I’ve bookmarked several passages. The passages I’ve bookmarked I’ve bookmarked with bacon.”
Apparently your window of opportunity is six hours.
Does this take into account climate, weather, and the possible presence of scavengers?
Oh good God. These people aren’t even pretending to be sane anymore.
With a name like “Barnhardt”, I imagine bestiality is her kink of choice.
Santorum/Barnhardt 2016!
The pink rifle. The shapely calf. The coining of the term “musloid”.
Honestly, if I had a bunk, right now I’d be in it.
I know—dead people and shapely calves: it’s a perversion two-fer.
The pink rifle. The shapely calf. The coining of the term “musloid”.
Honestly, if I had a bunk, right now I’d be in it.
Don’t forget the enticingly large forehead.
If she had a stylist, she’d be a shoo-in for a congressional run in South Cakalackistan.
Koran-smoked bacon for everyone!
What’s with the posing with guns anyway?
I’ve never found myself thinking “You know, this portrait looks pretty good, but you know what would really take it up a notch? If I was holding a gun.”
They pose with guns because posing with trebuchets is distracting.
Perhaps Bitter Scribe’s recent nymjacker has learned his lesson and therefore is using a long variant nym instead.
Oh wait. No Xian trolling in it. Scribe’s attitude and viewpoint clearly present.
Never mind.
Major: Your last comment is something I will remember and keep breaking up about at random moments for the next few days, confirming the opinion of the people I regularly deal with that I am insane. Thanks a lot.
Addendum: I meant the “dishes piling up” one.
It’s a sick world and I’m a happy man…..
Fensick: I do the long nym thing every now and again, but I’m nowhere near as creative about it as The Goddamn Batman. (Where is he, anyway? I miss him.)
I meant “Fenwick,” of course.
I like voles.
I like voles.
Fine. Come to my house and get the one who apparently is scrabbling around in my attic.
Scribe: I’ve always enjoyed yer comments. Also I like the creative way Sadlies tag their names (e.g. Spear and Provider).
An example of the sensitivity, subtlety and nuance of “conservative” “humor” while slumming on the Youtube for the battle of New Orleans. Lloyd Marcus, eat your heart out.
Ann Barnhardt is a livestock and grain marketing consultant, was a commodity broker until Jon Corzine and his cronies destroyed the integrity of the financial markets and financial services industry
Obviously an expert in Musloids, but why does she hate Capitalism and therefore AMERICA?
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Backchannels/2012/0426/Egypt-necrophilia-law-Hooey-utter-hooey
In her Amercian Stinker “musloids do love them some necrophilia” post, Darling Ann (as I like to think of her) linked to a site directly refuting her own claim.
Could that delightful sense of whimsy be why I love her so? Or is it, still, the Koran (sic) bookmarked with bacon which so entrances? Cupid alone knows.
also, H. Rumbold, Masterr Barberr
your raison d’etre bran gag still cracks me up.
Then he busted my head with a chair.
i literally LOLd at this…how does ann barnhardt’s head not spin right off her body with all the dissonance…
i know now why there is a maker’s mark ad at the bottom of the ‘stinker’s’ page…drinking is highly encouraged before you enter there…
presence of scavengers?
It’s hard to keep it up with a vulture pecking your ass.
What?
Lloyd Marcus, eat your heart out.
?!?
A reference to the previous thread, I think. Also a True Fack for Minnesotan consolation: The Twins have scored more runs than Washington…which is leading the killer-tough NL-East and has the 3rd-best record in bazeboll. Despair not, with 110 games left.
General Tsao was the greatest general ever. He promised that the chickens will come home to roost in a nice spicy chicken sauce and he was very prescient.
DickeyPENIS.While General Tso is credited with chicken, and other matters (He served with distinction during the Qing Empire’s civil war against the Taiping Rebellion, in which it is estimated 20 million people died), few know about his success against Nian Cat.
~
Damn, now I’m hungry for spicy Chinese food but I want something Hunan.Maybe I’ll go to the Mongolian grill and build my own.
