Jan
13

Today in Non-Sequitur




Posted at 11:32 by Cerberus

Redefining Smug Assholes Everywhere.

K-Lo and W. Bradford Wilcox the Improbably Non-numbered, National Coo Coo Ca Choo:
Getting the 60 Percent Married

Sometimes… Sometimes you’re just not sure where to start with a post. This interview… it’s written almost entirely in non-sequiturs. The things they are talking about aren’t just unrelated to reality in the nice predictable wingnut projection we are used to, they are just… detached. And the result is a bit more disorienting than we’re usually used to over here at Sadly, No!

Let me see if I can summarize:

Shorter (or the last port before Jungle):

  • Everything can be solved by forcing people to marry. Everything!

I mean, I get a lot of it. I get the monomaniacal focus because of an underlying agenda. The attempt to brute-force religious demands through repetition and lots of lies.

After all, Bradiford Burkle and his not-very-secret Catholic Church propaganda arm “National Marriage Project” have well earned some rather lengthy bits of infamy for essentially being dishonest hacks willing to massage any numbers they can to support their political agenda.

But then you run into this.

KATHRYN JEAN LOPEZ: Who are the “forgotten 60 percent”?

W. BRADFORD WILCOX: Almost 60 percent of Americans have a high-school degree but not a college degree. We call this group “Middle Americans,” which includes those with some college or an associate’s degree, and it is this group that is driving the key trends in marriage today

I… what? Huh? So they’re claiming high-school graduates and only high-school graduates as “real middle america” now? Not, I don’t know, the middle of the fucking country or conservatives in general or even the middle class which would allow them a version of this that would even begin to make sense?

Fuck, it’s not even like “Middle American” is all that much shorter than “High School Graduate” and-

Wait. 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6.

In fact, it turns out to have one more syllable than the thing it’s standing in for.

I don’t-

Yet their welfare — when it comes to marriage, work, and education — has received practically no attention from politicians, the media, and other observers of American life, even though they make up a majority of the American adult population. This neglect may change in the wake of the recent presidential election, insofar as Republicans have realized the cost of neglecting the welfare of Middle Americans.

Ohhhh. Oh. Okay, I see how the monte works now. You needed some way of tying a class of people who are often poorer and, let’s be frankly honest, browner into all your usual baggage about “Middle America” so that you could pretend that issues caused by poverty are actually caused by… Democrats raising taxes or some such shit.

Am I close?

WILCOX: It matters for two reasons. First, children born outside of marriage are much more likely to be consigned to a life of family instability, poverty, and educational failure. In a word, they are much less likely to have a shot at the American Dream.

Bam! I am good!

And yes, in a world where causation and correlation might as well be one and the same, it turns out social issues caused by poverty are not actually caused by poverty but by an unrelated issue that causes the poverty… somehow.

Actually… that’s a legitimate question.

How are children born outside of marriage supposed to be causing poverty?

And bonus question, how will you answer that question without being forced to admit that religious attitudes to things like sex education and the lack of easy access to reproductive options may be a contributing factor?

The answer to both is parakeet, because Bradiana Jones knows better than to let logic or sanity get even within docking range of this shit.

Hell, he won’t even let “Middle Americans” mean one thing.

LOPEZ: Why do you call these people “Middle Americans,” and how can they best be reached?

WILCOX: We call them Middle Americans because they hail from the middle of the American class distribution and make up a majority of the population.

So they are the middle class.

And, until recently, they have served as the moral and civic backbone of America.

Oh wait, they’re now conservative Real American types.

In the 1970s, for instance, this group was more likely to attend church than any other group in the country. But now, for both economic and cultural reasons, Middle Americans are falling behind.

Okay, now they are Evangelicals… and I’m just going to sidestep the easy joke about religious observance and education level.

Middle Americans, especially Middle American men, are losing their connection to marriage, work, religion, and civil society.

Wait, no, now it’s a thinly veiled dog whistle for black people and yeah, black men might be having such difficult retaining their connection to marriage because we incarcerate them so frequently and over so little we might as well reinstitute slavery so we can at least be honest with ourselves.

LOPEZ: If getting them married successfully is “the social challenge for our times,” why aren’t more of us talking about it, and often?

WILCOX: Because many Americans think that family-related matters such as marriage are “private” and not worthy of public attention, or because they think we should celebrate today’s family diversity.

Gays wanting to marry totally ruins it for everyone else.

But really, I wonder what I was thinking. It’s not too bad-

LOPEZ: What does this have to do with the fiscal cliff or the economy?

What?

Nothing. Literally nothing. Marriage has literally nothing to do with the fiscal cliff. Partially because the fiscal cliff was a bunch of media-invented bullshit designed to make the end of the Bush Tax Cuts seem like an important issue to anyone outside the Top 1%… But mostly because that statement is so stupid, it’s caused my brains to leak out of my ears.

I don’t even care what bizarre self-serving “single mothers cause mass shootings, all of poverty, and the deficit because welfare queens” answer he gives, because it can’t possibly justify that question. Let’s hope the next question is better-

LOPEZ: What is the marriage penalty, and what kind of difference could it make if it were lifted?

I really need to stop setting myself up like that.

Yes, marriage is so very penalized and not at all economically promoted in this country. I mean, what with all the tax breaks, child tax credits, expanded available social services, health insurance and other benefits available to married couples its just no wonder that straights haven’t started boycotting marriage entirely in order to protect themselves.

WILCOX: Robert Lerman at the Urban Institute estimates that many low-income families face a marriage penalty of up to 25 percent.

Please ignore that this looks suspiciously like the sort of believable large number some one would instinctively reach for if someone were to say “Hey, Rob, can you pull the first number you think of out of your ass for me?”. It’s simply a coincidence.

This is because many of our public welfare programs — e.g., food stamps — are cut off for low-income families whose income rises above a certain threshold.

Which is a remarkably good argument for a more robust safety net that doesn’t cap out before people still need it… Also, household income for married couples has a whole different chart than even single parents. But I guess things that screw over single parents are magically things that screw over married couples through the magic of transparent ideology.

And marriage often means a second earner enters the picture, thus disqualifying many low-income couples from means-tested programs. This means that some couples or single mothers have an economic incentive not to get married.

Of course. People are avoiding getting married while still remaining cohabitating partners and parents because this somehow saves money compared to the literally endless array of benefits and credits they would otherwise earn.

But I guess if your worldview is that people are either together and married or they are chastely living in two separate locations having Jesus approved cuddles only, then…

Wait. If that was the case in your bizarre worldview, where are all these kids of single parents coming from?

In the report, we detail steps that could be taken to end this penalty. This would shore up the economic foundations of marriage among the poor and send the right signal about marriage to low-income communities where marriage is increasingly rare.

Yes, by fixating on a purely fictional issue, we send a nice strong signal about marriage to low-income communities.

That being that we don’t fucking care about low-income communities and can’t even pretend to fucking care. But we’re happy to exploit the poverty we help make worse in order to try and hard-sell bitches back into marrying early and unhappily out of a generalized sense of panic.

LOPEZ: What does the president have to do with this? What could he do about it?

WILCOX: In my view, the biggest thing that President Barack Obama and First Lady Michelle Obama could do is to get behind a public campaign to promote married parenthood, much like the campaign the First Lady has conducted on behalf of healthy eating. The Obamas have gone the distance in their marriage, and they could encourage more of their fellow citizens to follow in their footsteps for the sake of kids across this great country of ours.

Dude, if Obama were to suddenly start pimping his marriage to Michelle and telling Americans to marry, conservatives would be declaring War on Marriage within the-

Actually, yes, that’s a great idea. Obama should adopt it at once.

LOPEZ: How can we talk about marriage and divorce without making people feel bad about a marriage that did not work out?

Ha ha, Kath, you ignorant slut, the whole point of this organization is to make bitches feel bad about failed marriages.

WILCOX: We have to think about the future. Almost no one hopes that their children will face a future that includes divorce, single parenthood, or some other family difficulty. So, even though many of us adults have made mistakes or failed in marriage

Yes, so many mistakes and failures so we can’t at all promote things that actually work.

Like supporting the overall movement to delay marriage overall which has dramatically lowered the divorce rate. Or supporting strong social safety nets, general poverty relief, strong unemployment benefits, and job creation so that economic worries don’t add unnecessary stress to relationships. Or allowing gays to get married so people who want to get married and have legal protections for their families can, you know, have them. Or making contraceptives readily available and stepping up sex education as well as making sure abortion access is treated as a human right so that no one who isn’t ready for children isn’t forced into it because of necessity. Or strongly supporting feminist efforts to reduce the incidents of rape, assault, or abuse. Or provide strong support to the victims, both economic and social so that bad relationships can be terminated long before they get overly tangled.

Or pretty much anything other than just going “um, er, marriage sure is neat, everyone should do it with someone, anyone, cause it doesn’t really matter beyond getting the ring.”

We need to renew a marriage-friendly culture that manages to hold up the ideal of the intact, married family while treating departures from that ideal with grace and sensitivity. Our children deserve no less.

And if this wasn’t so utterly lost in the world of poorly-hidden dog whistles that this wasn’t a two page exercise in absurdist poetry, we could actually take you at your word.

We could actually make it easier for people to get married, remove the economic and social barriers that make it difficult, and cheer on the feminists helping to ensure that marriages are more likely to succeed.

We could even forget pushing marriage altogether and promote what works for each couple and making it easier to create one’s family, no matter what form that takes.

But we won’t. Because you’re off in your little world where marriage is a reliable good you can buy in the corner store and low marriage rates cause poverty rather than the other way around.

And where you don’t want to admit that the rate of failed marriages has actually been going down since we all stopped getting so hung up on marriage.

Cause if you do, then you might have to get a real job.

And nothing is more terrifying than that.

272 Comments »

  1. barga20 said,

    January 13, 2013 at 12:40

    What i missed in that piece was any mention of K-Lo’s marriage success.

  2. Crissa said,

    January 13, 2013 at 12:44

    Ahh, a missive from the dept of easily missed points. Now, who exactly is it that is stopping us from having means testing that doesn’t penalizing families?

  3. Major Kong said,

    January 13, 2013 at 12:58

    In the 1970s, for instance, this group was more likely to attend church than any other group in the country. But now, for both economic and cultural reasons, Middle Americans are falling behind.

    They probably don’t have time, what with having to work 3 part-time jobs just to stay ever so slightly above the poverty line.

  4. Anonymous said,

    January 13, 2013 at 14:58

    I too have a bitchin’ cold Cerb so it is with tea and sympathy that I suggest you correctly spell ‘redefining’.

  5. Gary Ruppert said,

    January 13, 2013 at 15:48

    The fact is liberals demanize marriage and promote sinful living arangements such as Polly and Molly. God never intended that Gary and Larry should be bound in matrimoney. The day of wreckoning is coming for the progressives that are runeing this once great country.

  6. witty1 said,

    January 13, 2013 at 15:58

    The most punchable face ever?

  7. DAS said,

    January 13, 2013 at 16:01

    Gary’s on to us and our liberal plot to ensure only couples whose names rhyme are allowed to marry.

  8. Willy said,

    January 13, 2013 at 16:02

    We call this group “Middle Americans,”
    Short, hirsute hill-dwellers with big feet?

  9. DAS said,

    January 13, 2013 at 16:36

    I wanna play the correlation equals causation game too! How’s this: in the 1970s “Middle Americans” lost ground economically, socially, you name it; the 1970s began with Nixon in the White House and marked a watershed (water? see what I did there?) in our country’s political discourse in which the Overton window started to lurch rightward. Did Nixon and the “Silent Majority” CAUSE the decline of “Middle America”?I dunno. We report, you decide … as they.say.

  10. tigris said,

    January 13, 2013 at 17:11

    Almost 60 percent of Americans have a high-school degree but not a college degree.

    So, wait, let me get this straight: people with diplomas but no baccalaureate are economically disadvantaged therefore we should focus on them getting married? Does a marriage license come with an honorary degree now? Summa gonna cum laude?

