Jun
29

Things that must be read to be believed




Posted at 15:18 by Brad

There are times when I wonder what, exactly, conservatives mean when they say they want to “promote democracy” in other countries. Now, via the Wall Street Journal’s op-ed page, we have our answer: it involves supporting military coups against democratically-elected governments:

Honduras Defends Its Democracy: Fidel Castro and Hillary Clinton object

Hugo Chávez’s coalition-building efforts suffered a setback yesterday when the Honduran military sent its president packing for abusing the nation’s constitution. It seems that President Mel Zelaya miscalculated when he tried to emulate the success of his good friend Hugo in reshaping the Honduran Constitution to his liking.

But Honduras is not out of the Venezuelan woods yet. Yesterday the Central American country was being pressured to restore the authoritarian Mr. Zelaya by the likes of Fidel Castro, Daniel Ortega, Hillary Clinton and, of course, Hugo himself. The Organization of American States, having ignored Mr. Zelaya’s abuses, also wants him back in power. It will be a miracle if Honduran patriots can hold their ground.

This reminds me of Ralph Peters’ recent declaration that the American military should start actively slaughtering members of the American media in order to procure more favorable coverage:

Although it seems unthinkable now, future wars may require censorship, news blackouts and, ultimately, military attacks on the partisan media. Perceiving themselves as superior beings, journalists have positioned themselves as protected-species combatants. But freedom of the press stops when its abuse kills our soldiers and strengthens our enemies. Such a view arouses disdain today, but a media establishment that has forgotten any sense of sober patriotism may find that it has become tomorrow’s conventional wisdom.

Do you guys even understand what “democracy” means? Because to my way of thinking, it doesn’t involve military coups and violent censorship of the press. But that’s just me.

268 Comments »

  1. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 15:23

    I screeched to a halt when I heard this in the morning. I could not believe that, whatever the price, the US wanted to suspend the constitution of a foreign land over a term limits debate.

    And that we’re teaming up with Chavez on this.

  2. Flying Fox said,

    June 29, 2009 at 15:37

    This isn’t as crazy as it sounds, even though the WSJ’s language echoes certain Cold War self-deception and doublespeak. My understanding is that Zelaya was acting unconstitutionally and ignoring the Honduran Supreme Court. The Supreme Court ordered the military to remove him. Not my idea of a democratic surrender of power either though.

  3. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 15:40

    Notice how Obama has dodged any real questions on Iran (pretending to care about the Iranian people while they are slaughtered by Islamist animals in the street).

    Even the British and the Europeans, weak themselves, were embarassed by our tepid response.

    Now he is bending over for the Socialists in Honduras. Disgusting.

    Typical Chicago hack.

    This wasn’t the “change” or “hope” people voted for.

  4. N.C. said,

    June 29, 2009 at 15:43

    This isn’t the troll I voted for!

    Rugged in Montana/Iris 2012

  5. Incontinentia Buttocks said,

    June 29, 2009 at 15:52

    Things to note about the emerging wingnut idiocy regarding this turn of events:

    1) Poor Daniel Ortega can’t catch a break. He tacks to the right, runs a contra as his VP candidate, and he’s still reduced to a walk-on role as a scary socialist in a wingnut talkingpoint. Every single leader in Central America is opposed to this coup. All–left and right–recognize that it is a coup and that accepting such coups threaten democracy in the region.

    2) I love that supporting socialists overseas is now one of the qualities of a “typical Chicago hack.” And there I was thinking that the “just a Chicago machine politician” and the “socialist terrorist cat’s paw for Bill Ayers” views of Obama were competing idiotic memes!

    3) Also love how (largely imaginary) criticism of Obama’s actions toward Iran by our European allies is now of crucial importance. Who knew that when the French disagreed with an American president patriotic Americans should listen to the French?

  6. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:06

    Rising unemployment
    Record deficits
    Bailout after bailout
    Wasted “stimulus” money
    Higher taxes
    Inflation
    Obama approval at record lows

    I think the maxi-libs must be getting nervous.

  7. jon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:08

    Honduras is pretty obviously a coup, unless you believe the deposed president really signed his resignation under any circumstances other than having soldiers pointing guns at his head.

    Was there a constitutional issue? Apparently there was. But from the details I’ve seen, the illegal referendum wasn’t going to happen anyway. So why the removal from office? The answer was simply because the military went along with whatever group didn’t want the referendum.

    Looks like a non-victory for democracy when unconstitutional acts are foiled unconstitutionally. And since it’s unlikely we’re going to do anything about it, the White House statements are all the critics of Obama are going to have to work with. Not that that will slow them down in any way.

  8. N.C. said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:10

    Maxilibs are double-plus-unkewl.

  9. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:10

    Who knew that when the French disagreed with an American president patriotic Americans should listen to the French?

    That’s going to leave a mark.

  10. kingubu said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:12

    Its obvious, but no, they really don’t get small-D democracy. After all, democracy– together with the open elections, press protections, an independent judiciary, limits on policing power, privacy and speech rights, minority protections, etc that give it shape– proceeds from a strong commitment to human rights; and caring about human rights is for bleeding heart liberals and losers like Jimmy Carter, not for real men of action.

  11. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:13

    Obama approval rating at 6/29/09: 57%

    Bush approval rating at 6/29/01: 50% (the lowest Presidential approval rating since the first Clinton administration)

  12. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:13

    Dance little badgers, dance!
    ————————————————-
    Here is how it will go down next week. First, the results from Virginia and North Carolina will come in, and they’ll be declared for McCain. You’ll be disappointed, but “no big deal, change can’t come overnight” will be your comment. Florida will go red, and a little nervousness will creep in. The usual suspects will fall into the usual categories. As the night drags on, Ohio, Colorado, and (much to your horror) Pennsylvania will be too close to call.

    My advice at this point to you will be to go to bed. You will wake up to a McCain presidency and the Great Liberal Freakout will be on.

    Bookmark this, liberals, as this is exactly how it is going to go down. You will be wonder how the hell I was able to call this.

  13. DrDick said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:14

    Do you guys even understand what “democracy” means?

    No. This has been …..

  14. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:16

    George W. Bush didn’t have a fawning MSM like Obama does. The press gives Obama a free pass, and the best he can do is 57 percent? Looks like the American people are beginnign to see through the Chicago smokescreen.

  15. rip said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:17

    In rightwing world there are no competing memes, no errors in judgement, no incorrect predictions. There is no hypocrisy, no cognitive dissonance, no arguement contrary to the facts. Every opinion, criticism, judgement and prognostication exists in it’s own perfect form, unrelated to what comes before, after or even concurrently. The conservative movement has triumphed over the space-time continuum, over logic and fact, and they know at this very moment that in some parallell universe as real as the one you and I inhabit, that President-for-life Obama has already rounded up gun-owners and tea-baggers, putting them in socialist FEMA re-education camps, while Nancy Pelosi easily pushes Sharia Law through the congress, as the Republicans have all been detained in the basement of the Blackhouse.

  16. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:17

    Obama approval at record lows…

    Record lows for whom? His approval rating is about 62%…low for Obama, maybe, but Bush would have given his left nut to have approval ratings that high in his second term. Bush could barely–and only intermittantly–crack the 30% mark his last year in office.

    Someone’s got his panties in a bunch and it’s obviously choking blood flow to his already delusional brain.