If you’re looking for human food, I hear there’s take out on Miami’s causeways.
Twice-cooked long pig?
With Yakov-Kreutzfeld sauce.
A reference to the previous thread, I think.
that i got…i just couldn’t figure out wtf they thought that video was a good idea to make…thems some freaky deaky peeps, right there…
thanks for the twins update…i have been out of doors transplanting in my garden so have not been near radio or teevee….
Dickey PENIS.
the name richard leakey still cracks me up…
I’ll go to the Mongolian grill and build my own.
I’ve never been all that fond of Chinese cuisine…but I am crazy mad for Mongolian. Maybe it’s a Genghis Khan thing?
Speaking of food, I thoroughly enjoyed my evil scientist kitchen bit experiment last night. Of course I was three sheets to the wind by the time we were ready for dessert so I may have forgotten some elements and I almost never measure anything so don’t expect a fucking recipe.
So I had these strawberries sitting there. I sliced them and sauteed gently in a bit of butter. A sprinkle of sugar and a good splash of Gran Marnier followed along with some orange zest. I dumped some AP floor in a bowl, added an egg and an egg yolk, a dollop of sour cream, baking powder, some cream and mixed up for a thickish batter. Melted butter in my 8″ Griswold cast iron pan (the one I got from my mother who got it from her mother – it’s about 100 years old or more), dumped the batter in and tossed it in a medium hot oven.
It cooked up into a soft, almost custardy flan-like deliciousness. Arrange slices on plate, top with sauteed strawbs and artfully place a scoop of pistachio ice cream. Deefuckinglicious. We’re calling it strawberries Romanov for some odd reason.
richard leakey
Dick Trickle also too.
yeah…enuf of the fewd talk…since we have been slaving out of doors and hubbkf has to go work in his dad’s yard very shortly, we are having tits and tots…
Dick Trickle also too.
heh…right? are any of you familiar with twin cities legend mel jass? i remember watching him when i was little…anyhoo, his wife died the other day and i was sorely disappoint that they did not have a child named hugh…
also, scerv….hubbkf loves fry bread…do you have a recipe?
We’re calling it strawberries Romanov for some odd reason.
i also have strawbs in the fridge…last night i sliced some with some pineapple chunks, sliced banners and whipped cream…that was quite delightful…
now that the tits and tots are all gone, i m back out in the yard…oooh, but hubbkf and i get to work at this weekend’s pledge drive at the station, so i got that to look forward too…i dunno why they are having it, but hey, i don’t get out much…
Pledge starts Monday. Yet another week of Teh Ho being largely absent from home. Although, the TV drives are far less demanding than the radio drives where he works 13 and 14 hour days 10 days in a row.
No I don’t, sorry. I love fry bread and it is one of those things that is as much art as science. After all there are only about four ingredients but it is easy to screw up. It’s interesting to see regional variations, on the Tohono O’odham rez I tried some that was big as a hubcap but very thin and airy. Jokes about frybread cooking skills (and lack of) are very common.
I like mine with butter and maple syrup or else Indian taco style.
Hey local and nearly local sadlies! Cider Summit is happening again in the park directly across the street from my abode. June 23, I think. There’s a sign in the lobby but their web site hasn’t been updated yet. I’ll post a link soon as there’s more info.
It’s good wrapped around a mooseburger, also, too.
also, scerv….hubbkf loves fry bread…do you have a recipe?
I’ve got at least one recipe for it. I’ll check my cookbooks later.
Nepalese fried bread. Plus digressions.
So it turns out there is a strawberries Romanov. Besides the obvious streebleberries it has orange liqueur. Wonder if our frazzled minds dredged that up from our drunken near-stupor. Now I’ll have to come up with a new name. Strawberries Stalin maybe?
I’ve started my great American novel. It’s about some kids who hang out near an air force base and crack wise about the fighters as they fly by. I call it “To Mock a Killing Bird”.
PENIS
Yer dick is spongy. Ew.