    And marriage often means a second earner enters the picture, thus disqualifying many low-income couples from means-tested programs. This means that some couples or single mothers have an economic incentive not to get married.

    In the report, we detail steps that could be taken to end this penalty.

    If he’s being honest this is something I can’t imagine anyone disagreeing with, though I’m wearing my “doubtful” face. When these guys say “reforming welfare” they usually mean “reducing welfare.”

  11. DrDick said,

    January 13, 2013 at 17:18

    I am pretty sure that K-Lo believes that all her problems would be solved by forcing someone to marry her and the making everyone get married is the only chance she has.

  12. ifthethunderdontgetya™³²®© said,

    January 13, 2013 at 17:22

    Good morning!
    ~

  13. Matt said,

    January 13, 2013 at 17:23

    @tigris: the means-testing line is a trial ballon for the new RW attack line, “Democrats are horrible because they allow RW policies to be enacted, so vote GOP!”

    Yes, it’s truly head-asplodingly ridiculous. But the “Middle Americans” are likely to buy it, just as long as there’s a big enough side of Jeebus Juice.

  14. Gary Ruppert said,

    January 13, 2013 at 17:28

    The fact is, liberals, youve got nothing. We are right on guns, abortion, gays, business growth, racism, working hard, so-called climate change, and everything else, yet you fool yourself into worshipping a negro king and his lawyer acolates.

  15. DAS said,

    January 13, 2013 at 17:34

    Matt, the GOP’s been using this strategy in various ways, shapes and forms for some time now. E.g. attacking Kerry for supporting the Iraq war and attacking Obama for Medicare. That’s why they want the Dems to propose spending cuts: to attack them for proposing those cuts. In fact, the trope is so established that the Simpsons parodied it way back when in the episode Side Show Bob Roberts in which the right wing prevails upon Mayor Quimby to release Side Show Bob from prison and when Quimby does so, they attack Quimby for doing so while running Side Show Bob for mayor! It’s a standard GOP strategy and yet the Dems generally seem.unprepared for it (although it does seem to be loosing its effectiveness as Middle America is onto thescheme even if the Dems are not)

  16. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 13, 2013 at 17:53

    So, even though some children do just fine in cohabiting, single-parent, or step-parent families, children’s odds of making it in America are much higher if they hail from an intact family where the parents are married.

    For instance, a recent Pew report found that “among children who start in the bottom third of the income distribution, only 26 percent with divorced parents move up to the middle or top third as adults, compared to 50 percent of children with continuously married parents.”

    Maybe there could be some cohort of children put into some wild experiment in which their families get the cash to do what they need to do.

  17. Major Kong said,

    January 13, 2013 at 18:28

    Did Nixon and the “Silent Majority” CAUSE the decline of “Middle America”?

    Some people say…..

  18. S. cerevisiae said,

    January 13, 2013 at 19:00

    matrimoney

    This is a thing of beauty.

  19. VCarlson said,

    January 13, 2013 at 19:07

    matrimoney

    This is a thing of beauty.

    Isn’t “matrimoney” what those folks think “welfare queens” get paid for procreating?

  20. Snorghagen said,

    January 13, 2013 at 19:19

    matrimoney
    - – - – - -
    This is a thing of beauty.

    Not to mention ‘demanize marriage’ and ‘day of wreckoning’.

  21. Pupienus said,

    January 13, 2013 at 19:30

    Relevant

  22. Spearhafoc, who waits dreaming in his house at R'lyeh said,

    January 13, 2013 at 20:40

    God never intended that Gary and Larry should be bound in matrimoney.

    Then why did you marry Larry, Gary?

  23. Chris said,

    January 13, 2013 at 20:40

    Middle Americans, especially Middle American men, are losing their connection to marriage, work, religion, and civil society.

    Maybe the reason they’re losing their connections to marriage is because women now have ways to fulfill themselves in society as something other than an extension of their husbands. Maybe all the marriages that aren’t happening are because people simply don’t want to get married; maybe all the marriages that are being broken up are people realizing they made a mistake and not wanting to condemn themselves to live with it for the rest of their lives. Maybe, in other words, losing the “connection” to marriage we had in LeaveItToBeaverstan isn’t actually such a bad thing.

    Maybe the reason we’re losing our connection to work is because we live in a society whose overlords regularly wrack us with crippling economic crises that leave many of us jobless and there is practically zero mechanism to help them cope with it or protect themselves against it anymore. Funny how you don’t seem interested in addressing that.

    Maybe the reason we’re losing our connection to religion is that we’re completely burned out on having our “morality” determined by a group of transparent bigots, charlatans, social climbers and control freaks who use religion as a tool to rule and fuck over their fellow citizens while completely ignoring any of its rules that might apply to them.

    And maybe the reason we’re losing our connection to civil society is that your people have spent the last thirty years smashing every possibly institution of “civil society” in favor of your “me, me, ME!” Thatcher/Reagan utopia where stepping on as many people as possible on your way to the top is seen as a virtue and any investment in human beings as something other than replaceable cogs in the robber barons’ machines is seen as a crime.

    You know, just maybe.

  24. wiley said,

    January 13, 2013 at 20:47

    Oh, where’s the fucking brain bleach! tears through cabinets Where did I leave it? shuffling through bottles and boxes Here it is! Aaaand it’s empty. Shit. Now that image of what K-lo was doing during that interview may stain. Let’s just say it didn’t look like pitching a soft-ball.

  25. Chris said,

    January 13, 2013 at 20:51

    Because many Americans think that family-related matters such as marriage are “private” and not worthy of public attention, or because they think we should celebrate today’s family diversity.

    More like “because many Americans think that family-related matters such as marriage should be talked about in terms of how to help them succeed, whereas the other side of the aisle thinks of them in terms of putting uppity sluts and faggots back in their proper place.”

    We need to renew a marriage-friendly culture

    Good. You can start by letting the people who want to get married actually get married. As you say, there’s not enough marriages in our culture and this can only help the score.

  26. Fenwick said,

    January 13, 2013 at 21:03

    I recommend our Sadly Overlords give Chris a spare key to the castle. Were he to accept it, I contend Chris would make a brilliant now-and-again SN poster.

  27. g said,

    January 13, 2013 at 21:10

    If getting them married successfully is “the social challenge for our times,”

    Kee-rist! Who the fuck talks about “getting them married” as if it was some charge taken on by some patriarchal master?

    Like there are some poor helpless ignorant powerless people who need the helping hand of some wiser master to “get them married.”

    Let’s “get them dressed” and “get them cleaned up” and “get them fattened up” too, while were at it.

    How fucking condescending.

    And what whited sepulchres they are, too. What about K-Lo? Isn’t she single? Let’s work on “getting her married,” how about, before taking on the rest of the population?

  28. Mooser said,

    January 13, 2013 at 21:11

    I plan to lose my connection to work as quickly and as permanantly as I can!

  29. Major Kong said,

    January 13, 2013 at 21:28

    Chris is on a roll today.

  30. DAS said,

    January 13, 2013 at 21:39

    g … that’s one juicily rotten mango you plucked. However, I’d interpret it differently (tho it’s not an either or thing): marriage is something the lower orders need but Straussian/Platonic philosophers like KLo don’t need to get married

  31. DAS said,

    January 13, 2013 at 21:44

    What Chris said. For people of a political stream that hates the very idea of the polis and social obligation to complain about the collapse of interest in civil society is along the lines of pissing in the wind and complaining about the rain.

  32. Strauss and Plato said,

    January 13, 2013 at 21:45

    For shame, sir! Even in ribald jest, we are are deeply offended by our names appearing in the same sentence.

  33. Pupienus said,

    January 13, 2013 at 22:29

    Good. You can start by letting the people who want to get married actually get married. As you say, there’s not enough marriages in our culture and this can only help the score.

    NOOOOOO! That ruins _real_ marriages and makes married people become alcoholics and harm children!

    http://www.capitalgazette.com/maryland_gazette/top_stories/dwyer-opens-up-on-his-drinking-and-recovery/article_980d0633-137d-51bf-bb16-a0381d54db84.html

  34. Pupienus said,

    January 13, 2013 at 23:08

    Difficult choices at Simpatica. The guy next to me had chicken and waffles (with kumquat syrup). It looked reaaaallllly good. But I got the E’s B as I am wont to do. The house Canadian bacon had a perfect smokiness in the background. The bread component was more of a crumpet than EM and it was perfectly griddled. Eggs perfectly poached and a standa huy well done lightly lemony Hollandaise. Small Yukon Gold potatoes, quartered, roasted to a fine turn – slightly crusty but not overcooked. Solid 5 stars.

    Teh Ho got chicken and biscuit with pork gravy. The fried chicken is delightful. The breading includes a bit of almost undetectable cinnamon. What really set it apart was the cardamom kind of up front and center but not overwhelming.

    Even not considering last week’s very disappointing brunch venture – HOW THE FUCK CAN YOU BE A BRUNCH RESTAURANT WITH NO EGGS BENNY?!?!?! – it was a fabulous brunch. With last week in mind I am nearly ecstatic. I chose well.

  35. KWillow said,

    January 13, 2013 at 23:26

    How are children born outside of marriage supposed to be causing poverty?

    Well, raising children is expensive- the more kids the more bills! So obviously having an illegitimate bastard must be even more expensive. Because SLUTS!

  36. KWillow said,

    January 13, 2013 at 23:38

    LOPEZ: What does this have to do with the fiscal cliff or the economy?

    Bastard kids are ALL on welfare & foodstamps. Everyone knows its Welfare, Medicaid and Food stamps that caused the deficit!

    In the 1970s, for instance, this group was more likely to attend church than any other group in the country. But now, for both economic and cultural reasons, Middle Americans are falling behind.

    Gee, what happened in the 1980s that changed our healthy booming economy into a debt/credit-based stagnant low-wage economy?

  37. KWillow said,

    January 13, 2013 at 23:41

    I think Gary Rupert has been reading author Peter DeVries.

  38. Major Kong said,

    January 13, 2013 at 23:53

    Everyone knows its Welfare, Medicaid and Food stamps that caused the deficit!

    Of course. Throw in foreign aid and you’ve got 95% of the budget right there.

  39. Shakezula said,

    January 14, 2013 at 0:46

    60% of Americans don’t have a B.A. and 59.9% of them make better use of their education that Lopez and Wilcocks combined.

  40. John Revolta said,

    January 14, 2013 at 1:32

    I gotcher kumquat syrup.

    Right here.

  41. tigris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 1:42

    That ruins _real_ marriages

    NUH-UH I’m in Mass and my real marriage is FINE.

    and makes married people become alcoholics

    Well OK that’s a fair cop.

  42. Major Kong said,

    January 14, 2013 at 1:53

    and makes married people become alcoholics

    I thought marriage made people become alcoholics?

  43. John Revolta said,

    January 14, 2013 at 2:08

    He drinks because she scolds, he thinks;
    She thinks she scolds because he drinks;
    And nether will admit what’s true,
    That he’s a sot and she’s a shrew.

  44. Joe Max said,

    January 14, 2013 at 2:36

    “People are avoiding getting married while still remaining cohabitating partners and parents because this somehow saves money compared to the literally endless array of benefits and credits they would otherwise earn.”

    As loathe as I am to admit it and give K-Lo any juice, that was the situation my (now) wife and I found ourselves in. We had a daughter, we were not married, and she worked part time. I worked not quite full-time (sometimes) and a sound contractor. As such, as a “single mother”, she qualified for a generous Earned Income Credit (what Ronald Reagan once called the most effective anti-poverty program of all) and that money really helped to pay of the baby-incurred bills every year.

    But when I got a union job (yay!) I was able to put my daughter on my union negotiated (yay again!) health plan, but not her mother. We had become legal Domestic Partners, but only same-sex Domestic Partners, or retirees over 65, qualified under my health plan. If you’re opposite sexes, you have to be legally married. (How’s that for some reverse-discrimination!) So we got married essentially for the health coverage, and together (since I make twice as much as she does) we lost the Earned Income credit.