    Silly fucking troll. Silly, silly, silly. You want to be taken seriously? Grow up first. Then bring substantive arguments to the table, not kooky right-wing talking points (sewer-dwelling, sad sack sophistry) that even a half-witted first grader could debunk.

  17. kingubu said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:20

    Shorter Fake Troll:

    “Ah ha! Obama’s approval ratings have dipped from stratospheric to merely above average. VICTORY IS OURS!”

  18. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:20

    Bush is gone. Obama “owns” the nations problems now. It has been over six months. Time to stop the whining about Bush and man up.

  19. chicago eight-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:23

    Clinton! Roosevelt! JIMMY CARTER!!!

  20. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:24

    It has been over six months.

    Bookmark this, libs! Do the math! Obama was installed as Presnident in December already!

  21. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:24

    Time to stop the whining about Bush and man up.

    “Man up” is some sort of redneck terminology that implies roofies, chewing tobacco, and date rape.

  22. Bill E Pilgrim said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:28

    George W. Bush didn’t have a fawning MSM like Obama does.

    True. It was his evil twin who wore the manly bulging flight suit they were all fawning over, and the one who worked at the ranch all the time clearing brush like a real good ol boy, and the one who saved the world’s people from evil by bombing them to smithereens while using all the folksy Texas sayings about “gonna smoke Bin Laden outta his hole..” THAT’s the one the media fawned over. Damn you evil twin!! You get all the attention!

  23. Personal Failure said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:28

    does chicago two step get that all Iranians are . . . oh, never mind.

  24. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:28

    Bookmark this, libs! Do the math! Obama was installed as Presnident in December already!
    You forgot:

    Butter my toast, libz!

  25. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:29

    Remember how when Bush was President and nothing taht happened oin his watch was blamed on Bill Clinton…YEah, me either…I guess Conservatives don’t Man Up

  26. pedestrian said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:30

    Don’t these same people believe that everything that Obama has done was unconstitutional, starting with being elected president?

    Don’t they also think that he’s buddy buddy with Chavez?

    Soooo…..?

  27. Bigby said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:32

    Hey, Pissant Two-Step? You new here? People here criticize Obama all the fucking time, unlike rethugs for whom Bush could do no wrong (even if what he did was the exact opposite of what he did earlier, which was perfection itself). Obama’s approval is double Bush’s. Also. Suck. On. That. Also.

  28. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:35

    Can you imagine an American wingnut coup d’etat? It would be like the panty raid scene inRevenge of the Nerds but not nearly as cool or successful, but of course Jonah and the Powerline nitwits would walk away with a sweet stash of White House Cheetos with the Presidential Seal on the bags. And meanwhile Michelle Malkin would make a big piddle on the Oval Office carpet.

    WOLVERINZ!!!1!!1!

  29. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:36

    We on the right criticized Bush for his massive deficit spending, expanding medicare, and for the bank bailout buffet.

    But we never expected Bush to be a messiah, or fix all our problems, or pay our mortgages and for our gas. A lot of liberals did.

    Obama has taken the worst Bush policies and super-sized them.

  30. The Dark Avenger said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:36

    George W. Bush didn’t have a fawning MSM like Obama does

    Link

    And remember that now-infamous Mission Accomplished moment? True, Matthews did not join his guest G. Gordon Liddy in admiring–still not kidding–the President’s pretend penis, but he was no less focused on Bush’s fashion statements. “He looks great in a military uniform. He looks great in that cowboy costume he wears when he goes West,” he cooed. “We’re proud of our President. Americans love having a guy as President, a guy who has a little swagger, who’s physical, who’s not a complicated guy like Clinton…. Women like a guy who’s President. Check it out.”

    Matthews’s man-crush on Bush continued longer than that of most of the mainstream media, leading him, for instance, to assert that “everybody sort of likes the President, except for the real whack-jobs,” at a moment when the percentage of Americans telling New York Times/CBS pollsters that they “liked” Bush had fallen to 37 percent.

    Do you believe in facts, Troofie?

    To counter the problem of the “unobserved population,” Groeling collected two different data sets: in-house presidential approval polling by ABC, CBS, NBC and FOX News and the networks’ broadcasts of such polls on evening news shows from January 1997 to February 2008. Groeling found that, with varying degrees of statistical significance, CBS, NBC and ABC showed what Groeling calls a pro-Democrat bias. For instance, CBS was 35 percent less likely to report a five-point drop in approval for Bill Clinton than a similar rise in approval and was 33 percent more likely to report a five-point drop than a rise for George W. Bush. Meanwhile FOX News showed a statistically significant pro-Republican bias in the most controlled of the three models Groeling tested: its Special Report program was 67 percent less likely to report a rise in approval for Clinton than a decrease and 36 percent more likely to report the increase rather than the decrease for Bush.

    Groeling’s work is one of the few studies to quantify partisan bias in the media, a subject notoriously difficult for social scientists to research and discuss. These scientists work with theories such as the socalled hostile media effect to predict that ardent supporters of a cause will view media as slanted for the other side, and they have conducted hundreds of studies that have revealed imbalances in the ways journalists frame news on topics ranging from AIDS to the war in Iraq. But there is not a cohesive literature on media bias. Maxwell McCombs of the University of Texas at Austin, who pioneered agenda-setting theory, one of the leading paradigms on news media, says that a researcher would need a few years to make sense of existing data and develop an approach to study media bias. Like many scholars, McCombs sees “bias” as a loaded term, preferring to speak of journalists’ “predilections.”

    “Scholars hate the word ‘bias’ because they feel like they’re entering the ideological fray,” says S. Robert Lichter, head of the Center for Media and Public Affairs (CMPA) at George Mason University, who prefers the term “tone.” Despite his efforts, Lichter himself got sucked into that fray. His content analysis of the transcripts of TV news broadcasts at the statement level is a respected and widely adopted methodology. This past summer, just as the view that journalists were going softer on Barack Obama than on John McCain was becoming widely accepted, CMPA issued a report showing that 72 percent of the statements in TV news reports about Obama in late spring and early summer were negative, whereas 57 percent of the statements about McCain were negative. When Fox News commentator Bill O’Reilly attacked Lichter’s method during a radio interview, saying it would embolden liberal bias, Lichter responded, “You can take all my studies or none of my studies”—an allusion to past uses of his work to support conservative views.

    Bookmark this, Troofie

  31. montysano said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:36

    I think the maxi-libs must be getting nervous.

    As an ultra-maxi-lib, you are partially correct: Obama is making me nervous, but not for the reasons you assume.

  32. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:37

    We on the right criticized Bush for his massive deficit spending, expanding medicare, and for the bank bailout buffet.

    So you were all lovey-dovey for six years…whereas we’re five months in and the left hates Obama already.

    *AHEM*

  33. chocolatepie said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:38

    Obama did the Chicago Two Step with your mom last night.

  34. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:40

    I don’t get my reports on media-bias from Soros funded rag sheets, thank you very much.

  35. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:41

    Chhicago two Step refuses to man up

  36. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:42

    I don’t get my reports on media-bias from Soros funded rag sheets, thank you very much.

    You get them from Coors-funded ones instead?

  37. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:42

    SHorter Chicago two Step

    “I hate the jewish media”

  38. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:43

    Shorter Troofie Too-Step:

    We never elected Bush to solve problems… just create them.