Moar Penis or perhaps Penis if the first link isn’t working. Either way I give up
Now it’s bigger and spongier.
To fit in more with Romanovs, I’d suggest “Strawberries Lenin” or–even better–“Strawberries Trotsky”. Sounds deelish, btw.
Plus you could garish ‘Strawberries Trotsky’ with a pickaxe made of toothpicks.
Like strawberries in jackboots walking on your face for ever.
I now have a hole in my hand.
Pookie-cat
Roomed w/ a cat named Pookie myself. One of the Pilipinos I worked w/ at the time advised me that in Tagalog pookie meant pussy, & not the kitty kind.
The More You Know.
BÖC turned anemic & generic after Agents Of Fortune… so it was four years of goodness followed by 27 years of FEH.
Some/many/most bands didn’t have more’n three-four good albums in ’em.
Once you’ve used up your normal (or at least un-famous) person experiences prior to becoming an international pop star no one wants to hear about it.
Nice of y’all to pause while I caught up.
You may resume.
Apparently they all turned into pumpkin-heads at midnight.
It’ll be fun to see Jonah try to backtrack this: http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2012/06/01/493804/national-review-writer-conservatives-should-beat-young-people-who-think-socialism-is-better-than-capitalism/
The thing about them darned young people is that while I was at a US university the town voted Mondale and the dorms voted Reagan. If Jonah wants to say all young people are stupid socialists then here’s hoping Mitt picks up the baton.
Roomed w/ a cat named Pookie myself. One of the Pilipinos I worked w/ at the time advised me that in Tagalog pookie meant pussy, & not the kitty kind.
Her official name is “Patches”.
Somewhere along the way I started calling her other names. Sometimes it’s Pook, Pookie, Pookster, Pookie-cat, Squeak, Squeaker (she often makes a sound like a child’s squeaky toy).
When she’s in trouble it’s “Caaaaaaat!!!!”
Pookie is reasonably evocative when one thinks about hairballs.
Ooop ack!
Mrs Cat gets called Mrs Squeaker as well.
Who would have thought that Joberg was a dickhead?
But let’s look at the list:
Conservatives don’t like: Non-white people, non-male people, non-mature people, non religious people, non-heterosexual people and non-conservative people. They will soon have enough members for a country club.
Pookie puts the world right : a book from my youth, and a formative one. Awfully sad and eventually happy – a sort of proto-Spielberg.
But that Pookie was a rabbit with wings – you are all confusing me.
No Irish!
My cat, Smudge, gets called “hey, fuzzface” quite a lot.
Shorter Johah Goldberg – “Waaah! People who don’t vote like me shouldn’t be allowed to vote!”
HREF = “http://tbogg.firedoglake.com/2012/06/02/andrew-breitbart-is-dead-andrew-breitb-art-is-not/#comments”>This demands Tintin’s awesome photoshop skillz.
It would look much more realistic with a sky-goatse shopped in over his right shoulder, so the “heavenly light” falling upon him is emanating from a giant asshole.
June 3, 2012 at 2:22
Goddammit.
This demands Tintin’s awesome photoshop skillz.
It would look much more realistic with a sky-goatse shopped in over his right shoulder, so the “heavenly light” falling upon him is emanating from a giant asshole.
Wow, really? Washington won? Washington was a TERRIBLE general. This isn’t even debatable; he lost almost every major engagement he was in direct charge of, he was barely able to marshal retreats correctly. The big wins of the war were led by other generals, esp French ones. Washington had a place in the system, he was an inspiring leader and got along well with the Congress of the time, but holy hell was he a god awful General.
RE: War of 1812, no one won. The Treaty of Ghent essentially said, “let’s all go home and pretend this didn’t happen.” There were no land or policy wins to either side. Pretty pointless all around.
Gee, only $1000 to get a print of Breitbart.
If the damned family wasn’t involved I bet you could rent the corpse to fuck it. The Muslims say it’s okay.
Renting the corpse.
Well of course you wouldn’t be allowed to fuck it. You put it in a chair and, when arguing with cloud rabbits, say “Andrew will back me up on that, won’t you Andrew?”