    Of course, none of this would have mattered if we all had universal health care anyway.

    It’s a strange situation, but it resulted in a very real “marriage penalty” for me.

  45. Bitter Scribe said,

    January 14, 2013 at 2:46

    Has anything with a name like “Institute for American Values” ever come up with an idea that was worth the time it took to listen to it?

  46. Bitter Scribe said,

    January 14, 2013 at 2:52

    I suppose it’s never occurred to this asshole that 1) one of the biggest barriers to marriage, and one of the biggest stressors within it, is lack of financial means and 2) this asshole and his fellow assholes advocate exactly the type of economic policies that lead to the gross income disparities that result in condition (1).

    Also, why didn’t J-Lo just ask the question that’s burning in her breast: “Why can’t I find a husband?”

  47. Shwell Thanksh said,

    January 14, 2013 at 3:49

    This is because many of our public welfare programs — e.g., food stamps — are cut off for low-income families whose income rises above a certain threshold.

    WILCOX: In my view, the biggest thing that President Barack Obama and First Lady Michelle Obama could do is to get behind a public campaign to promote married parenthood raise the income cut-off for public welfare programs — e.g., food stamps — for low-income families

    Fantodded.

  48. Fenwick said,

    January 14, 2013 at 4:04

    why didn’t J-Lo just ask the question that’s burning in her breast: “Why can’t I find a husband?”

    Because all of the ‘questions’ were softballs written well in advance and sent to him. Then he took his sweet time to write the ‘answers’. No-one ‘talks’ like this is a real interview.

    In all likelihood, the only ‘spontaniety’ is the clumsy fiscal cliff Non-Sequitor… perhaps accomplished through a late e-mail exchange. The Non Sequitor appears to have been shoe-horned into the ‘interview’ between the scripted questions. I posit that K-Lo’s lazy editing is the reason for the amazing whiplash into the fiscal cliff Non-Sequitor.

  49. Shwell Thanksh said,

    January 14, 2013 at 4:09

    But at the end of the day, what this interview really deserves is a Nerf bat non-sequitur.

  50. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 4:13

    This neglect may change in the wake of the recent presidential election, insofar as Republicans have realized the cost of neglecting the welfare of Middle Americans.

    Of course, the Republicans have been actively attacking any policies that would benefit Middle Americans for the past 30 years, but K-Lo conveniently papers over this fact.

  51. Pupienus said,

    January 14, 2013 at 4:30

    If you’re opposite sexes, you have to be legally married. (How’s that for some reverse-discrimination!)

    It might be reverse discrimination if same sex couples could get married. I would say something about yet another WTF health care shouldn’t depend on where you work, single payer, yada yada.

    Didja see the recent studies that prove what asswipes we are as a polity for our bullshit health care system (such as it is) in YOO ESS AIIIIEEEEEEE

  52. Maybe the Eggman said,

    January 14, 2013 at 4:33

    In the 1970s, for instance, this group was more likely to attend church than any other group in the country. But now, for both economic and cultural reasons, Middle Americans are falling behind.–

    Speaking of Church and evangelicals, their popularity is strongly off since BushCo tanked the economy in ’07. I guess those Evangelical churches are against “welfare” in declining economic times even for their own members, like used to happen in the days before big gubmint. And people don’t have time for feelin’ good w/ psuedo-Christian rock and self help when they have to go line up for piddling benefits or work three jobs to scrape by . . .

    But yes, marriage is an unqualified social good, if not for any other reason, than because at the very least at least half of them result in: Divorce! And you may be a sadder but you will also be a much wiser person after a divorce (or two or three), and less distracted by Castles of the Air visions of fulfillment with your “other half”, “the One that will make Everything Right,” etc.

    Hell, Newt is no “Middle American” what w/ his multiple degrees and honoraria, lobbying and speaking fees, the multiple marriages and divorces and adulteries and what-not, but he is a Wise Man, at least according to my television set and the MSM. And the wonderful word salad “analyzed” (as much as word salad can be) above does at least remind me of one “wise” thing he once said, that Right-wing social engineering is likely as bad as Left-wing social engineering. (Of course, that’s assuming that anything remotely “left wing” has been accepted or practiced in American politics in the last 4 decades, but let’s not get into that can of worms right now.)

    Coo coo ca choo, SadlyNauts! I’m going out to meet someone and look into getting another marriage going so I’ll feel like a member of the community.

  53. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 4:35

    John Revolta said,

    January 14, 2013 at 1:32

    I gotcher kumquat syrup.

    Right here.

    Hilarious! You left an almost identical comment at my place almost a year ago. For the record, I have a well-nigh insatiable greed for kumquats.

  54. tensor said,

    January 14, 2013 at 4:46

    They’ve been flogging this “marriage gets you out of poverty,” dreck for awhile now. You know what else gets you out of poverty, J-lo? Higher education one can actually afford, living in a country with a decent distribution of income, and not having rich fools shipping family-wage jobs overseas whilst stashing the loot in offshore bank accounts. You know what keeps a straight woman out of poverty while she’s single, J-lo? Contraception and safe, legal abortion. Get back to us when NRO supports all those things, J-lo.

    Also, if marriage has such great benefits for all, why not extend it to gays?

    (Others have covered these topics, above, better than I just did, but I figured I’d take a whack at it.)

  55. DAS said,

    January 14, 2013 at 5:26

    That’s why Iike Sadly, No. Where else could I find other people who like kumquats? Yum! Kumquats … we actually had a kumquat tree when I was growing up

  56. Smut Clyde said,

    January 14, 2013 at 5:28

    In the 1970s, for instance, this group was more likely to attend church than any other group in the country. But now, for both economic and cultural reasons, Middle Americans are falling behind.–

    So the group of people carved out of current American demographics by some arbitrary criteria do not behave entirely like the completely different group of people obtained by imposing the same criteria on the population of 40 years ago. Who’d have thought?

    They are not “falling behind”. They are completely different people. Evidently Wilcox cannot tell the illusion of motion (produced, for instance, when he closes his eyes and moves before opening them again) from real movement.

  57. jim the heretical anti-cliff lemming said,

    January 14, 2013 at 6:12

    Oh, K-Lo you sassy beast … still giving surrealism a bad name.

  58. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 6:26

    That’s why Iike Sadly, No. Where else could I find other people who like kumquats? Yum! Kumquats … we actually had a kumquat tree when I was growing up

    I’m so jealous!!! Not that the mulberry tree of my youth was anything to sneeze at.

  59. parsec said,

    January 14, 2013 at 6:39

    I don’t believe I’ve ever had a kumquat. Is it a goer, wink, nudge, know what I mean? Is it like bacon or play-doh?

    Wot’s it like?

  60. Polly said,

    January 14, 2013 at 6:46

    What i don’t understood is in fact how you are now not actually much more smartly-appreciated than you might be right now. You are very intelligent. You realize therefore significantly on the subject of this matter, produced me individually consider it from numerous numerous angles. Its like women and men don’t seem to be fascinated until it’s something to do with Woman gaga! Your individual stuffs excellent. Always take care of it up!

  61. John Revolta said,

    January 14, 2013 at 7:29

    Hey! I gotcher kumquat tree………………………………….

    oh. heh heh. never mind.

  62. Another Kiwi said,

    January 14, 2013 at 7:31

    Ok it’s kumquats and women’s gaga night is it? I’ll just sit over here and do the crossword.

  63. Snorghagen said,

    January 14, 2013 at 7:35

    The joy of kumquat liqueur.

  64. Spearhafoc, who waits dreaming in his house at R'lyeh said,

    January 14, 2013 at 8:04

    Here’s a black and white photoset of Christina Hendricks posing with a bow and arrows.

    That is all.

  65. Pupienus said,

    January 14, 2013 at 8:05

    300 cum eunuch quatloos on the newcomer!

  66. John Revolta said,

    January 14, 2013 at 8:27

    Under a spreading kumquat tree
    The village smith, he frolics
    The smith, a mighty man is he
    With large and sinewy
    what? too soon?

  67. Spearhafoc, who waits dreaming in his house at R'lyeh said,

    January 14, 2013 at 8:44

    Oh there once was a swagman camped in the billabong, Under the shade of a kumquat tree…

  68. Another Kiwi said,

    January 14, 2013 at 9:12

    Don’t kumquat that joint, my friend.

  69. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 9:52

    Here’s a black and white photoset of Christina Hendricks posing with a bow and arrows.

    I ain’t saying she ain’t pretty, but there’s room for only one cute redheaded archer in my browser bookmarks.

  70. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 9:53

    I don’t believe I’ve ever had a kumquat. Is it a goer, wink, nudge, know what I mean? Is it like bacon or play-doh?

    Wot’s it like?

    Think of it as a tiny inside-out clementine- thick sweet rind, astringent pulp.

  71. smut clyde said,

    January 14, 2013 at 10:27

    Under a spreading kumquat tree
    The village smith, he frolics

    The rhyming possibilities of ‘prolix’ are sadly unexplored.

  72. Anonymous said,

    January 14, 2013 at 13:01

    You can have my kumquats 4B, they’re falling on the ground with the satsumas, it’s been all I can do to keep up with the Meyer lemons and the Marsh grapefruit. My friend’s Marsh tree in the Tremé, less than ten years old, put out three bushels this year; that requires a lot of vodka.

  73. El Manquécito said,

    January 14, 2013 at 13:03

    Anonymous is me, you can tell by the vodka.

  74. El Manquécito said,

    January 14, 2013 at 14:36

    And as far as restaurant brunches go, I was at Galatoire’s for 12th night at noon, sweetbreads and eggs sardou, champers, terrific gab, hard to beat.

  75. JohnR said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:22

    Are you really appreciating Gary as much as you should? I ask you – ‘”runeing” this once great country’? Now that’s some first-rate work there. I can’t decide whether it’s a Hobbit shout-out or Gary’s a Norse-lover, but either way it’s good. Also, too “day of wreckoning” (!) You don’t throw around little playful languageisms like that unless you’re having fun.
    Incidentally, I’m deeply offended at the J-Lo/K-Lo confusion above. Jennifer Lopez may not be Shakira (mmmm), but she’s not chopped liver, either. Katherine Lopez, on the other hand, ranks somewhere way down lower than chopped liver on the appetizing scale. She doesn’t even have Katisha’s elbow to recommend her.

  76. Pryme said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:26

    Oh, no, Bill Kristol; I don’t know anyone who tried to push legislation based on an issue they never campaigned on. Ever.

  77. tigris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:32

    According to Bloody Bill Kristol, they’re only going to feel compelled to work with him on legislation that he campaigned on.

    So why are they fighting tax rate increases on the wealthy? Also too every other damn thing he campaigned on.

  78. DAS said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:35

    Once, when I was in grad school (I know … one time in band camp …), I brought jerk chicken for lunch. Knowing my taste for the fruit, someone asked if there were any kumquats in it. Someone else, um, piled on, asking about mayonnaise. I thus vowed the next time I made jerk chicken, I would use kumquats and mayonnaise and other ingredients (I forget the entire list) to make the dish as pervy to describe as possible. The dish came out decently, but it wasn’t quite a hit.

    It was altogether funny though.

  79. DAS said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:38

    I’m so jealous!!! Not that the mulberry tree of my youth was anything to sneeze at. – BBBB

    Unless you are allergic to mulberries ( / rimshot ). Actually in Queens we are swimming in mulberry trees. I dunno if I’d eat anything off of a tree growing in someone’s yard not too far from a major highway in Central Queens though. Who knows what that plant has absorbed into its system. Can’t be all that bad though: the squirrels and pigeons seem to survive ok.

  80. El Manquécito said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:44

    You could always raise silkworms, I’m sure there’s a big localwore movement in Brooklyn.

  81. Chris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:51

    Am not seeking castle keys at this time but appreciate all compliments nonetheless -

    Speaking of Church and evangelicals, their popularity is strongly off since BushCo tanked the economy in ’07. I guess those Evangelical churches are against “welfare” in declining economic times even for their own members, like used to happen in the days before big gubmint. And people don’t have time for feelin’ good w/ psuedo-Christian rock and self help when they have to go line up for piddling benefits or work three jobs to scrape by . . .