    ‘Shorter’ concept created by Daniel Davies and perfected by Elton Beard. We are aware of all Internet traditions.™

  39. Brandi said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:43

    I thought the Chicago two-step was the name for the feeble attempts to prevent leakage and prolapse after prolonged anal rape.

  40. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:43

    Olexicon, I guess you hate Jews because you criticize Jonah Goldberg?

  41. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:45

    Olexicon, I guess you hate Jews because you criticize Jonah Goldberg?

    He’s Episcopalian. You could look it up.

  42. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:45

    Shorter Chicago Two Step

    “I am clearly illiterate”

  43. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:45

    I think the maxi-libs must be getting nervous.

    …thus spaketh the maxi-pad.

  44. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:47

    Why don;t you man up and admit you hate Soros because he is a better man than you will ever be

  45. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:47

    Next time you say something critical of Bill Kristol, Ill just call all of you anti-semites I guess.

  46. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:49

    Wait, Chicago Two Step missed all thsoe months where anyoen who dislieked neoconservatiev foreign policy was immediately called an anti-semite

    clearly he hates Israel

  47. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:50

    I hate Soros because he is a fringe extremist who uses his (illegally acquired?) billions to smear conservatives, influence the media, and antagonize for radical social policies like gay marriage and the legalization of prostitution and dangerous narcotics.

  48. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:50

    Olexicon, I guess you hate Jews because you criticize Jonah Goldberg?

    No, we criticize Panload because he’s a drooling fucking idiot. The fact he’s a Jewish drooling fucking idiot is a tragedy.

    Sheesh.

  49. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:51

    So you Hate Soros because he’s part of the Jewish Coinspirac y to control the worlde

  50. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:52

    Take the word “Soros” Out of that sentence on why he hates Soros and substituet “Interbnational Jewry”

  51. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:52

    And the fact we criticize Gay Patriot West doesn’t make us homophobes. We love TEH GHEY here at Sadly, NO. Why, just last night I had three myself! Wheeeee!

  52. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:53

    I wouldn’t care if Soros were a southern baptist, a presbyterian, or a hindu–if he were doing those things, I’d still hate him.

  53. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:55

    Since your reasons for hating Soros are in no way based on reality…

  54. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:55

    I wouldn’t care if Soros were a southern baptist, a presbyterian, or a hindu–if he were doing those things, I’d still hate him.

    But the fact Obama is a Teh Magic Negro certainly makes you crazier than the already maximum crazy you already are, right?

  55. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:56

    Olexicon, you could take “neocon” out of say, Naomi Klein or any other leftist screed and replace it with “International Jewry” and end up with the same thing.

  56. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:57

    “Wait, Chicago Two Step missed all thsoe months where anyoen who dislieked neoconservatiev foreign policy was immediately called an anti-semite”

    Me earlier

  57. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:58

    Olexicon, you could take “neocon” out of say, Naomi Klein or any other leftist screed and replace it with “International Jewry” and end up with the same thing.

    So you’re accusing the neo-cons of being the internationalist Jewish conspiracy? Read “The Protocols” much lately?

  58. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:58

    Or how about we take a column critical of Fox News and replace “Rupert Murdoch” with “International Jewry”?

  59. "Those Guys" said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:58

    Do you guys even understand what “democracy” means?

    A buzz word we use to provide cover for our profiteering and fear-mongering.

    DUH!!!

  60. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:59

    Chicago two-step is a ZOGmonster!

  61. The Dark Avenger said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:59

    Troofie, get some help for your condition:

    Echolalia is the repetition of vocalizations made by another person. Echolalia can be present in autism, Tourette syndrome, aphasia, Rubinstein-Taybi syndrome, developmental disability, schizophrenia, Asperger syndrome, Alzheimer’s Disease and, occasionally, other forms of psychopathology. It is also frequently found in blind or visually impaired children, although most will outgrow this behavior. When done involuntarily, echolalia may be considered a tic.

    The word “echolalia” is derived from the Greek ??? meaning “echo” or “to repeat”,[1] and ????? (laliá) meaning “babbling, meaningless talk”[2] (of onomatopoeic origin from the verb ????? (laléo) meaning “to talk”).

    Immediate echolalia causes the immediate repetition of a word or phrase. In some autistic and Asperger’s cases it may be a method of buying time to help process language. In an instance a child with autism is asked, “Do you want dinner?” the child echoes back “Do you want dinner?” followed by a pause and then a response, “Yes. What’s for dinner?”[3]

    In delayed echolalia a phrase is repeated after a delay, such as a person with autism who repeats TV commercials, favorite movie scripts, or parental reprimands.

  62. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 16:59

    Or how about we take a column critical of Fox News and replace “Rupert Murdoch” with “International Jewry”?

    That would be as crazy as claiming that President was not born in America

  63. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:00

    No, actor, I’m showing how ridiculous OlexiCon’s premise is.

  64. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:00

    Echolalia is the repetition of vocalizations made by another person.

    See also:Meissner method of acting.

  65. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:00

    Two-step, we don’t cotton to antiSemites here. Take your “neo-cons are international jewry” act on the road, son.

  66. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:01

    Avenger, that’s an awfully fancy, ten-dollar way of saying two-step is a fucking moron.

  67. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:02

    Take the Word “Obama” out of anything that Chicago Two Step rights and substute the word “DIrty N*****”

  68. Qbert said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:02

    Poppy Bush made lots of stern noises how “this will not stand” when Haiti overthrew Jean-Bertrand Aristide. This meant absolutely nothing, as they were clearly delighted with the outcome (which I wouldn’t be surprised if they orchestrated). They never lifted a finger to reverse the coup, even after waves of Haitian boat people started washing up on our beaches.

    Read your Chomsky, people. The US–regardless of the administration in charge– is perfectly happy with anti-democratic governments in our hemisphere as long as they kowtow to our economic interests.

  69. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:03

    I don’t believe “neocons” are a Jewish conspiracy (I don’t believe in any Jewish conspiracy) but a lot of leftists sure do!

    The real anti-semites have always been on the Left. Go to an ANSWER rally sometime.

  70. owlbear1 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:03

    Not one word about “Activist Judges”?

  71. Simba B said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:05

    chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:03 (kill)

    Well looky here. Guess nothing’s changed around these parts.

  72. owlbear1 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:06

    Can you just hear them whispering?

    “Wouldn’t it be great if Roberts did the same thing here?”

  73. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:09

    I don’t believe “neocons” are a Jewish conspiracy

    Well, you said they’re interchangeable! That must mean either you believe they are, or they are!

  74. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:10

    Funny how Simba always shows up when Troofie is on the board…but never any other time.

  75. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:11

    The real anti-semites have always been on the Left Right. Go to a ANSWER Klan rally sometime.

  76. Xecky Gilchrist said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:14

    Notice how Obama has dodged any real questions on Iran (pretending to care about the Iranian people while they are slaughtered by Islamist animals in the street).

    Indeed, a real pretzeldent would dodge real questions while slaughtering the Iranian people himself using high-altitude carpet bombing.

  77. Parody Troll said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:16

    Keep wasting your breath, liberals. I ignore 98% of what people tell me anyway.

  78. Uncle Ned said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:19

    Don’t think of it as feeding the trolls, think of it as fattening them before slaughter.