Oh, all right, you can fuck it for a bit.
I didn’t come here for corpse-fucking. I’m looking for an argument.
You’re not going to get one from him, he’s dead.
Though I must say Breitbart has never looked so slim. Also: longest period of continuous sobriety since he was weaned.
YES I AM A HORRIBLE PERSON.
longest period of continuous sobriety since he was weaned.
Has anyone tested the milk-alcohol content on Breitbart mère?
OMG, I hadn’t even thought… you know, where DOES Bailey’s come from?
I had such a crush on Bailey Quarters.
I had such a crush on Bailey Quarters.
Me too. I thought she was way hotter than Lonnie Anderson on that show.
Mr. Bogg took my suggestion – now there’s a photoshop contest for who can do the funniest defacement of that sad, sad Breitbart painting.
I need help, people! I don’t know anything about photoshopping, but I KNOW that picture needs a goatse over Breitbart’s right shoulder!
Jeffraham, vs? Bueller? Bueller?
ftfy
GodDAMN, Jennifer, that is butt-ugliest painting I have EVER SEEN.
Jesus Christ, the shadows aren’t even lined up with the sun on that thing.
tigris – the problems with proportion are epic. He’s got a baby arm and the torso of a…a…well, Tyrian Lannister. Or some other dwarf.
Oooo, there’s ANOTHER good p-shop idea! Breitbart as one of the seven dwarves….Ragey.
Goddammit rem at 9:28, I would ahem you on that Jesus’ General link but I’m beat tired and on phone. He is a great leader tho
Necrophilia – fuck the corpses before they zombify and eat you.
Necrophilia – more 3D than Playboy.
Necrophiladelphia – City of Breitbart Love
It’ll be fun to see Goldberg try to backtrack this
This isn’t the eliminationist rhetoric you’re looking for … because Teh Force gives me power over your weak liberal mind.
Jennifer, that painter has the worst grasp of proportions ever. His arms couldn’t reach the top of his massive head. Unless Andrew really was the life model for the stone heads on Easter island, that painting is objectively terrible. I’ve seen more natural looking muppets.
YES I AM A HORRIBLE PERSON.
Tigris should start a blog.
Pledge starts Monday.
yeah, that was kinda duh of me, wasn’t it? quiet, quiet night at the station…even ‘funtime polka’ didn’t get the phones ringing…
also, scerv….hubbkf loves fry bread…do you have a recipe?
I’ve got at least one recipe for it. I’ll check my cookbooks later.
thank you, sir! and scerv…i didn’t realize there were some regional differences, but that does make sense…i’m a fan of it with butter and sugar & cinnamon…
“Gift” for Jennifer.
Nepalese fried bread. Plus digressions.
this sounds yummy…can i borrow your stand mixer?
Goldberg laments the culture’s obsession with youth
o rlly? isn’t jonah forever trying to prove how young and hip he is? gdang it he is such a dickwad…
also, the breitbart?!? that is possibly the funniest fail i have ever seen…
Oh, all right, you can fuck it for a bit.
this made me lol so loudly i startled hubbkf who was in the other room…
Goldberg, Advocating that conservatives should “literally” beat young people into political submission
Oh noes, I thought it was VPOTUS Biden who deserves teh public opprobrium for eliding the difference between ‘literally’ and ‘figuratively’.
I heard it from someone called Jonah Goldberg.
GodDAMN, Jennifer, that is butt-ugliest painting I have EVER SEEN.
I am prepared to argue that the El Greco in the Scottish National Gallery is uglier.
I had such a crush on Bailey Quarters.
She was cute as a button, all right
Feudalism, thy name is Breitbart.
o rlly? isn’t jonah forever trying to prove how young and hip he is? gdang it he is such a dickwad…
My favorite line in Doughbob’s decree was:
“It is a simple fact of science that nothing correlates more with ignorance and stupidity than youth.”
SCIENCE, IT WORKS, BITCHES!