    I see the same logical flaw in church charities that I do in all private charities – they’re voluntary. Which means that when the economy goes south, the rich people who were happy to feed the poor (tuppence a bag) during the good years are suddenly going to clam up because they “can’t” “afford” indulge that old pastime anymore and they have to think about their own fortunes first. So the supply of money feeding charities dries up exactly when the need for it skyrockets.

    Didn’t know the fundies’ popularity was waning, but I’m delighted to hear it. Maybe that explains why the Catholics are the ones who’ve taken the lead in the anti-Obama campaigns of the religious right these past few years.

  82. Chris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 17:55

    Incidentally, I’m deeply offended at the J-Lo/K-Lo confusion above. Jennifer Lopez may not be Shakira (mmmm), but she’s not chopped liver, either. Katherine Lopez, on the other hand, ranks somewhere way down lower than chopped liver on the appetizing scale. She doesn’t even have Katisha’s elbow to recommend her.

    Hell yes to your Shakira statement.

  83. Pupienus said,

    January 14, 2013 at 18:56

    The rhyming possibilities of ‘prolix’ are sadly unexplored.

    I have a friend from Frolix 8.

  84. Woodrowfan said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:26

    whenever you talk about K-Lo for some reason I flash back to the CSI about the large woman’s convention and the dead “chubby chaser.”

  85. Pupienus said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:34

    Second try, after having coffee.

    Arena poetry slam!
    Dueling symbolics!
    Enter from prolix gate (run by hydraulics)
    Join Our Friends From Frolix 8

  86. Snorghagen said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:34

    Not one of you kumquat-chompers is man enough to live in the Citadel.

    Marxists, Socialists, Liberals, and Establishment Republicans may find that living within our Citadel Community is incompatible with their existing ideology and preferred lifestyles.

    Don’t want no Neo-Maoists like Paul Ryan or Eric Cantor.

    We are in the process of selecting the ideal location among the beautiful mountains of Idaho in the American Redoubt.

    That’s just south of Berchtesgaden.

    Via Balloon Juice.

  87. tigris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:41

    Just heard on a local Boston radio show that Krazy Keith Ablow is considering running for senator. Oh Lord, let it be true.

  88. Willy said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:43

    Not one of you kumquat-chompers is man enough to live in the Citadel.

    Anyone else find it weird that you have to apply for residence in this bastion of LIBERTEE? What liberty?

    The Citadel is Liberty-driven

    Liberty is the bastard offspring of Toonces.

  89. Pupienus said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:44

    Middle Americans, especially Middle American men, are losing their connection to marriage, work, religion, and civil society.

    According to recent studies/polls, younger Americans cast off their connections (if they had them in the first place) in large part because the christian supremacists worked so hard against a civil society. The “nones” are quite turned off by religion precisely because KLo and her ilk injected their religious crusades into politics. Keep up the good work Lopez and Wilcox. Here’s hoping you never figure out that you keep shooting yourselves in your feet.

    http://www.pewforum.org/unaffiliated/nones-on-the-rise.aspx

  90. Major Kong said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:51

    Not one of you kumquat-chompers is man enough to live in the Citadel.

    I wonder how long before this degenerates into BioShock?

  91. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:58

    comment mango:
    In my case as well I didn’t find a higher paying job, quite the reverse, I took a lower paying job but found Jesus Christ. With him as my guide I have found my desire to be the provider for my family fulfilled.

    that there is truly delightful…

  92. tigris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 19:58

    The “nones” are quite turned off by religion precisely because KLo and her ilk injected their religious crusades into politics.

    And because they injected their political crusades into religion. Klo et al really have the Merdas touch.

  93. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:00

    also, too…pat robertson so helpfully defines who the real enemy of marriage is…

  94. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:07

    omg…those citadelians are amazing pitch people:

    You select the facade for the exterior of your home. You are responsible for completing the interior of your home as you wish. You may choose to do the work yourself, or hire contractors. But every single detail, from paint to tiles to counters, is your choice.

    for truly! man has never experienced such freedoms!

  95. Whale Chowder said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:14

    there’s room for only one cute redheaded archer

    She’s a walking argument for quiver capacity limits, she is.

  96. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:27

    Unless you are allergic to mulberries ( / rimshot ). Actually in Queens we are swimming in mulberry trees.

    You could always raise silkworms, I’m sure there’s a big localwore movement in Brooklyn.

    Here in Bastard Central, the Yonkers/Bronx border region, some guy tried to start a silk industry, so he planted a fuckton of mulberry trees. I always gorge myself on mulberries and put up mulberry preserves in June. In July, it’s wineberries, little “feral” raspberries.

  97. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:28

    She’s a walking argument for quiver capacity limits, she is.

    Hur hur, I’d get all “quiverfull” with her, to be sure.

  98. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:29

    Klo et al really have the Merdas touch.

    High five!

  99. Pryme said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:31

    I don’t know how I began receiving emails from “Conservative Contact Alerts” but it has given me some…insight…into the mind of a conservative:

    Dear Patriot,

    With the way our government is heading it could only be a matter of days until you kiss your second amendment rights goodbye.

    But here’s the question…

    Do you know how to defend your family using nothing but primitive weapons?

    Click the link below to see the truth about 21 deadly weapons the government could NEVER take away:

    http://www.survivallife.com/primitive-weapons-4752

    See with the way things are heating up between North Korea, Iran and the everyday threat of a terrorist attack you could need to defend your family sooner than you think.

    And in a disaster situation can you guess what one of the first things to go is going to be?

    AMMO.

    Which means you’ll be forced to rely on the same kind of weapons our ancestors used for thousands of years…

    Weapons that a small group of men would use to hunt and kill anything from a wild elephant to a lion!

    Click the link below to discover the truth about these 21 long-forgotten weapons:

    http://www.survivallife.com/primitive-weapons-4752

    Remember, we’re all in this together!

    ‘Above Average’ Joe
    Survival Life

    P.S. Be sure to pay attention to the one thing NEVER to do with a glass bottle… and how to make it into a 9-knife weapon instead!

    http://www.survivallife.com/primitive-weapons-4752

    P.P.S. You’ve already got 6 weapons hiding in your garage (not power tools). Don’t be left helpless if the government ever decides to confiscate your guns.

    Um…”Wolverines?”

  100. DAS said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:33

    Here in Bastard Central, the Yonkers/Bronx border region, some guy tried to start a silk industry, so he planted a fuckton of mulberry trees. I always gorge myself on mulberries and put up mulberry preserves in June. In July, it’s wineberries, little “feral” raspberries. – BBBB

    Some of our mulberry trees think they are strangler figs and take over other trees. Meanwhile, some of the hedges on our apartment grounds are being taken-over by wineberries (so that’s what those are called!). In some cases the maintainance staff is trying valiently to keep the encroaching bambles (which effectively are growing as vines) at bay, but for a few hedges, they’ve just let the vines take over.

  101. tigris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:36

    also, too…pat robertson so helpfully defines who the real enemy of marriage is…

    The guy who looks like an enormous ugly baby left in the bath about 18 years too long is blaming ugly spouses for cooling marriages? He brags about being married 58 years, when did his wife go blind?

  102. El Manquécito said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:37

    Surely whineberries have a place in the NRO Cruise breakfast buffet.

  103. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:48

    He brags about being married 58 years, when did his wife go blind?

    and why is he reading maxim magazine?

  104. El Manquécito said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:50

    You’ve already got 6 weapons hiding in your garage (not power tools)

    Let’s see, fear, surprise, ruthless efficiency, maybe but I moved the comfy chair out to the shop.

  105. smut clyde said,

    January 14, 2013 at 20:51

    some guy tried to start a silk industry, so he planted a fuckton of mulberry trees.

    I think El Manquécito wants you to eat them.

  106. Pryme said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:01

    and why is he reading shouting, “Oh god, oh god release the demons” while sweating over a maxim magazine?

    Fix-licious!

  107. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:09

    I think El Manquécito wants you to eat them.

    and why is he reading shouting, “Oh god, oh god release the demons” while sweating over a maxim magazine?

    thank you both for ruining lunch…probably forever…

  108. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:11

    Complaint:

    Any objective viewer would tell you the HBO telefilm “Game Change” was a mess, a poorly orchestrated hit piece on Sarah Palin that bordered on parody while pretending to tell a political cautionary tale.

    That isn’t stopping the entertainment industry from heaping award atop award on the film.

    Tonight, the Golden Globes gave “Game Change” three major prizes – best television movie/miniseries, best actor and best actress in a television movie or miniseries.

    [...]

    Can you imagine a reporter ever asking a Democrat what newspapers he or she reads?

    How stupid is the Democrat?

    Also, EVEN NOW, hahahahahahHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

  109. smut clyde said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:14

    Via Steve M @ NoMoreMisterNice: Citadel Self-Internment Camp scam turns out to be run by a convicted professional extortionist and grifter. Now promoted by Fox Nation.

  110. El Manquécito said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:19

    The Towers and Curtain Wall providing the town’s primary perimeter defense will be inaccessible to tourists.

    Sadly this will limit the number of amateur artists attempting, H Bosch like, to capture the extravagant dystopia within.

  111. Pryme said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:21

    Can you imagine a reporter ever asking a Democrat what newspapers he or she reads?

    Maybe if they would actually invite some Democrats on their Sunday shows we’d find out.

  112. Major Kong said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:22

    Residents are expected to agree to a “Patriot Agreement”

    So how are they going to enforce compliance with this “Patriot Agreement”?

    Some sort of central government with jack-booted thugs?

  113. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:26

    Surely whineberries have a place in the NRO Cruise breakfast buffet.

    They seem more like Eaters of Dingleberries… at least their readers do.

    I think El Manquécito wants you to eat them.

    I’ve indulged in entomophagy, but I’ve never paid for the privilege. These suckers taste like celery-flavored M&Ms (crunchy outer shells you know), but they make an awful racket until you bite their heads off.

  114. Pryme said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:27

    Re: Smut’s link, the patriot agreement:

    Every able-bodied Patriot aged 13 and older governed by this Agreement shall annually demonstrate proficiency with a handgun of choice by hitting a man-sized steel target at 25 yards with open sights at the Citadel range. Each Resident shall have 10 shots and must hit the target at least 7 times.

    Glad they plan on teaching teens to be responsible; I mean, sometimes shooting a human four, five or six times just doesn’t do the job.

    Also, this idea was better when it was a movie called “The Village.” And that’s saying a lot.

  115. Major Kong said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:29

    I think El Manquécito wants you to eat them.

    I’ve been to survival school. Insects are highly overrated as a snack food.

  116. smut clyde said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:35

    The Towers and Curtain Wall providing the town’s primary perimeter defense will be inaccessible to tourists.
    Sadly this will limit the number of amateur artists attempting, H Bosch like, to capture the extravagant dystopia within.

    No credit to Niven and Pournelle for inspiration but the guy is after all a grifter.

    I for one would welcome Boschland as a theme-park but Ian Watson had the idea first.

  117. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:57

    The Towers and Curtain Wall providing the town’s primary perimeter defense will be inaccessible to tourists.

    wait…now i haz a confooze? under the ‘revenue’ tab, you will find this:

    Additionally, the Citadel intends to become a premiere tourist destination for Americans from sea-to-sea and border-to-border. Not only will tourists travel to see the only real fortified castle & town in America, we intend to offer numerous attractions including a firearms museum where enthusiasts actually get to fire their favorite arms from history!

    When tourists choose to stay at the Citadel for a while they may also take advantage of our RV parks, quaint and comfortable bed & breakfast establishments, or high-end hotels. The panhandle of Idaho is renowned for its scenic beauty, notably rugged mountains and rolling hills. It is among one of America’s most superbly beautiful landscapes. Whatever the season, you will find numerous recreational activities. Indulge in boating and other forms of water sports. Enjoy world-class fishing on Lake Coeur d’Alene or on many other lakes, rivers, and high-mountain streams. There are trails for hiking, picturesque paths for strolling, as well as places ideal for biking or horseback riding. The Idaho panhandle has also earned a stellar reputation for champion hunting and deluxe skiing!