  79. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:21

    So a President violated the Honduran Constitution by trying to illegally install himself as a dictator. He is removed from officr, and Obama condems it?

    I guess he wants a precedent for when we have to drag him out kicking and screaming in 2013.

  80. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:22

    Looks like the judge is going to throw the book at Madoff. Reuters is live-blogging the session.

  81. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:22

    So a President violated the Honduran Constitution by trying to illegally install himself as a dictator.

    No, he asked for a public referendum, a plebiscite, as to whether the Constitution should be amended.

  82. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:25

    He gets 150 years.

  83. MrToad said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:25

    What’s the point in debating ‘Chi-step’? There are people who see only what they want to see, and cannot see or understand anything that doesn’t fit in with that. I recall some saying from somewhere about “none so blind, etc.” It’s just a waste of time. He’s not even as good as a troll, who only stirs things up for fun, but knows reality by sight if not by name. Chi-step and his buddies live in an alternate world, much like the Heaven’s Gate folks, which is not accessible by people who are not insane (using the term “insane” in its classical sense of “not being sane”). Like any other insane folks, they remain convinced that theirs is the only “real reality” and the rest of the people are really the nuts. Debating them merely strengthens their convictions. A soothing pat on the head is probably the most attention that should be paid them, other than a strait-jacket when they become a danger to themselves and others. Naturally, Chi-step will feel much the same about most of the other people in this comments section, but there it is – I’m going to side with the group that has the greatest degree of agreement with measurable reality.

  84. Olexicon said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:25

    Shorter Chicago Two Step

    “I hate the Commander in Chief during a time of war, between 2002 and 2008 I would have called myself a traitor”

  85. Pissing in the boots my father used to fill said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:26

    I guess he wants a precedent for when we have to drag him out kicking and screaming in 2013.

    That’s the spirit Boy!

    Now, let’s work on your aim…

  86. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:27

    Actor, in Honduras it is unconstitutional for a President to even propose that he stay in office beyond his term limits.

  87. Mouthful of Kelp said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:30

    I guess he wants a precedent for when we have to drag him out kicking and screaming in 2013.

    I just can’t believe The Truth is still making election predictions.

  88. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:34

    Actor, in Honduras it is unconstitutional for a President to even propose that he stay in office beyond his term limits.

    So proposing a Constitutional amendment is a bad thing? All documents should remain set in stone? Blacks should have 3/5 of a vote here?

  89. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:36

    Actor, in Honduras it is unconstitutional for a President to even propose that he stay in office beyond his term limits.

    Yeah, he shoulda had the little people do it for him.

  90. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:37

    The Honduran Constitution prohibits extending the Presidents term, or even proposing it. The former President was acting illegally. He had to be removed one way or the other.

  91. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:37

    I guess he wants a precedent for when we have to drag him out kicking and screaming in 2013.

    I just can’t believe The Truth is still making election predictions.

    Bookmark it… ahhh, you know the rest.

  92. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:38

    The Honduran Constitution prohibits extending the Presidents term, or even proposing it.

    Citation, please.

  93. Shorter Troofie said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:40

    I live in the Matrix.

  94. Hermione said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:43

    The former President was acting illegally. He had to be removed one way or the other.

    Hey! So was ours!

  95. Hermione said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:43

    *Wasn’t he?

    What?

    *FYWP!

  96. owlbear1 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:44

    In Honduras unconstitutional means “must be removed from office with military force”?

    Wow, they’re really strict.

  97. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:44

    The Honduran Constitution prohibits extending the Presidents term, or even proposing it.

    The US Constitution had no term limits on the President. Yet now we have a two-term limit.

    According to you, Troofie, that’s unconstitutional, and yet, it’s constitutionally mandated.

    How is that? How does that work?

  98. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:46

    In Honduras unconstitutional means “must be removed from office with military force”?

    Wow, they’re really strict.

    This was the point Obama was talking to.

  99. chicago eight-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:46

    WHITE PEOPLE!! eeh-eh-ehh-eh-eh-eyy

    BLACK PEOPLE!! doo-da-doo-doo-doot

  100. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:47

    We have a different Constitution than Honduras, retard. Duhhh.

  101. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:49

    This was the point Obama was talking to.

    But was it central?

  102. owlbear1 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:50

    We have a different Constitution than Honduras, retard. Duhhh.

    I’ve never seen the Honduran constitution. Do you have a link to it?

  103. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:57

    From the Honduran constitution (translated from the original Klingon Spanish):

    CHAPTER I Article 3

    “ARTICLE 3 .- No one owes obedience to a usurper government or to those who assume public office or employment by force of arms or by using means or procedures that violate or are unaware of what the Constitution and the laws.”

  104. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:57

    We have a different Constitution than Honduras

    True, but theirs is also subject to amendment. Why do you hate democracy so?

  105. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 17:58

    Link:

    http://pdba.georgetown.edu/Constitutions/Honduras/hond05.html

  106. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:01

    Formally, the referendum only asked voters whether they wanted to vote for the convening of a constituent assembly later this year

    So he didn’t say the Constitution should be amended, only that he wanted the people to determine if a new Constitution should be written.

    No one is supporting Zelaya’s attempt to overthrow his Constitution, Troofstep. What we do think is wrong is having the military overthrow a currently legally elected President.

    Why do you hate democracy so?

  107. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:02

    Wow, Badger! It looks like that Constitution gets fairly regular amending!

  108. N.C. said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:09

    “ARTICLE 3 .- No one owes obedience to a usurper government or to those who assume public office or employment by force of arms or by using means or procedures that violate or are unaware of what the Constitution and the laws.”

    I think it’s closer to “that violate or disregard the established Constitution and law”, but yeah.

  109. Joe Max said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:12

    Actually, Troofie has a point (other than the one on his head).

    Article 42, sec 5 states it is prohibited “To urge, to promote or to support the continuation or the re-election of the President of the Republic;”

    People in Central America have had a long history of “presidents for life”, so they even put that one in the constitution.

    But calling for a referendum on holding a “constitutional congress” is not, strictly speaking, violating that article.

    It’s a tricky legal minefield, though. If, during such a constitutional congress, some delegate put forward the idea of increasing the president’s term of office to say, two terms, would that very propodsal itself be a violation, considering that the original constitution is still in effect?

    (Which is the whole reason you don’t put such things in constitutions in the first place.)

  110. The Red Badger of Courage said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:13

    Wow, Badger! It looks like that Constitution gets fairly regular amending!

    Yep.

  111. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:33

    Joe Max,

    So the answer is to remove the legally elected president before his term expires, just for having the temerity of suggesting that maybe the Constitution ought to be affirmed by the people?

    I get the backstory, too, about how he might try this to illegally wrangle a second term, but that’s when you remove the bastard, not now.

  112. Anthony said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:43

    Why don’t any of these people just pick a protege to run the country like they would instead of throwing a constitutional shit fit to stay in power.

  113. John D. said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:47

    Good news about Bernie Madoff.

    As for Chicago Tweleve-Step: Eh. Even for a troll, he’s boring and stupid.

  114. Coach Urban Meyer said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:50

    Wuzza-wuzzup, loony libs? Looks like Chicago Two-Step is two-stepping all over your loony lib dreams now that the Obummer’s popularity is sink sank sunk! You better believe that the socializin and terrorizin has gotten to the McCaniacs and Palinators out in Middle America, the ones teabaggin’ daily no matter what your MSM covers! Badoodle boo yeah, Urban out!