Doughbob’s call to beat the socialism out of “the youth” is pretty much a Fatbeard Fatwah.
“It is a simple fact of science that nothing correlates more with ignorance and stupidity than youth.”
This is why young people, as part of their War on Science, made it illegal to investigate possible rises in sea level resulting from climate change.
No, wait, that was the Republican party in North Carolina.
Remember the Children’s Crusade Against Evolution?
nothing correlates more with ignorance and stupidity than youth
Hmmm if only there was another correlation
Hmmm if only there was another correlation
But… but… that characterization is so… clichéd.
Hmmm if only there was another correlation
Let the record show that the study to which AK refers was in Psychological Science, which is somewhat of an outlier in the psych. field, being committed to evidence and rigour.
Remember the Children’s Crusade Against Evolution?
Was that related to the March of Dimetrodons?
somewhat of an outlier in the psych. field, being committed to evidence and rigour.
The swines!
Was that related to the March of Dimetrodons?
Well played!
The swines!
Making the rest of the field look bad…
Subby, that ROCKS! I left a comment on your blog, but I’ll leave it here, too – is it ok to submit this to TBogg’s contest (with full attribution, of course)? Please? Pretty pretty please?
@bbkf
I sent the fry-bread recipe to the public email that was listed on your blog.
Goldberg: “But I won’t apologize for the “misunderstanding” because there is no misunderstanding.”
Damn straight there wasn’t, we all know what “literally” means.
Tigris should start a blog.
If only I could find a couple of delightfully loquacious blokes to do all the writing. HMMMM.
@bbkf
I sent the fry-bread recipe to the public email that was listed on your blog.
got it, approved of it, replied…thank you, major!
You know what would really be funny? If Goldberg actually attempted to beat somebody. You know, somebody with pubic hair who wasn’t paralyzed.
Brazilian wax libel!
Of course. But you don’t need to worry about credit: it’s your idea.
Cool! I’m going to submit it as a collaborative effort. Just posted at your blog – suggested title: The Happy Warrior Is Called Home.
I had such a crush on Bailey Quarters.
THIS … RUN NERDLUST.EXE
On the topic of cats, I had a cat who would come to me whenever I performed “Java” in “da”s. Da da da da da da da, da da da da da da da… Since then, I have suspected that cats have secret and somewhat obscure tunes that are irresistible to them. For all you cat people, I suggest you try to find that tune. The ability to call your cat to you is very convenient.
They might prefer instrumentals.
‘Symphony for Tin and Opener’ works pretty well around here.
OT: North Carolina legislators order the sea to stop rising.
Out for brunch at a new “German inspired” restaurant.
Orangensaft mit Sekt. Kaffee. Ostereicher Pfannkuchen mit Speck.
But they didn’t know about Currywurst so I’m leery.
For all you cat people, I suggest you try to find that tune. The ability to call your cat to you is very convenient.
I’ve found that the sound of a can of cat food being opened works exceedingly well.
As SC is likely thoroughly in his cups by now, I shall AHEM BS for him.
http://www.sadlyno.com/archives/37120.html#comment-1280933
The Nurenberger bratwurst was a bit dry and mealy. The red cabbage was just slightly better than insipid. I can’t comment on the Pfannkuchen because they screwed up our order and I haven’t received it yet. The eggs over easy weren’t. By the time they brought us Salzburg und Pfeffer the Eier were cold. They did comp us mimosas and the Speck to make up for it.
Ahh, the pancake has arrived. Doesn’t look promising. […] dense, grainy.Tastes of cornmeal.
D-. Shant be back.
With a couple exceptions, I can’t say I was all that impressed with German food. I practically lived on Döner kebabs when I was in Munich.
Oh bad luck, Pup. It’s so disappointing when the restaurant is no good.
Molotov cocktail (gasoline) disappointing, or Molotov cocktail (vodka) disappointing?
Also on the subject of cats,
No description available.
Present for Pupienus!
The best German food I ever tasted was at the Amana Colonies in Iowa.