  118. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 21:58

    Sadly this will limit the number of amateur artists attempting, H Bosch like, to capture the extravagant dystopia within.

    also, too…i imagine that mcnaughton dude is already signed up…as would t. kinkade were he not dead…

  119. Major Kong said,

    January 14, 2013 at 22:01

    The Towers and Curtain Wall providing the town’s primary perimeter defense

    Because of course, towers and curtain walls have historically proven impregnable.

  120. bbkf said,

    January 14, 2013 at 22:04

    Because of course, towers and curtain walls have historically proven impregnable.

    if they do the math correctly…

  121. smut clyde said,

    January 14, 2013 at 22:04

    These suckers taste like celery-flavored M&Ms
    Present for BBBB!

    Enjoy world-class fishing on Lake Coeur d’Alene
    Teh Whackyweedia reveals how far back the links go between Lake Coeur d’Alene and abject stupidity:

    There are a number of Ford Model T automobiles sitting on the bottom of the lake, due to people in the early 1900s who would drive across the lake during the winter time in order to save half the distance in getting around the lake.

  122. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 22:12

    Every able-bodied Patriot aged 13 and older governed by this Agreement shall annually demonstrate proficiency with a handgun of choice by hitting a man-sized steel target at 25 yards with open sights at the Citadel range. Each Resident shall have 10 shots and must hit the target at least 7 times.

    The coming of age ceremony for boys will be a Nutbar Mitzvah, for girls, a Batshit Mitzvah.

  123. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 14, 2013 at 22:16

    I’ve been to survival school. Insects are highly overrated as a snack food.

    I dunno- crickets have a not-unpleasant nutty flavor and ants have a piquant tang due to the formic acid content.

    Present for BBBB!

    That’s like the arthropod equivalent of huitlacoche, aka corn smut… any connection, Mr Clyde, if that is your real name?

  124. El Manquécito said,

    January 14, 2013 at 22:43

    in order to save half the distance in getting around the lake.

    Lake must not be pi shaped.

  125. Chris said,

    January 14, 2013 at 23:01

    Via Steve M @ NoMoreMisterNice: Citadel Self-Internment Camp scam turns out to be run by a convicted professional extortionist and grifter. Now promoted by Fox Nation.

    The most fantastic use of “a fool and his money are soon parted” I’ve seen to date.

    It saves us the trouble of having to gerrymander them out of relevance, too.

    So how are they going to enforce compliance with this “Patriot Agreement”?

    Some sort of central government with jack-booted thugs?

    Yeah, that was my first thought too. So, here’s a monument to citizens’ right to bear arms. As our first order of business: citizens MUST bear arms, whether they want to or not. As the antichrist character in Narnia so pithily put it, “true freedom means doing what I tell you.”

    Because of course, towers and curtain walls have historically proven impregnable.

    Oh, to be a fly on the office wall of the Supreme Commander of the One-World Government Conspiracy for a New World Order when he hears this news.

    “How thoughtful of these Second Amendment types to all gather in one spot far away from civilization! I was going to have to wipe them out one at a time by sending my Jackbooted Thugs on a house-to-house search of the area. But now all I have to do is napalm them all with my Black Helicopters of Doom and not even have to worry about the bad press from collateral damage! The only way this could possibly get any better is if they’d put up a big Batman-type Bullseye-Signal over the compound to guide my pilots to the target, but I think we’ll manage without it.”

  126. g said,

    January 14, 2013 at 23:34

    including a firearms museum where enthusiasts actually get to fire their favorite arms from history!

    So tourists will be firing blunderbusses? I’m sure that will go over well. Their liability insurance premium is going to go through the roof!

    You know, it’s costly enough in terms of risk management just to operate a public swimming pool. Imagine an attraction where the ticket-paying public gets to experiment with gunpowder, explosives, projectiles and poorly engineered obsolete weapons!

  127. Major Kong said,

    January 14, 2013 at 23:40

    . Imagine an attraction where the ticket-paying public gets to experiment with gunpowder, explosives, projectiles and poorly engineered obsolete weapons!

    Um, excuse me, but there’s a Mister Darwin over here who’d like a word with you.

  128. Bitter Scribe said,

    January 14, 2013 at 23:49

    Citadel Self-Internment Camp scam turns out to be run by a convicted professional extortionist and grifter.

    This is a tragedy. I was so looking forward to seeing a bunch of malcontent knuckleheads, seething with resentment and armed to the teeth, in a remote location with restricted ingress (and egress). With nothing but patience and some well-placed cameras and mikes, we’d have what would undoubtedly become the bloodiest reality show of all time.

  129. Thread Bear said,

    January 14, 2013 at 23:59

    Every able-bodied Patriot aged 13 and older governed by this Agreement shall annually demonstrate proficiency with a handgun of choice by hitting taunting in a ridiculous French accent a man-sized steel target at 25 yards with open sights at the Citadel range. Each Resident shall have 10 shots taunts and must hit the target at least 7 times.

    They may also be asked to show proficency with cowtapults.

  130. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:07

    OK, now I’m interested, my ridiculous French accent is formidable.

  131. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:08

    Though I’m better with an onager…

  132. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:16

    Tigris: So you’ve been through an onager management program?

  133. bbkf said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:26

    This is a tragedy. I was so looking forward to seeing a bunch of malcontent knuckleheads, seething with resentment and armed to the teeth, in a remote location with restricted ingress (and egress). With nothing but patience and some well-placed cameras and mikes, we’d have what would undoubtedly become the bloodiest reality show of all time.

    right? i think we can all agree that caribou barbie would make an excellent narrator for the series…

    unless we go with thread bear’s french accent tauntathon…then we would have to go with john cleese…

  134. bbkf said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:27

    Tigris: So you’ve been through an onager management program?

    did you hear ‘ba da dum!’ when you typed that?

  135. Thread Bear said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:35

    The coolest thing about The Citidel community, with every citizen armed, is that there will be absolutely no need for a police force. That will be a big savings in taxes.

  136. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:41

    Because of course, towers and curtain walls have historically proven impregnable.

    Well-designed, well-built, well-provisioned, and properly garrisoned medieval castles were nearly impregnableery few castles fell to direct assault. Treachery and starvation were far more common means of

  137. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 0:43

    Fuck you WP. WP was TOTALLY responsible for activating the ‘Submit Comment’ button before the comment was finished !!! Not gonna finish it, though; you should be able to decipher is easily enough.

  138. The Citadel (no, not that pansy military academy, neither!) said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:02

    there’s a Mister Darwin over here who’d like a word with you.

    Evolution is a fraud. Darwin was a pliant tool of the Hanseatic Ports propaganda machine. Fuck Darwin. I believe in Smith and Wesson.

  139. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:06

    I believe in Smith and Wesson.

    They make a good oil.

  140. Katherine Jean Lopez said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:09

    Drapetomania!

  141. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:10

    The coolest thing about The Citidel community, with every citizen armed, is that there will be absolutely no need for a police force. That will be a big savings in taxes.

    I kind of want this thing to “work…” well, to last – because I’d be pretty entertained by the process of watching these guys slowly, painfully, stupidly reinvent the wheel. First unsolved murder in town makes them rediscover why people invented Po-leece Departments. First time anything needs to be built or rebuilt reminds them why people invented “taxes.” First major natural disaster makes them re-discover why people call on the federal government to involve itself in local affairs… etc, etc, etc.

    Of course that’s giving them way too much credit. The unsolved murder would probably be blamed on outsiders, the federal government or whoever’s the least popular man in town, and any major question like how to address disaster relief or construction would have them shrug, say “fucked if I know” and move back to society. But still, I’d be pretty amused if my initial thought held true.

  142. bughunter, catching up on his short lunch break, said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:10

    Kumquats: We have a kumquat shrub. Mrs bughunter makes kumquat marmalade (really kumquat/grapefruit marmalade since there’s very little pith on a kumquat). I created a gin martini using this marmalade that I dubbed “Paraquat” — 2 oz gin, 1Tbs marmalade, juice of 1/4 lime. Muddle the marmalade and lime juice in a cocktail shaker with a wooden spoon, add ice and gin, shake, serve up garnished with a slice of kumquat.)

    I read about Citadel a month or so ago. I thought it was a good idea… I think we should send all the gun nuts there, and lock the gates from the outside. (This was inspired by a SF novel where this was done with the entire state of Texas… I can’t remember the author unfortunately… Heinlein? R. A. Wilson? Google is no help… too many other hits for “texas+hell”.)

    Finally: I fear this will delay the regrowth of many bushes for another decade or two. As a fan of the well-maintained patch of pubes, I have mixed feelings about this news.

  143. bughunter, catching up on his short lunch break, said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:11

    WP was TOTALLY responsible for activating the ‘Submit Comment’ button before the comment was finished

    I learned the hard way that an errant TAB followed by striking the spacebar will result in a premature

  144. bughunter said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:12

    But the tagfail is indeed WP’s fault.

  145. smut clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:14

    any major question like how to address disaster relief or construction would have them shrug, say “fucked if I know” and move back to society

    Forgive me if I am mistaken, but how does this differ from the response of the US as a nation?

  146. bbkf said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:29

    First unsolved murder in town makes them rediscover why people invented Po-leece Departments.

    oh jeepers…i just read a bunch of that site…they do not plan on having a police force because they will try to settle any disputes by an arbitration committee and they will depend on county and/or city police departments to uphold law and order…

    here’s something that gave me pause (well, the whole thing gives me pause):
    One: Once ratified, this list of conditions may only be altered by unanimous consent of all parties governed by this Agreement, i.e. full-time Residents. Full-time residency will be defined by a select panel of full-time Residents who will also establish guidelines for acceptable exceptions for absences.

    hmmmmmmm…who selects the select panel of full time residents? i got the feeling from their blog that the patriots who are sending in their money right fucking now are expecting to be revered as founders and are expecting some sort of special treatment…i have a feeling they may need the po-leece sooner than they think…

    but really, their whole thing is kinda brill, actually…they literally say, ‘we have no real plans, just a bunch of discussions and suggestions and everyone affiliated with this project are volunteers, so if we can’t answer your questions, sorry! the volunteers are overwhelmed due to all the positivie patriotism and are busy, busy busy discussing and suggesting and what not…but we hope to buy some land and build, but who knows if it will happen…gosh, we sure hope it does, but it might not, you know…’ and people are sending them money…

  147. bbkf said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:33

    any major question like how to address disaster relief or construction would have them shrug, say “fucked if I know” and move back to society

    oh, you sillies! one of the precepts is that each and every patriot who lives in the citadel and outside it’s borders is required to have enough food and water and whatnot to be able to live for a year on…also, too…the houses are poured concrete and the layout of the citadel is such that haha mother nature, can’t destroy us! and such, they are not worried about puny mother nature…oh, no…their main concern is man-made disasters like economic collapse…and gun control…

    THE CITADEL FEARS AND NEEDS NO ONE BUT ITSELF…

  148. Major Kong said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:34

    Well-designed, well-built, well-provisioned, and properly garrisoned medieval castles were nearly impregnable few castles fell to direct assault.

    Right up until the invention of artillery.

  149. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:36

    Ah. BBKF dashes my hopes. So basically, it’s just yet another conservative “we want the government to get off our lawns but we still fully expect it to continue providing any and all services we may require for it” phoniness.

    Disappointed? Yes. Surprised? Not even remotely.

  150. Whale Chowder said,

    January 15, 2013 at 1:40

    I fear this will delay the regrowth of many bushes for another decade or two.

    Hm. This changes my assumptions about you based on your nym…substantially.

  151. Snorghagen said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:14

    medieval castles were nearly impregnable…
    - – - – - – -
    Right up until the invention of artillery.

    The important thing is that Citadel residents will be secure against attacks by hordes armed with nerf bats.