  115. Parrotlover77 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:54

    I don’t believe “neocons” are a Jewish conspiracy (I don’t believe in any Jewish conspiracy) but a lot of leftists sure do!

    The real anti-semites have always been on the Left. Go to an ANSWER rally sometime.

    Shorter Two-Nuts: I know you are, but what am I?!

    Internet traditions and all that.

  116. Xecky Gilchrist said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:56

    Why don’t any of these people just pick a protege to run the country like they would instead of throwing a constitutional shit fit to stay in power.

    I wonder that too. Ego-gratification must be way more demanding down there.

    Actually, I suspect it has to do with that tradition of presidents-for-life; they’re whining “Generalissimo X did it, why can’t IIIIIIIIII?” Like the wingnuts here pining for the days of consequence-free sexual harrassment and all.

  117. g said,

    June 29, 2009 at 18:56

    Twoofie couldn’t spell “Honduras” three days ago. Now he’s an expert on their constitution.

  118. You said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:00

    Twoofie couldn’t spell “Honduras” three days ago. Now he’s an expert on their constitution.

    Troofie never even knew what the word “politics” meant until he read a comic book entitled “How To Bother People On Internet Blogs And Make Enemies”

  119. Tommmcatt said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:03

    You force-feed those trolls for about 50 or so comments and what do you get?

    Troll poop.

    It’s okay, just don’t pretend to be surprised.

  120. PeeJ said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:13

    Twoofie: He is removed from officr, and Obama condems it?

    Everybody else: Yes, he condems the way it was done.

    Twoofie again: He had to be removed one way or the other.

    Everybody else: STFU you intolerable idiot.

  121. g said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:14

    You force-feed those trolls for about 50 or so comments and what do you get?

    If we just held their beaks open and poured the RWTalking Points corn down their gullets, we’d get “foie gross.”

  122. MajorKong said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:18

    But we never expected Bush to be a messiah, or fix all our problems, or pay our mortgages and for our gas.

    No, you just expected him to invade oil-rich countries to ensure cheap gas for your 12 mpg Chevy Tahoes.

    And after watching Jesus Camp you sure had me fooled about that “Messiah” thing.

  123. OneMan said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:23

    “foie gross.”

    Larf.

  124. ifthethunderdontgetya™³²®© said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:25

    You force-feed those trolls for about 50 or so comments and what do you get?

    Unreadable thread? Victory for troofie?

  125. Joe Max said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:35

    Actor212: “So the answer is to remove the legally elected president before his term expires, just for having the temerity of suggesting that maybe the Constitution ought to be affirmed by the people?”

    Of course not! The only point was that it is, in fact, unconstitutional in Honduras to “urge, to promote or to support” the continuation of the presidential term limit.

    I didn’t say it wasn’t a stupid clause to have in a constitution. Or that having a military coup was the correct response (which is another thing, besides “presidents for life”, that Central American countries have far too much of. I wonder if military coups are also “unconsitutional”?)

    But I simply pointed out that, for once, Troofie made a claim that was (to my astonishment) backed by actual facts.

    Stopped clocks being “right” and all that…

  126. New and Improved Maxi-Lib said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:51

    Look! I’ve got WINGS!!!!

  127. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:53

    Scuse my finGAHS!!!!!

  128. EJ said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:54

    So the Honduran Congress is not democratically elected? I did not know that.

  129. The Dark Avenger said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:18

    Does an ultra-maxi-lib provide more protection than a maxi-lib?

    Because like my daughter Lowella Parsonage, I really treasure that “fresh” feeling when you have enough protection.

  130. Professor Dumbeldore said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:28

    If we just held their beaks open and poured the RWTalking Points corn down their gullets, we’d get “foie gross.”

    Ten points to Griffindor!

  131. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:29

    But I simply pointed out that, for once, Troofie made a claim that was (to my astonishment) backed by actual facts.

    Stopped clocks being “right” and all that…

    Yes, but it was his conclusion, that somehow Obama didn’t support democracy, that we took exception to.

  132. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:29

    Professor Dumbledore is a fag, like Tintin and all the other men I have crushes on.

  133. MajorKong said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:33

    I don’t get my reports on media-bias from Soros funded rag sheets, thank you very much.

    Silly me. I forgot. Soros money bad – Scaife money good.

  134. Simba B said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:33

    So, Troofy has been here what, like a year, or something? Is that some kind of record for mentally incapacitated trolls?

  135. The Kid from Kounty Meath said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:36

    Why has Twoofie been here a day after election day without accounting for How the Hell He Was Able to Figure This Out?

  136. MajorKong said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:43

    I’d love to see Troofy and his buddies form the modern equivalent of the Abraham Lincoln Brigade and head over to Iran to fight the regime.

    Heck, I’ve got an SKS and 1000 rds of ammunition I’ll gladly donate to the cause. But I better see youtube video of Troofy going toe to toe with the Revolutionary Guards.

  137. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:46

    What are “buddies”?

  138. The Kid from Kounty Meath said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:47

    “But I better see youtube video of Troofy going toe to toe with the Revolutionary Guards.”
    Found it.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHdXG2gV01k

  139. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:48

    But I better see youtube video of Troofy going toe to toe with the Revolutionary Guards.

    It’ll be more like “butt to secks,” with Troofie catching.

  140. Lesley said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:51

    In the “Things that must be read to be believed”, this certainly qualifies. (Also a new way to poke fun at cheeto loving knuckledraggers.)

    Can Cheetos lip balm cut the craving?
    Karen Hawthorne, Canwest News Service
    …there’s a new product on the market to give you your Cheetos fix without the empty calories: Cheetos lip balm (photo evidence), not a glue stick as you might first assume when you see it in the plastic on cardboard packaging with the grinning trademark cheetah. The flavour is full-on Cheetos with a warning of “Dangerously Cheesy” in the bottom corner.

    “Full on Cheetos” and “Dangerously Cheesy” must be employed to describe wingnuts.

  141. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 20:55

    Cheetos lip balm

    Great. Now right wingers will go en masse to the men’s room to suck each other’s lips put on their lipstick.

  142. owlbear1 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 21:12

    It’s amazing how much wax the ‘poofy’ type Cheetos will hold.

  143. me said,

    June 29, 2009 at 21:20

    chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 19:53

    Scuse my finGAHS!!!!!

    -ok-

  144. The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge said,

    June 29, 2009 at 21:25

    Anthony said,
    June 29, 2009 at 18:43

    Why don’t any of these people just pick a protege to run the country like they would instead of throwing a constitutional shit fit to stay in power.

    There’s a difference in terminology. Here in “legitimate” regimes like the U.S. the big money boys hire thugs like the Bushes to give them the key to the treasury, and when their terms run out, they hire a new set.

    In “corrupt” regimes, they just give themselves the governmental titles and rake it in personally. That’s why they don’t want to lose their position, and why the U.S, gets to disingenuously tut-tut over “corruption.” They just don’t use the fig leaves that we’ve evolved over the years to disguise who’s really preying on society.

  145. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 21:30

    In “corrupt” regimes, they just give themselves the governmental titles and rake it in personally. That’s why they don’t want to lose their position, and why the U.S, gets to disingenuously tut-tut over “corruption.” They just don’t use the fig leaves that we’ve evolved over the years to disguise who’s really preying on society.