Goldberg: “But I won’t apologize for the “misunderstanding” because there is no misunderstanding.”
Damn straight there wasn’t, we all know what “literally” means.
Has anyone commented at NRO to remind Goldberg of the contempt he feels for
peopleDemocrats who use “literally” as an intensifier?The pretzels and beer in Munich were as good as you would imagine, however.
Whenever I see the words”Grant Lee” I reach for my buffalo.
I laughed. Now I’m going to hell.
Damn you, Hogeye!
~
Present for Pupienus!
A present for me?
Whaddya got?
Whaddya gonna give me?
With leather?
Looks nothing at all like a Telefunken U47.
Sorry, Pup. It was Herbert Grönemeyer’s hit single “Currywurst”.
[Checks Google]
There’s a Grönemeyer concert in Bochum on June 22rd and I won’t be there until the 25th. FECK. My sad, let me show you it.
No problem, Smutty. I found a yootoob of it I could watch. And I did.
Argh, Smutsy. FYautocorrect for knowing more than I.
EMI
And…God Save The Queen.
~
Hey, quit living in the past already!
How about a little stairway, scarecrow?
~
What it’s really like to work in a music store.
What it’s really like to work in a music store.
Crap. I was hoping for something about a record store to note that Philp K. Dick never described it like that.
Also, is that you?
Also, is that you?
Nah, some guy in Birmingham, AL, though we do in fact look vaguely similar.
Also, I always thought that Dick worked in a record store?
And after 15 years playing the guitar, I have finally relented and learned how to play Stairway … it just seemed churlish not to.
Though it should be noted that it was the Rolf Harris version.
Crap. I was hoping for something about a record store to note that Philp K. Dick never described it like that.
And also that I can’t read. So there’s that.
And also that I can’t read. So there’s that.
I am trying in vain to make a pun or other joke involving “high fidelity.”
It’ll be fun to see Goldberg try to backtrack this
This isn’t the eliminationist rhetoric you’re looking for … because Teh Force gives me power over your weak liberal mind.
Good thing I grew up with the Huts…
The first two sentences is his usual pseudo-intellectual gobbledy-gook; Opinion A does not equal proof of Hearsay A. But back to the point: his LAST FUCKING SENTENCE says “literally or figuratively as far as I’m concerned;” how the blue hell are people supposed to interpret that as “OMG j/k u guyz?”
And lastly: he doesn’t need to apologize. He *meant* to be provocative and offensive. It’s not the “beat them up” comment either; it’s the fact that he believes that young people who embrace socialism are inherently stupid.
P.S.: There’s bad news about Obama everyday. He’s the POTUS; any bad news happening in the country is automatically attributed to him (See: Fox News; National Review).
(Next on National Review: Jonah argues that when Darth Sidious ordered Anakin Skywalker to “wipe out” the Separatists, he meant from his personal list of contacts.)
Unfriend the Separatists on Facebook?
~
I’ve been away from the Intertoobz for most of the day and I’ve just come across the Breitbart painting. What majesty! What grandeur!
I’ve just come across the Breitbart painting. What majesty! What grandeur!
What’s truly disturbing is, I suspect that’s how they really see themselves.
You’re going to be in Bochum? My sympathies.
There’s a Darth Sidius? Sidiously?
(I’ve never seen any of the prequels. My world is better that way.)
There’s a Darth Sidius? Sidiously?
Pryme’s joking- his real name was Darth Sexyass.
I’m guessing he and young Anakin had a “special” relationship, then …
And, for Pup, some High Fidelity.
What it’s really like to work in a music store.
I ROFLed, because I always strenuously endeavor to be that eye-wateringly obnoxious to the human ear – but plainly that dude’s a natural!
What majesty! What grandeur!
Move over Three Wolf Moon, there’s a new corpse in town!
Move over Three Wolf Moon, there’s a new corpse in town!
Now I’m picturing three medieval Breitbarts howling at the Kenyan Usurper’s head in the sky.