  152. smut clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:23

    medieval castles were nearly impregnable…
    - – – – – – -
    Right up until the invention of artillery.

    For values of “artillery” that include “Mamluks with big trebuchets”.

  153. bughunter said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:29

    The important thing is that Citadel residents will be secure against attacks by liberals and other vermin armed with subversive ideas like tolerance and charity.

  154. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:32

    All homes will be built of poured concrete for exceptional strength and durability. Your home will be built to your specs (details available at this website) with utilities stubbed to the interior. You select the facade for the exterior of your home. You are responsible for completing the interior of your home as you wish. You may choose to do the work yourself, or hire contractors. But every single detail, from paint to tiles to counters, is your choice.

    I don’t see any problem at all. You want a couple of big picture windows overlooking the spectacular Idaho scenery? Go right ahead! It’s your choice. Never mind about creating a vulnerable point in the defense.

    I’m not sure how the homes will be of ‘exceptional strength and durability’ if they are built to the resident’s specs. Poured concrete is okay for folks on a budget: who needs rebar?

    Anyway the Citadel will surely be an marvel for tourists to look at with all the colorful and architectural diverse exteriors! Stucco check-to-jowl with faux half-timbered facades. Concrete bunker-like ‘brutalist’ facades (N_B can esplane) with narrow machine-gun traverses and razor-wire garlands …smack-dab against a Victorian whimsey loaded with gingerbread!

    The ‘artist’s view’, which looks suspiciously like hastily cobbled-together clip-art, shows some trees and shrubs growing at the foot of the Curtain. Doesn’t matter if the trees mask fields of fire…It’s your choice! (The shrubbery also seems to contradict the key tenet of castle design tenet: Always protect the base of the wall.)

    The ‘artist’ portrays the Citadel’s entrance–usually the weakest point of a fortress–with a genteel Georgian facade including a pillared portico along the front. (Doesn’t the roof of the portico create ‘dead ground’?). The gatehouse also has some large windows, presumably so the defenders have a clear view of the attackers.)

    Only really poor Patriots should invest in the condos built into the Curtain Wall itself. There are NO exterior windows at all! (I’m not sure how this squares with residents’ total control of their homes.)

    The ‘artist’s view’ of the Citadel has other innovative and unusual design features: The Towers are NOT located at the vulnerable corners of the Curtain, which is most curious: a wall’s re-entrant angle is notoriously vulnerable to under-mining. But at least the Towers have splendid panoramic windows, so essential to all fortresses, ancient and modern.

  155. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:34

    If you have trebuchet-fired tolerance and charity I would be interested in your website or newsletter.

  156. Whale Chowder said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:39

    If you have trebuchet-fired tolerance and charity I would be interested in your website or newsletter.

    Tolerance and charity are usually the purview of the sappers and introduced via trenches-and-tunnels, to…er…sap the enemy’s will and precious bodily fluids.

  157. S. cerevisiae said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:39

    They are rooting for the rest of us to go all Mad Max and the hordes of blah people and messicans attacking the walls.

  158. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:39

    We’ll see about impregnable citadels once I find the astroglide.

  159. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:41

    utilities stubbed to the interior

    This confuses me. What entity provides the utilities and maintains them? Will there be gas bills and electric bills? Are residents responsible for installing and maintaining their own utilities? Will there be a Citadal Sanitation Department, or will residents throw their trash out of their picture windows?

    Finally, I gotta say that a walled city occupied by 3,000 – 7,000 people is NOT going to be easy to provision !

  160. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:48

    Right up until the invention of artillery.

    Duh.

  161. Helmut Monotreme said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:53

    Who wants to open a “hands on” artillery museum five or 10 miles from the citadel?

  162. bughunter said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:55

    a walled city occupied by 3,000 – 7,000 people is NOT going to be easy to provision

    Aye, that is going to be one spectacular failure of a community. The only people willing to live among that kind of inconvenience are going to be such nutjobs that the place will be a true hive of scum and villany.

    I imagine that some very sad stories will come out of it, too, because these people will bring their children…

  163. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 2:59

    Right up until the invention of artillery.

    Perhaps they should use a Vauban design…
    http://www.google.com/search?q=vauban+fortress+design&hl=en&client=safari&tbo=d&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=pKn0UJTIMuy50AHnqIHgAw&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA&biw=1285&bih=986

    I’m too lazy today to provide links today. Also got some non-Sadlyville stuiff I must do. Have fun, y’all!

  164. bughunter said,

    January 15, 2013 at 3:07

    Thinking on it some more, I’m realizing that the likely outcome is that most of the “official residents” will actually make their homes in the surrounding communities and maintain “shelters” inside the walls into which they plan to retreat when the blah man in the white house declares martial law and comes for their guns. The number of people living inside full-time will self-limit according to the supply of electricity, water, and ease of bringing in food and removing waste.

    The only people who live full-time there will be their “select panel of full-time residents” who want or need to establish credo with the ruling oligarchy… because you know there will be one.

    The fun will begin when someone sets off their “apocalypse alarm” and everybody holes up inside the walls. They’ll suffer in there for days, weeks or even months because no one will want to admit its a false alarm, or risk being caught outside the gates because the declaration of a false alarm might be false itself. I’m trying not to cackle out loud imagining the debates* that will take place among them on this regard.

    *armed debates, of course, because inside the Citidel, everybody’s packing

  165. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 3:14

    There a number of Vauban-style fortifications in the US and Canada. Among the most famous: Fort Ticonderoga and Fort McHenry here in Clam City.

    During my Journey I walked the battlements of several walled cities with intact defenses. I only visited one Vauban-style city fortification: the small Portugeuese border fortress of Elvas, generally regarded as the most complete and well-preserved example still remaining. Even the fields of fire are intact. Also the city’s water supply came via a fortified aquaduct.
    http://www.google.com/search?q=elvas+fortress&hl=en&client=safari&tbo=d&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=nqr0UJHPNYWz0QGkrYGgAg&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA&biw=1285&bih=986

    I gotta pull myself away from Sadlytown! This place is w-a-y addictive.

  166. VCarlson said,

    January 15, 2013 at 3:41

    Right up until the invention of artillery.

    And, as has been pointed out on other sites, the existence of an air force makes any sophisticated redesigns in response to ground assaults pretty pointless.

  167. Pupienus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:04

    The one over there? That’s what we call a “bunker buster.” Sucker goes right through any number of feet of concrete and WHAM! they’s not much left inside.

    I will refrain from mentioning my great amusement that The Citadel employs all the best and up-to-date theories of medieval feudalism. French feudalism.

  168. Snorghagen said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:06

    the Citadel intends to become a premiere tourist destination for Americans from sea-to-sea and border-to-border.

    No Canucks!!!

  169. Snorghagen said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:31

    The Citadel has a blog for the suckers and marks prospective residents. Some of the wingnuts were getting suspicious and asking pointed questions about how the place was going to be function. Citadel staff has responded by shutting off comments and posting this statement:

    Many of your questions are “why aren’t you building/providing/doing _______?” We believe free markets are the best way to provide the goods and services that will be needed by the Citadel. If you don’t like that answer, the Citadel is probably not a good fit for you.

  170. Snorghagen said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:33

    ‘going to function’, not ‘going to be function’

  171. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:37

    the existence of an air force makes any sophisticated redesigns in response to ground assaults pretty pointless.

    I’m not sure what you mean. I assume you refer to redesign / improvement in fixed fortifications or installations, not to ground forces themselves. Please clarify the sentence, if I have misunderstood your meaning. Thanx.

    (also Go Ravens…)

  172. The Citadel (no, not that pansy military academy, neither!) said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:43

    We believe free markets are the best way to provide the goods and services that will be needed by the Citadel

    Plus the Invisible Hand is a defensive weapn swatting away the Black Helicopters from the UN.

  173. bughunter said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:48

    You need a standoff weapon or preferably another air force to defend any fixed location from air attack. And even then, it’s still down to the primeval contest of who’s got the bigger stick with the longer reach. Eventually, when you escalate the contest all the way up to WMDs, you soon realize that the best solution is to not be warlike.

    But apparently, these people are still stuck in the “Ogg have big stick, make Ogg feel good” mental evolutionary state.

  174. VCarlson said,

    January 15, 2013 at 4:56

    I’m not sure what you mean.

    See Pup’s remarks re: “bunker busters.”

    Also, ballistic missiles, death rays from satellites, et cetera, ett cetera, et cetera.

  175. Major Kong said,

    January 15, 2013 at 5:00

    Just toss a few firecrackers over the wall and wait for hilarity to ensue.

  176. VCarlson said,

    January 15, 2013 at 5:00

    Me, I prefer the “not be warlike” option. Healthier and cheaper, if done well.

    But you have to mean it, be smart about it, and always be on the lookout for the assholes who prefer the “Ogg method.”

  177. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 5:18

    If you follow Snorg’s link, the curtain wall and towers depicted at the Citadel site are at Avila (Spain), another of fortified cites I visited during the Journey. The curtain wall–studded with 88 towers–is complete.

    http://www.google.com/search?q=avila+walled+city&hl=en&client=safari&tbo=d&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=qMf0UJHnCIup0AHGuoCoDw&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAA&biw=1285&bih=986

    The purpose of projecting towers is to protect the base of the curtain wall between them (so that the enemy can’t undermine the wall, creating a breach when it collapses). Archers in the towers could cover the base of the curtain, protected by the merlons(*) Much safer than leaning out over the wall’s battlement and shooting straight down. TMI?

    (*) merlons are the ‘up’ part of crenellation; crenels are the ‘down’ part. Avila’s pointed merlons are a Moorish style; most merlons are squared-off.

    ————————
    There must have been some sorta S&M kink in Avila: Torquemada got his start here. Also where St. Theresa had her ecstasy.

  178. John Revolta said,

    January 15, 2013 at 5:22

    Wild and crazy guy!

    A German student “mooned” a group of Hell’s Angels and hurled a puppy at them before escaping on a stolen bulldozer, police have said.

    The man drove up to a Hell’s Angels clubhouse near Munich, wearing only a pair of shorts and carrying a puppy.

    He dropped his shorts and threw the dog, escaping on a bulldozer from a nearby building site.

    He was arrested later at home by police. The 26-year-old is said to have stopped taking depression medication.

    After making his getaway on the bulldozer, he had driven so slowly that a 5km tailback built up behind him on the motorway.

    After driving about 1km, he had abandoned the bulldozer in the middle of the motorway, near Allershausen. He continued his journey by hitchhiking.

    “What motivated him to throw a puppy at the Hell’s Angels is currently unclear,” a police spokesman said.

    The puppy is now being cared for in an animal shelter.

  179. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 5:25

    VCarl: I double-down on yer last comment….especially ‘be smart about it’.

  180. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 5:33

    Wild and crazy guy!
    Prepare to be AHEMed.

  181. The mayor of Upper Astroboffin (who is facing an unpleasant recall) said,

    January 15, 2013 at 5:55

    Wow. A two and a half year ahem?
    Izzat a record er sumpin?

  182. Snorghagen said,

    January 15, 2013 at 6:13

    Nevermind puppies being hurled at Hell’s Angels. What about kittens hurling themselves at Nazis?

    More Nazis with kittens.

    Still more Nazis with kittens.

    Yet again, Nazis with kittens.

    Even more Nazis with even more kittens.

  183. John Revolta said,

    January 15, 2013 at 6:21

    WTF? The BBC is recycling old stories.
    I just read another one there about Republicans in Congress holding the economy hostage over some stupid made up shit. How long ago was that?

  184. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 6:43

    The 26-year-old is said to have stopped taking depression medication.

    Sounds to me like he stopped taking medications for schizophrenia or bi-polar disorder. His behavior doesn’t seem at all consistent with stopping medication(s) for depression. Medications for depression typically have relatively mild side-effects, if any.

    Some bi-polar or schizophrenia meds, however, can have strong and very unpleasant side-effects…which is often why those patients stop taking them. Provoking bikers, throwing puppies, stealing bulldozers and causing a traffic jam seem to indicate a bi-polar or schizophrenic patient.