    The difference between tyrannies and democracies is the commission officials can charge for raping their people.

  146. PeeJ said,

    June 29, 2009 at 21:37

    The difference between trannies and republic(an)s is frequently negligible.

  147. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 21:40

    The difference between trannies and republic(an)s is frequently negligees.

    FIXED!

  148. Cowalker said,

    June 29, 2009 at 21:59

    I cannot read the Honduran constitution, having the barest minimum of Spanish. But doesn’t it provide a mechanism, such as impeachment, that would handle the situation where a president violates the Constitution? Wouldn’t ignoring the legal remedy for dealing with presidential criminality be as unconstitutional as proposing to change the term limits set by the Constitution? Don’t tell me some elected official officiously took that the impeachment option “de la tabla.”

  149. chicago two-step said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:02

    NO! Charging in with big shiny pen… guns is the only way to EVER SOLVE ANYTHING.

  150. Jennifer said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:05

    Can I just say, this thread has gotten damned boring?

    Here’s something to entertain you.

  151. Smut Clyde said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:11

    Is that a Freudian slip you’re wearing?

  152. M. Bouffant said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:15

    Flying Fox at the top:

    The Supreme Court ordered the military to remove him.

    At last, a working definition of “activist judges.”

    Is SCOH constitutionally empowered to do this?

  153. Smut Clyde said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:15

    Things I learned from today’s thread:
    (1) Naomi Klein, a Jewish journalist, is paranoid about the International Jewish Conspiracy to control the world.

    There is no (2).

  154. Rusty Shackleford said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:19

    Holy poop Jennifer, that video was funny.

  155. Rusty Shackleford said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:24

    John Hawkins: minorities include not just negroes and Mexicans, but also women

  156. PeeJ said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:24

    trannies and negligees

    Always with the veiled penis references.

  157. A Freudian Slip said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:27

    I used to be a liberal, until I was mugged by a criminal negligee.

  158. Larry Craig said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:28

    Is that a Freudian slip you’re wearing?

    Like it? It offsets my wide stance.

  159. Smut Clyde said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:33

    Looking up at the side-bar*, I see that the SebRoll link section contains not just one, but now two linkies to Lingerie websites. Is there something we should know? Any specific requests?

    * As Larry Craig was wont to say.

  160. M. Bouffant said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:35

    From Shaq’s link:

    The problem in the last few elections is that marriage among White women has fallen apart, and married White Women are FAR more conservative than single women. Married White Women were GWB’s margin of victory in 2004, and not enough of them insured a President Obama.

    The culmination of a “Don’t bother w/ the nigras & spics, yada” rant.

  161. Jennifer said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:36

    Holy poop Jennifer, that video was funny.

    Every time I think of “what the effing crap, that angel guy just felt me up” I start cracking up all over again.

  162. M. Bouffant said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:40

    Smut, it’s repressive pajamas for the authoritarians, sexxy lingerie for decadent/degenerate soCIALISts.

  163. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:41

    The problem in the last few elections is that marriage among White women has fallen apart, and married White Women are FAR more conservative than single women. Married White Women were GWB’s margin of victory in 2004, and not enough of them insured a President Obama

    So even tho a “conservative” Republican won the last two elections, we can blame wimmin for being uppity and wanting equality?

  164. Smut Clyde said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:45

    it’s repressive pajamas for the authoritarians ducks.

    Finxed.

  165. Smut Clyde said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:49

    Cheetos lip balm (photo evidence) [...] The flavour is full-on Cheetos with a warning of “Dangerously Cheesy” in the bottom corner.

    The time I got the tube mixed up with my haemorrhoid cream, you’d be surprised how many new friends I made.

  166. Nom de Plume said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:49

    Rusty Shackleford said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:19

    Holy poop Jennifer, that video was funny.

    I was disappointed to see that the “literal music videos” pretty much go downhill from there. It seems that people misunderstood the point of the Bonnie Tyler vid, and decided that simply describing what’s happening on screen is somehow funny.

  167. M. Bouffant said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:57

    I thought the Hair Supply one was pretty damn funny too. In most cases, what’s happening on screen is stoopid, & therefore hee-larious.

  168. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:57

    The time I got the tube mixed up with my haemorrhoid cream, you’d be surprised how many new friends I made.

    Dude, it’s pronounced ANN-algesic! It goes on your mouth!

  169. Cowalker said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:58

    So even tho a “conservative” Republican won the last two elections, we can blame wimmin for being uppity and wanting equality?

    I blame the men who are refusing to step up and marry White Women. Everyone knows that all women want to get married and all men don’t. But conservative men must do their duty and marry/conservatize those crazy, single, lefty women.

    It would be too head-asploding to consider the possibility that more women are becoming progressive, which also might have the effect of making them less likely to see marriage as a necessity.

  170. g said,

    June 29, 2009 at 22:59

    White Women were GWB’s margin of victory in 2004, and not enough of them insured a President Obama.

    this is the hilarious opposite of Occam’s razor – the idea that the best answer to a question is the most far-fetched and unreasonable idea.

    The fact that women, like other voters, preferred Obama to McCain/Palin can only be explained by a dramatic demographic shift in the US population over a stunningly swift four year period.

    Not by the fact that GWB’s scare tactics 4 were so thoroughly discredited by 2008 that people who fell for them in 2004 were unmoved by McCain trying the same thing.

    Or by the fact that McCain insulted the intelligence of American women by thinking Sarah Palin was worthy of higher office.

  171. g said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:01

    The problem in the last few elections is that marriage among White women has fallen apart,

    OTOH – Oh Noes!! See, it’s really true that letting gays marry destroys Regular Marriage.

  172. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:06

    I blame the men who are refusing to step up and marry White Women.

    Hey, don’t blame me! I marry as many as I can find!

  173. actor212 said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:06

    Jennifer, that video was AMAZING! I can’t stop laughing thru the tears of it.

  174. M. Bouffant said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:08

    Zelaya was seized from his home, still in his pajamas, hours ahead of a nonbinding vote on the reforms, including one that could allow presidential reelection in Honduras.

    LAT.

  175. Nom de Plume said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:08

    I thought the Hair Supply one was pretty damn funny too.

    Yeah, that one was okay, but then I segued to a few others that were just plain awful. Maybe I just had bad luck.

  176. rodertrudis said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:11

    My, my, my Zelaya,
    why, why, why Zelaya, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Honduran_political_crisis)?
    So before they come to break down the door, forgive me Zelaya……..
    Al Senor Presidente no le gusta los periodistas y los mata. Zelaya es asesino.

  177. smut clyde said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:14

    marriage among White women has fallen apart
    How can we induce more white women to marry one another?

  178. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:14

    In rightwing world there are no competing memes, no errors in judgement, no incorrect predictions. There is no hypocrisy, no cognitive dissonance, no arguement contrary to the facts. Every opinion, criticism, judgement and prognostication exists in it’s own perfect form, unrelated to what comes before, after or even concurrently.

    Platonic solids st00pid.

  179. Slackor said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:15

    As a Chicagoan I must point out that Obama would never be caught doing some cheesy red state dance. While you’re waiting for him to start over at step one he blew past you and is doing the cha-cha slide.