I see a Breitbart risin’
I see trouble on the way
I hear a hurricane of bullshit
Bad reporting posted every day
Can’t post crap tonight / My heart just don’t feel right / There’s infarction on the rise
♪ I see that edit-con a-rollin’
I see those fanboys fap & pray
I smell a wave of fail a-trollin’
Sadder than bands who pay to play ♪
When I was growing up all the guitar kids first learned Smoke on the Water, followed by Stairway and drooled over Eruption.
I was only a half-assed singer but it was a good time to be a kid.
Late to the party (out all weekend, Arkansas yet) but gotta chime in re: Bailey Quarters/ Jan Smithers………………what made it worse was that at the time (WKRP time) she was going out with some hot rock star, so you knew that the shy act was not the whole story, IYKWIMAITYD………………..now, who was the guy?? I can’t remember & the intertoobz aren’t helping…………………….anybody?
Being a punk kid, I only ever wanted to play like Bob Mould. Still do, actually …
Kip Winger?
“As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.”
So I checked my vitals and funny story, it turns out I’m still alive.
So yeah, new post.
“As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly.”
Oh fucking god that was a classic. I would have killed half my family for Loni Anderson back then. OK, hyperbole but damn I was a hormone-fueled kid who was a sucker for boobs (so to speak).
I’ve been away from the Intertoobz for most of the day and I’ve just come across the Breitbart painting. What majesty! What grandeur!
An old thread, I know, but it is worth recording that clever-clogs Greylocks at LGM has found the original of the plagiarism.
You’re going to be in Bochum? My sympathies.
Bochum has perfectly serviceable brewpubs and a small-but-perfectly-formed art museum. I was there once and they had an exhibition of work by Unica Zürn. Imagine my happiness!
Oh fucking god that was a classic.
This was my happiest accomplishment in a S,N! thread.
Wow Smut, you owned that thread. Whatever happened to that Herr Doktor guy, now he was funny.
Nobody mentions Sam Houston? He let an ill-equipped guerilla army against a vastly superior force and using tactics alone defeated Mexico and won independence for Texas. Extra points for vehemently opposing slavery and secession, to the point of spending the duration of,the civil war under close supervision ans what we would call house arrest.
The bestest military advice ever was from Cap’n Crunch.
Stay crunchy, men. Stay crunchy.”
If you too think Lee was amazing, brillant, kind, anti slavery, and almost won the war for the South despite amazing odds — WOW are you in for a shock. That is, if Lee’s own handwritten paper matter.
Just take slavery Whoever told you he was anti slavery was wrong. In fact, Lee had 80-100 slaves, and they hated him, according to his papers He also had them whipped for various offenses — such as the 14 year old girl he had whipped for running away with her child. Oh, excuse me, LEE’s child. Lee regularly separated mothers from children, we learn from his papers.
And of course, the slave women knew that. SSlave girls had babies young — real young at Arlington. We don’t know who was fathering the slave babies, but according to 1860 census, an a astonishing 50% of his slaves were listed a MULATTO. And we have pictures of a female slave Lee owned — about two years old. She is as white JFK’s daughter. When you first see her picture, you think how odd it is a while child is being held in a picture by a very dark man. That dark man was supposedly her grandfather –but unless the laws of DNA and skin color have changed in 150 years, that light skinned girl, who had a slave mother and a slave grand mother, had a white father AND a white grandfather.
Lee also defended slavery as ordained of God. God even “intended and knew” that slaves “must endure painful discipline” Pain, wrote Lee, was “necessary for their instruction.
Lee actually KEPT TRACK of how many times he had slaves whipped, how many lashes, and how much he paid for the capture of which run away slave — and he had many. Lee paid 600% higher bounties for the capture of light skinned GIRLS. Ask yourself — can light skinned GIRLS pick 600% more cotton? Really? Can they carry 600% more water or wood?
No? Well,gee, I wonder why Lee found them so darn financially valuable?
I have read that Sherman’s commands suffered the fewest casualties during the Civil War. If true, then, as an old gun-shy soldier, he gets my vote.