    Over the course of 15 years, I have taken nine different anti-depressant medications. We seem to have (finally!) found a combination of medicines that provide good benefits for me: Two anti-depressants and a mood-disorder medication. I also ‘self-prescribe’ and use marijuana. I have used ‘the sweet smoke’ recreationally for much of my life; I have alway favored legalizing marijuana for recreational use.

    I now believe marijuana can have a useful therapeutic value (certainly so in my case). At the very least, medical marijuana should be legally available.

    *climbs down from soapbox*

    ————————–

    He continued his journey by hitchhiking.

    WTF ? Don’t the Polizei have helicopters? Radios? The guy drive steals a bulldozer and then causes a traffic jam by driving slowly … and then he hops off and is able to hitchhike?
    WTF?

  185. Torquemada said,

    January 15, 2013 at 6:47

    No one expects the Spanish Inquisition.

  186. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 6:57

    Thanks for the Nazi kittens, Mayor.

    Nazi Kittens….a gurl band with a costume gimmick.

  187. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 6:59

    …or a badass attitude.

  188. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 7:04

    (who is facing an unpleasant recall)

    Don’t sweat it. The citizens of Astroboffin are far too intelligent to remove you from office.

  189. The Mayor of Upper Astroboffin (who is facing an unpleasant recall) said,

    January 15, 2013 at 7:18

    I dunno, the chipmunks are up in arms because a feral cat was allowed to commit genocide on their community.
    I tried to stop it, I swear.

    Snorghagen said,
    Even more Nazis with even more kittens.

    I’m sensing a pattern here.

  190. The Mayor of Upper Astroboffin (who is facing an unpleasant recall) said,

    January 15, 2013 at 8:25

    …and now I’ve killed the thread.
    My career is in the dumpster.

  191. bughunter said,

    January 15, 2013 at 8:25

    Nazi kittens grow up to be Soviet Pussys.

    (Assuming they’re not rocket scientists or atomic physicists, then they get paperclipped and relocated to Los Alamos.)

  192. Snowwy said,

    January 15, 2013 at 9:04

    Don’t you see? Doesn’t anybody SEE?!

    It’s plain as the nose on your face! It’s the work of Zardoz! The coming of the Brutals is prophesied! This is the first training camp for Exterminators!

    Look! Look! The twisted hyper-masculinization! The worship of the gun! IT’S ALL RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF YOU! HAIL MIGHTY ZARDOZ, BRINGER OF THE GUN!

  193. VCarlson said,

    January 15, 2013 at 9:08

    Not even the prospect of Sean Connery in an orange diaper was enough to get me in to the theater to see that movie (or perhaps because of it).

  194. Lancelot Link said,

    January 15, 2013 at 11:29

    (Assuming they’re not rocket scientists or atomic physicists, then they get paperclipped and relocated to Los Alamos.)
    or excessively Catholic, in which case they may go on to be the ultimate moral authority for more than a billion people worldwide.

  195. Fenwick said,

    January 15, 2013 at 13:15

    Correction for 6:43 comment:

    Two anti-depressants and a mood-disorder stabilizer medication.

  196. Major Kong said,

    January 15, 2013 at 15:49

    I’m in Grand Forks. Sooooooo cold.

    The sled dogs had the good sense to stay home, leaving me to fend for myself on the frozen tundra.

  197. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 16:33

    Everyone loves kittens. That’s what made it easy for them to penetrate the Nazi party and destroy it from the inside.

  198. Pryme said,

    January 15, 2013 at 16:45

    Everyone loves kittens. That’s what made it easy for them to penetrate the Nazi party and destroy it from the inside.

    Like in the movie Valcatrie?

  199. g said,

    January 15, 2013 at 17:31

    I’m in Grand Forks. Sooooooo cold.

    I’m in Malibu. Soooooo cold! Seriously!

  200. Pupienus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 18:00

    Grand Forks.

    Pretentious fucks. Should be renamed to Unremarkable Confluence.

  201. Pupienus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 18:07

    We got competition, folks.

    http://www.edgey.net/DHSBandNameGenerator/

  202. Thread Bear said,

    January 15, 2013 at 18:21

    Alright! Got my new band name:

    Avian Brown-out Initiative

  203. El Manquécito said,

    January 15, 2013 at 18:50

    Sorry g, somehow we got your Malibu weather (80F, balmy) here in the Okefenokee.

  204. Pupienus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 18:57

    (80F, balmy) here in the Okefenokee.

    Just. Fuck. You.

    Grrrrrrrr. Also brrrrrrr, it’s been motherfucking cold around here lately.

  205. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 19:02

    Fug Drifters
    Dale Sardine
    The Overshadowing Paranoid Thought
    Bill Clinton and the The Molded Executers
    Repeler Hubris
    Rhoda Does Sudan
    Dirk-Hists
    The Stupefied Five
    The Rigid Thinking
    Bland Bus-Nest
    The Pastoral Onion
    Immoral Vipers
    The Vindictively Pleased
    The Enameled Consumers
    Acme Maxi Oscillates Ethiopia
    Tall Rod
    Boston Hunk

  206. El Manquécito said,

    January 15, 2013 at 19:03

    Grrrrrrrr. Also brrrrrrr

    But, but, I didn’t go on about the best camellia crop in years, the sweet olive perfuming the yard, azaleas starting a month early. I was gonna go easy on y’all.

  207. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 20:10

    Hey, first three comments here are great:

    http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/337725/hailing-martin-luther-king-yuval-levin

  208. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 20:19

    FUCK YES! Nice find, Sub.

    Debating whether or not I want to risk a flame war by putting it on Facebook.

  209. Pupienus Maximus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 20:23

    Hey, first three comments here are great:

    Ouch. Wait a minute – using their own words against them makes them LIARS!

  210. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 20:32

    National Review is one of those few conservatives sites where the commenters are occasionally smarter than the author. I remember back in the election when Romney blurted out something about Syria being “Iran’s pathway to the sea,” and someone at the NRO actually wrote an article trying to defend what Romney was saying as some deep incredible insight into something that’s actually totally true (same thing they do every time Palin opens her mouth).

    And… incredibly, most of the comments were actually people saying “No. Dude, seriously. He said a stupid thing, get over it.”

  211. El Manquécito said,

    January 15, 2013 at 20:32

    NR is clearly being oppressed and abused by intertoobz common taters.

  212. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 20:41

    Maybe they should turn the hoses on them.

  213. Bitter Scribe said,

    January 15, 2013 at 20:53

    Don’t worry. There’s always the old reliable.

  214. Pupienus Maximus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:05

    National Review is one of those few conservatives sites where the commenters are occasionally smarter than the author.

    That aint saying much. Jonah. Klo. Sowell. Mona fucking Charon?!?

  215. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:08

    Wow!

    Dear Mr. Roberts,

    When you administered the oath of office to Barack Obama for his first term as president, you could have been excused for believing that Mr. Obama was qualified under the Constitution to hold the office of president, which he had sought and won. After all, Obama’s opponent, John McCain, never raised the issue of Mr. Obama’s qualifications.

    [...]

    Your own oath of office, sworn before God and the American people, requires you to uphold the Constitution. (If not you, then who?) If you now administer the oath of office for the presidency to a man who by his own admission fails to meet the natural born citizen requirement imposed by that Constitution, you have violated your own oath of office and are rightly subject to impeachment by any House of Representatives, at any time, now or in the future.

    If you choose the easy course of ignoring our Constitution, it does not change the fact that Mr. Obama is barred by that same Constitution from acting as president. I am sure that if you turn your judicial mind to the ramifications of this fraud, both foreign and domestic, you will understand that the harm you will have done insures your impeachment and eternal dishonor at some point down the road: If not this House of Representatives, then the next, or the next, or the next.

    ETERNAL dishonor. Also insurance.

  216. Pupienus Maximus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:25

    by his own admission fails to meet the natural born citizen requirement

    I must have been off-planet when he did that.

  217. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:28

    re: The Citadel

    Because I love poking around at this kind of stuff.

    Looking at the Artist’s Concept for the walled city, I count 4 Neighbourhoods with a total of 120 houses and 14 more Perimeter Houses. For “3,500 to 7,000 families.” That Town Center is going to have some crazy density. It really will be a Citadel since we’re probably looking at 100 story apartment buildings. Let’s say half the population lives in this area. There’s no scale on the map, but let’s also assume that this space is 1000 feet square – roughly the 20 acres they have already purchased. This is a population density of over 50,000 people per sq km – 2.5 times denser than the current densest census tract in the US.

    There’s a Farmer’s Market. There are no farms, so this would be where their more agriculturally minded neighbours come to sell them food. There is no parking.

    There is no Fire Station. There is no hospital or clinic marked. There is no city hall or other administrative buildings. Unless these are all packed into Town Center – a space that already has twenty times the population density of Tokyo.

    The public works for the city is confined to a space of two smallish buildings right above the Town Center. To address both Water and Power. To see how woefully inadequate this is, let’s look at nearby Sandpoint, the seat of Bonner County and birthplace of the Quitter from Wasilla.

    Here’s Sandpoint Public Works – two water treatment plants with a peak 8 mgd capacity. Then there’s the other end of the systm. I did a bit of poking and it looks like this is their wastewater treatment plant.

    Since it’s Idaho, AC load is probably not as heavy as elsewhere, so you can go with a fairly low estimate for peak household demand – say 7 kW. Multiply by 7,000 families is roughly 50 MW. This is a pdf showing what a 50 MW cogeneration plant looks like.

    Even the part they should have gotten right – the III Arms factory – is a huge botch-up. A factory that will provide enough industry to support a city of 10,000 – with no rail or truck access. Maybe the idea is to do all shipping and receiving via express ponies, just like the Founders intended.

  218. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:32

    I am concerned by DK-W’s lack of faith in the power of the Free Market to provide.

  219. Crissa said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:33

    So, we’re back to misogyny as source for why Obama can’t be President? His mother was insufficiently American, or something?

    How many Presidents had a non-American parent, again? The first several all weren’t born Americans, but were grandfathered in; one of those had an immigrant parent; plus several others. And our citizenship is granted for a single American parent.

    So what is Obama’s mother? Chopped liver?

  220. Pupienus Maximus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:35


    There is no Fire Station.

    Not now but there will be when some brilliant Galter creates one by the sweat of his brow. That said sweat is profuse has NOTHING TO DO with his pyromaniac tendencies.

    There is no hospital or clinic marked.
    Only weakling moochers need “health care”, Galtian übermen do not.

    There is no city hall or other administrative buildings.

    Well duh.

  221. Pupienus Maximus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:37

    I leave my computer for two fucking minutes while crafting a comment and SC meanly preempts me. Bitch.

  222. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:40

    There is no Fire Station.

    If it’s all 100-story apartment buildings you just get the boys in the next building over to pee.

  223. Bitter Scribe said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:41

    So what is Obama’s mother? Chopped liver?

    Worse. She’s a white woman who not only voluntarily had sex with a black man, but bore his child. The worst kind of scum for those people.

  224. Bitter Scribe said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:43

    If it’s all 100-story apartment buildings you just get the boys in the next building over to pee.

    If it’s at the top they’d have to pee an awfully high arc. There’s supposedly a way to do that, but I don’t know how, and I don’t think I want to.

  225. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:46

    Correction, the official blog does list Medical Center as one of the Citadel features. Anyways,

    The group say the community will live in accordance with Thomas Jefferson’s ideal of rightful liberty and prepare for all imagined emergencies.

    ‘It will be defined by physical preparedness to survive and prevail in the face of natural catastrophes –such as Hurricanes Sandy or Katrina — or man-made catastrophes such as a power grid failure or economic collapse,’ the website says.

    They are prepared for hurricanes because they are in NW Idaho. The natural disaster they are much more likely to encounter is drought. Note however, they have no water tower or reservoir at all. The map at the official blog shows they have picked a location that is topographically interesting (read mountainous) with no road access at all. And they are putting a factory there.