  180. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:15

    Talk about st00pid…

    Shoulda oughta closed them brackets!

  181. Rusty Shackleford said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:17

    I marry all the White women I please. Problem is…

  182. M. Bouffant said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:26

    Murdoch doesn’t seem to have ruined the news reporting side of the WSJ yet.

    Indicating what’s really going on:

    The U.S. stand was unpopular with Honduran deputies. One congressman, Toribio Aguilera, got prolonged applause from his colleagues when he urged the U.S. ambassador to reconsider. Mr. Aguilera said the U.S. didn’t understand the danger that Mr. Zelaya and his friendships with Mr. Chavez and Cuba’s Fidel Castro posed.

    Retired Honduran Gen. Daniel López Carballo justified the move against the president, telling CNN that if the military hadn’t acted, Mr. Chávez would eventually be running Honduras by proxy.

    Is this is any way mindful of certain reactionary elements in the U. S. who are busy imagining/predicting/projecting coups, takeovers, socialism, government by proxy, blah blah? You think a nice coup might be their solution that their current projections?

  183. Jennifer said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:26

    I thought the Hair Supply one was pretty damn funny too. In most cases, what’s happening on screen is stoopid, & therefore hee-larious.

    Ha! Speaking of the abomination that was Air Supply…back in my high school days, you know, when they were as big an act as they were ever gonna be, they played ATU (that’s Arkansas Tech University) in the smallish town where I went to HS. Anyway, you would have had to be a lamer just to go to that show but…there were actually a few girls in my class who not only went to the show, but also got backstage passes and then went on after the show to party with Air Supply in their room at the local Ramada Inn (I swear to god I am not making this up).

    Worst of all, they didn’t seem to realize that this was not the type of thing that would give you any kind of bragging rights, and so they came back to school and told everyone about how they had partied with AIR SUPPLY, apparently not realizing that this would turn them into a laughingstock. Which, of course, it did.

  184. Rusty Shackleford said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:30

    I’ve taken to trolling Pajamas Media because of their relatively permissive commenting policy, and I’m finding all kinds of gems. Today we have Victor David Hasselhoff harumphing about the kind of crass society that allows teh PENIS on television at five o’clock at “night” then turning right around and decrying the kind of society that is so prudish it thinks that adultery is a bad thing now that a Republican is the most recent politician to be caught in it.

  185. smut clyde said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:30

    there are no competing memes, no errors in judgement, no incorrect predictions. There is no hypocrisy, no cognitive dissonance, no arguement contrary to the facts. Every opinion, criticism, judgement and prognostication exists in it’s own perfect form, unrelated to what comes before, after or even concurrently.

    Spotless mind, meet eternal sunshine… But I see you’re already acquainted.

  186. Snarla said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:32

    …(pretending to care about the Iranian people while they are slaughtered by Islamist animals in the street)…

    Boy! Is it ever getting hard to keep track of what’s going on in the world. Last month the Iranian people were Islamist animals and now they’re not, but Islamist animals are slaughtering them. In the street, no less.

    It was so much easier when you could just say “Axis of Evil” and be done with it.

  187. Matt T. said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:34

    rodertrudis said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:11

    Okay, that was funny. But I’m a Tom Jones fan, so YMMV and whatall.

  188. jimmy said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:44

    will you guys make fun of that idiotic Douthat column from this week? PLEASE?!

  189. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:52

    they had partied with AIR SUPPLY

    This is standard operating procedure in a nursing home.

  190. M. Bouffant said,

    June 29, 2009 at 23:58

    It is more fun to “party” w/ a Nitrous Oxide supply.

  191. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:07

    Ok, now that someone brought up Air Supply (and I’ll cop to my guilt in expanding the topic) it just reminds me of a question I’ve had for years: what if your claim to wealth and fame was such schlock and you had to go through the rest of your life with that shame? I mean, these guys DO know that they made a lot of money for making crap, right? How do they live with the shame of it? When I first thought up this question back in college, I wondered if the guy who invented the Smurfs was tempted to commit suicide…but compared to a lot of what I’ve seen since, the Smurfs were high art.

  192. smut clyde said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:17

    Such a view arouses disdain today
    Have I mentioned my theory that Ralph Peters’ guided missives are all ghostwritten by Josh Treviño, or possibly vice versa?

  193. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:18

    How do they live with the shame of it?

    Big houses, high-priced call-girls, fine Colombian agricultural products…

    When I first thought up this question back in college, I wondered if the guy who invented the Smurfs was tempted to commit suicide…but compared to a lot of what I’ve seen since, the Smurfs were high art.

    Comrade Peyo created the Smurfs in order in indoctrinate the children of the world into socialism. Without the Smurfy indoctrination of the past twenty-odd years, Barack Hussein X Socialislamicommiefascistmessiah (that could be a German word) might not have gained the youth vote.

    Did you not learn this during your ACORN orientation, Comrade Jennifer?

  194. Matt T. said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:19

    I mean, these guys DO know that they made a lot of money for making crap, right?

    Dig, not every band sets out to be U2 or Radiohead or Fugazi or whatall. Not everyone’s in it for art or the sake of the song or the voice of the unheard. Some are just in it for pussy and drugs and the wonderful life of not having to work in a restaurant while you stay true to the music, maaaan. And that’s before you get to the basic cluelessness of the average musician concerning how desperately he needs to stop playing his crappy music. Those guys are probably aware of the loathing thier stuff gets and could give a fuck what people think.

  195. tigrismus said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:26

    How can we induce more white women to marry one another?

    Hee hee, that was my first thought, too. It’s time now for homo nups global!

  196. kingubu said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:27

    I wondered if the guy who invented the Smurfs was tempted to commit suicide…

    The set of people working in Network TeeVee who possess the sense of artistic credibility you suggest (much less the shame that might result by running afoul of such a sense) is roughly equal in size to the set of people who would could be fairly classified as “sexy right-wing blogger”. Hope that helps to clear up your wonderin’.

  197. The Dark Avenger said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:32

    what if your claim to wealth and fame was such schlock and you had to go through the rest of your life with that shame?

    What if your claim to fame was people wanting you dead because of all the money you made selling what lots of folks think is schlock merchandise?

    Eloise Popeil and her boy friend were convicted Saturday of soliciting the murder of her millionaire husband in hopes of cashing in on up to one-third of his estate.

    :

  198. M. Bouffant said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:32

    not every band sets out to be U2

    Jeeziz, talk about money for crap, U2 is the ultimate example.

    And the Air Suppliers, & their ilk, think they’re performing a public service, since they’re raking it in. “Sure, we ain’t Beethoven, but people like us!!”

  199. smut clyde said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:34

    How can we induce more white women to marry one another?

    (1) Remind them that the alternatives include actor212.
    (2) ???

  200. The Truthful Problem With Real Life said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:34

    So, Troofy has been here what, like a year, or something? Is that some kind of record for mentally incapacitated trolls?

    Longer than a year on Sadly No!, and although he changes his nyms every few weeks or so to try and avoid detection, the same old mannerisms give him away time and time again.

    And if it’s the same obsessive I think it is, he’s been trolling liberal blogs for about 8 years now, as someone who used to post almost exactly like him could be found on Eschaton in 2001/2.