  226. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:50

    Also, the Town Center is all Retail/Commercial. Thus the 3,500 to 7,000 families are expected to share 134 houses.

  227. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:53

    Also, looking at it from Google Earth, there are no nearby farmers. I have no idea who is supposed to be selling at the Farmer’s Market. They plan on having an airstrip and helipad (not marked on drawing). Great, they’ll fly in all their food.

  228. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 21:58

    I… just… really would love to see this thing play itself out, and eventually tear itself apart from all the contradictions. It’d be like BioShock, or the Sith Order pre-Rule-of-Two.

  229. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:01

    Okay, the FAQ is helpful.

    Of those 3,500 to 7,000 families – only some will get to live behind the defensive walls – the rest shall serve as the agricultural field workers beyond the walls. These are the folks that are supposed to work the Farmers Market. Did I mention that they are building this thing in the mountains?

  230. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:04

    I hear you can grow oysters in the mountains…

    What?

  231. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:04

    Of those 3,500 to 7,000 families – only some will get to live behind the defensive walls – the rest shall serve as the agricultural field workers beyond the walls.

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaand there’s your inevitable social stratification – the expendable people outside the walls vs those important enough to live inside.

  232. Helmut Monotreme said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:06

    It is not idiotic to build what I am going to call a ‘resilient’ community. Such a community would be resistant to storms, flood, drought, earthquake and fire. Perhaps one might even want one that would be resistant to armed incursion. It would look nothing like their citadel. It Would need a resevoir, and water treatment plant. It would need sturdy buildings that would be liviable if the power should fail, and have sturdy cellars to store food and provide shelter in extreme weather. It would need farms and pastures enough to feed everyone healthy food and store up supplies against famine. It would need distributed powerplants (perhaps wind and solar with small biomass burners to make up for temporary shortages) and and a smart distribution grid resistant to storm damage and point failure. It would need businesses and police and fire crews and courts and jails. It would need walkable streets so people could get to work and shop without using gas that may be in short supply in times of want. It would have to work hard to minimize waste in order to provide for everyone and store up surpluses against hard times. It would in short look like the America that progressives have been trying to build for more than a century!

  233. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:11

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaand there’s your inevitable social stratification

    That’s not the half of it.

    One of the primary reasons for a lease paradigm versus private property inside the walls is our desire to make the community for Patriots only.

    The model will be similar in many ways to that of Disneyland. It is walled, gated, private property with controlled access. People pay to enter and agree to the rules because they see value in doing so. It is all based on a voluntary agreement between the owners of the property and those who want to come inside.

    You will be there at III Arms’ whim – James Miller can boot out anyone that doesn’t meet his standards of Patriotism (and also the marksmanship tests for those thirteen years of age or older). You can’t get properly Patriotic with only serfs and town burghers – you also need an absolute monarch.

  234. Major Kong said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:13

    They plan on having an airstrip and helipad (not marked on drawing). Great, they’ll fly in all their food.

    I see a free market opportunity in the making. Wonder how much I could charge these people.

  235. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:20

    In short, they are looking for people to move into a regime where one individual has absolute authority on who stays and goes. There is no appeals process, you are bound by your voluntary agreement to abide by his rules.

    There’s what is effectively conscription.

    There’s a jail, despite there being no legal authority for III Arms to detain or imprison anybody. In fact, it would be quite illegal for them to use said “jail”.

    And the vast majority of people will be relegated to farming the mountain in order to feed the handful of delusional jerkwads play-acting Patriot! behind the walls. Walls they are going to build in the mountains. At huge expense. Ones they acknowledge serve no real purpose outside of symbolism.

  236. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:23

    I hear you can grow oysters in the mountains…
    Photographic evidence!

  237. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:26

    It’d be like BioShock, or the Sith Order pre-Rule-of-Two.

    I was thinking “1534-1535 Anabaptist regime in Muenster”, but that’s just me.
    Spoiler Alert: psychopaths seize control, people die horribly.

  238. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:27

    One of the primary reasons for a lease paradigm versus private property inside the walls is our desire to make the community for Patriots only.

    Wait. If I’m reading that right, none of the inhabitants will actually own their own place? It’ll all be the Overlord’s property, which they are only renting from him? Holy dog shit!

  239. Helmut Monotreme said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:28

    I see a free market opportunity in the making. Wonder how much I could charge these people.

    Of course those starving heavily armed rednecks will pay you for food and not just take it at gunpoint.

  240. Major Kong said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:32

    Of course those starving heavily armed rednecks will pay you for food and not just take it at gunpoint.

    I was going to air-drop it, for an additional fee of course. Payment in advance.

  241. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:33

    Of course those starving heavily armed rednecks will pay you for food and not just take it at gunpoint.

    Net-30 or next time he airdrops plague rats.

  242. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:34

    Wait. If I’m reading that right, none of the inhabitants will actually own their own place? It’ll all be the Overlord’s property, which they are only renting from him? Holy dog shit!

    Yes. That’s exactly how it works. Because Freedom!

  243. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:36

    So basically, this dude just rediscovered sharecropping.

    Talk about reinventing the wheel.

  244. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:36

    A society of Spartans needs helots.

  245. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:38

    I take it all back. Instead of an Andrew Ryan or Darth Bane character towering over the city, I’m now just picturing a little fat man in a white suit, white cowboy hat and with bull horns on his white Cadillac. (I’d saddle him with a less-than-competent sheriff, but as there’s no police, I do what I can…)

  246. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:41

    There was some speculation over in a BalloonJuice thread that James Miller is exaggerating the crudeness and childish absurdity of his Galtian Gulch to ensure that the only people who express interest are the really easy marks, and he doesn’t have to waste time trying to empty the pockets of vaguely-skeptical people who retain some grasp on reality.
    Or it could just be that he is in fact a spectacularly stupid guy who designs a town the way a 12-year-old might, crammed with Cool Stuff and no concern for practicalities, because that’s simply how his mind works.

  247. DAS said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:43

    I am concerned by DK-W’s lack of faith in the power of the Free Market to provide. – Smut Clyde

    Or as the Wingnut Bible (WIngnut Matthew 6:25-34) reminds us:

    Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet the invisible hand feeds them. Are you, pleasantly hued and a fine specimen of ‘Murkin manhood, not much better than they? Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature? And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin: And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. Wherefore, if the invisible hand so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall it not much more clothe you, O ye who clearly does not understand the Austrian School of Economics nor even Econ 101? So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ (For after all these things do the un-American Hippies and people of darker hue seek:) for the invisible hand knoweth that ye have need of all these things. But seek ye first feedumb from gummint regulation and oppose any liberal who wants to force teh ghey sharia law down your throat; and all these things shall be added unto you. Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

  248. El Manquécito said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:46

    And the vast majority of people will be relegated to farming the mountain in order to feed the handful of delusional jerkwads play-acting Patriot!

    They’re going to get pretty tired of Famous Potatoes and sugar beets.

  249. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:46

    Or it could just be that he is in fact a spectacularly stupid guy who designs a town the way a 12-year-old might, crammed with Cool Stuff and no concern for practicalities, because that’s simply how his mind works.

    You’d think the fact that it was #2 pencil on ruled paper with spit marks from the explosion sounds he made while drawing it would’ve raised some doubts.

  250. tigris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:49

    Sugar beets will make the long pig taste delicious.

  251. The Mayor of Upper Astroboffin (who is facing an unpleasant recall) said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:50

    I’m now just picturing a little fat man in a white suit, white cowboy hat and with bull horns on his white Cadillac. …who was regularly outdone by two archers.

    Yeah, sounds about right.

  252. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:57

    There was some speculation over in a BalloonJuice thread that James Miller is exaggerating the crudeness and childish absurdity of his Galtian Gulch to ensure that the only people who express interest are the really easy marks, and he doesn’t have to waste time trying to empty the pockets of vaguely-skeptical people who retain some grasp on reality

    Yeah, I think the idea that this is all a scam to separate fools from their money is still the most likely one being tossed around.

  253. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 22:58

    I alternate between thinking
    (1) The whole scheme is one guy’s grift… one guy whose previous get-rich plan was to shake down shopping malls by threatening them with bad publicity if they didn’t hire his phony-baloney anti-terrorism mall-cop service. The Underpants Gnomes nature of the town plan is no discredit to anyone else… one cannot read it as a broader Marching Morons streak of stupidity & gullibility, until tea-baggers sign up en masse.

    and
    (2) Fox Nation are promoting it.

  254. Thread Bear said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:00

    They’re going to get pretty tired of Famous Potatoes and sugar beets.

    The Five Guys Beet-Burgers and Fries franchise will make them oh so palatable. Everything will be fine.

  255. El Manquécito said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:06

    I guess they could grow canola so they could have a Lord of the Fries.

  256. Thread Bear said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:07

    Yeah, I think the idea that this is all a scam to separate fools from their money is still the most likely one being tossed around.

    I agree, but targeting a bunch of gunnuts harboring vigilante fantasies as your marks might not be the wisest get rich sheme to pull off.

  257. Chris said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:12

    I agree, but targeting a bunch of gunnuts harboring vigilante fantasies as your marks might not be the wisest get rich sheme to pull off.

    The real irony would be if the grifter retired to Cuba or Venezuela after this to hide from the gun nuts.

    Then they could all talk about how it was a Red conspiracy, and feel better because it makes them victims of a communist plot rather than their own stupidity.

    Then when Obama fails to invade Cuba to get the grifter back, they can tell themselves the federal government was in on the conspiracy too.

    And then another grifter can come along, play to those fears and scam them all over again.

    Later, rinse, repeat.

  258. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:14

    I guess they could grow canola
    I also refer you to Citizen-Scientist Lysenko’s success in adapting wheat to grow in climates that were previously thought to be too cold.

  259. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:18

    they can tell themselves the federal government was in on the conspiracy too.

    Complain that the federal government did not interfere enough in their lives and prevent the scam? UNTHINKABLE.

  260. El Manquécito said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:22

    Smyt: I have to confess I aired out stole your heron joke while in Louisiana and you would have been gratified by the anguished groaning.

  261. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:23

    J’egret rien.

  262. Smut Clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:25

    NEED NEW BIRD PUNS.

  263. Dragon-King Wangchuck said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:36

    Birdpuns? Thread takes a tern for the worse. Let osprey for new thread.

  264. Substance McGravitas said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:39

    At the Sasquatch Seminar I watched a presentation from a guy who, on a trip to the deepest wilds of Montana, saw sasquatches enter a UFO. He was looking for funding for another expedition into the trackless wilds which are obviously unreachable except by hot-air balloon or atomic burrowing machine.

    The Citadel sounds like a similar thing.

  265. DAS said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:47

    atomic burrowing machine.

    The Citadel sounds like a similar thing. – Substance McG

    No. They are quite different. “The Citadel” is a Ska/Black Metal fusion group while “Atomic Burrowing Machine” is playing in some hipster bar in Williamsburg

    Or at least to me that’s what those terms sound like they refer to.

  266. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:51

    Tigris: So you’ve been through an onager management program?

    Heh, “onager manager” would be a great job title. Would such a person’s ID number be an “onager manager integer”?

  267. Pupienus Maximus said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:53

    Feeling safer, JP?

  268. smut clyde said,

    January 15, 2013 at 23:55

    At the Sasquatch Seminar I watched a presentation from a guy

    Josh St. Lawrence! Was it all about THE BUTTOCKS?

  269. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    January 16, 2013 at 0:00

    Alright, which one of you jokesters left this comment at the “Citadel” blog?

  270. El Manquécito said,

    January 16, 2013 at 0:00

    Heh, “onager manager” would be a great job title.

    For a horse’s ass.

  271. Whale Chowder said,

    January 16, 2013 at 0:06

    Feeling safer, JP?

    How could an arms race between criminals and cops possibly go wrong?

    Also I see a new post.

  272. Pupienus Maximus said,

    January 16, 2013 at 0:08

    Virginia keeping it classy.

    A majority of the Virginia Senate GOP- 12 of 20 Senators walked out rather than vote for a gay judge.

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