    One day, perhaps, he’ll come to realize that the only meaning his life has, the attempt to hurt liberals, is a complete wash out as there’s just nothing to do but laugh at someone who in one thread alone gets the lowest presidential approval ratings ever off by 35% (GWB final approval rating: 22%); And who can’t count the number of months since November; And who insists that he knows what you think better than you do; you did declare Obama a messiah, you did, you did, you DID!

    Yes, how sad and wasted is your life when you are compelled to go online again and again and again, trying to upset people because you don’t know, and never will know what love is, and all they do is laugh at you making a complete tit of yourself?

  201. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:35

    I have to take issue with your characterization of U2. Whatever you think of their more recent stuff, they have made some kickass music. Personally, I like the recent stuff too, though I could do without the Bono personality cult – or the one that Bono imagines exists, at any rate.

  202. Simba B said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:48

    And if it’s the same obsessive I think it is, he’s been trolling liberal blogs for about 8 years now, as someone who used to post almost exactly like him could be found on Eschaton in 2001/2.

    Even for Troofus, that’s…uh, impressive, I guess. Heh, it kinda takes the bite out of his bark, just because it’s so sad.

    Shit, eight years. I can’t even begin to think about what has changed for me since then. I can only imagine I’d have probably jumped off a bridge if I was living now the same life I was living in 2001.

    Comment @ 0:34 is officially the new bookmarked reference for The Truth.

  203. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:01

    And if it’s the same obsessive I think it is, he’s been trolling liberal blogs for about 8 years now, as someone who used to post almost exactly like him could be found on Eschaton in 2001/2.

    He’s kinda like Captain Ahab, were Ahab:

    a. A real person (though sometimes I think Tw00fy is a fictional character portrayed by a coterie of snarkers.
    b. A moron.

    Yeah, he’s obsessed enough with Tintin and Gavin to make cartoon postings on Youtube that no Sadlynaught cares to watch, and anyone unfamiliar with SadlyNo would never even think to look for. He spends a lot of time that would be better spent trolling Craigslist or public bathrooms trying to get a rise out of somebody/anybody. At least Ahab’s obsession (were Ahab a real person) would have been rational because Ahab was actually harmed by Moby Dick, and, had he killed Moby Dick, Ahab would have gained a fortune in oil and other byproducts. Heh, killing things, and taking their stuff… where have I heard that before?

    Yeah, like Ahab, only a complete moron.

  204. ifthethunderdontgetya™³²®© said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:03

    Teh literal translation of With Arms Wide Open made me laugh.

  205. g said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:07

    That Popeil murder plot is too delicious! The best part?

    “Although he coneded that he had hired private investigators in the past to follow his wife, Mr. Popeil, said he did nothing to discourage the relationship between Mrs. Popeil and Ayers.

    “In fact,” he added, “I was kind of happy to have him take her off my hands.”

    that and the fact that one of the hit-men the Vega-matic inventor’s wife hired to kill him was named Robert Peeler.

  206. Big Bad Bald Bastard said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:13

    How could the Popeil murder plot possibly have worked? I mean, the guy was sure to have invented a Murder Plot Foiling Device… but wait, there’s more! Order the Murder Plot Foiler now, and we’ll throw in, not one, but TWO Infidelity Detectors… and, if you call now, we’ll even throw in a set of Conspiracy to Commit Murder convictions.

  207. Xecklothxayyquou Gilchrist said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:25

    Worst of all, they didn’t seem to realize that this was not the type of thing that would give you any kind of bragging rights, and so they came back to school and told everyone about how they had partied with AIR SUPPLY…

    Around 1981ish, probably the same time you’re talking about, the Air Supply concert was the social event of the year, at least among the girls at my junior high school. This illustrates how uncool my hometown of Ogden, Utah was (and likely still is), as if anyone needed any proof.

    Better still – Air Supply is coming to my current town of Salt Lake City, UT at the end of next month! See the July 31 entry here. So everything you heard about Utah being soopa-kewl was wrong.

  208. thomas said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:30

    At first it would appear that Zelaya ignored both the Honduran supreme court and congress and called the military’s bluff. But it seems that he was right on the cusp of being checkmated anyway and just opted to run a losing game all the way to the end.

    When you look at his position and his personality (like his heavily affected language about creating monsters) you can appreciate how he acted as though he didn’t have anything to lose: extend his time in office and bring the military and other branches of govt. in hand or lose, but lose with a persecuted flourish when you’re being plotted against anyway.

    It’s hard to know just who knew what when or where this is headed but two things are certain: Tegucigalpa is an awesome city and the WSJ is worthless in every respect.

  209. Zarquon said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:36

    Air Supply were Australia’s pre-emptive revenge for Everybody Loves Raymond. Suck it up, norteamericanos.

  210. PeeJ said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:37

    How the fuck did Popeil come into this thread?!? (I had a little nap)

    It’s odd because, as I was skimming through the comments since I nodded off, I saw How do they live with the shame of it? and immediately thought of Ron Popeil. PeeJ is off his meds again, you are tempted to say – with some astuteness, it must be admitted – but there’s a link.

    I can’t find a link to video but I have a memory of Popeil being on Letterman’s show or Carson’s or someone’s and the host was showing the “inventions” in a most unflattering way. “Look at this in the shell egg whipper, he’d say. What a stupid idea! And it’s crap to boot! It’ll break the first time you try to use it. Popeil smiled and said “yep, that’s true.”

    So the host pulled out some other stupid piece of shit and similarly lambasted it and Popeil. His response was a gentle grin accompanied with “I couldn’t agree more.”

    After a bit of this, the host demanded “Well what have you got to say for yourself?” Popeil smiled broadly and said “I made 12 million dollars last year.”

  211. The Truthful Problem With Real Life said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:48

    Yeah, he’s obsessed enough with Tintin and Gavin to make cartoon postings on Youtube that no Sadlynaught cares to watch, and anyone unfamiliar with SadlyNo would never even think to look for.

    Yup, one reason I suspect it’s him, because of the pattern of obsessive repetition of other’s work and identity; the freak at Eschaton used to set up blogspots with a similar URL to Atrios and Hesiod et all, and then just post nonsense trying to insult the original blog on them; when he got control of himself (the Hesiod blog just had a child-like scrawl of a man with a big nose on it as I recall…) he’d hope to get your IP address from the visiting logs, and then would trace real life details, usually resulting in a call that went “This is Duncan Black, stop posting on Eschaton! Fuck you!”

    If that sounds paranoid well… just ask yourself this; how long have YOU all been posting online? You’ve been doing it for some time, right? But sensibly and often funnily… now imagine the same length of time… or perhaps even longer… but spent consumed with hate and trollery. Yup. Even if it’s not the exact same lonely freak, bet dollar to donuts he’s been at it for similar lengths of time. He’s certainly going for a similar level of retardation…!

  212. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:49

    OMG, PeeJ, I remember that. It was Letterman.

    But the “oh shit” for me in the article about the attempted Popeil hit was that I had never realized that Ron Popeil was the second schlock-vending generation of Popeils.

    This is roughly equivalent to how the offspring of pseudo-celebrities began showing up on Hollywood Squares sometime in the early ’90s. I knew our days as an empire were numbered when the son of John Davidson, a man notable only for a few brief appearances on Love, American Style and Hollywood Squares, took over his old man’s square.

  213. Righteous Bubba said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:53

    I dunno what registration entails, but the Popeil article here was good:

    http://www.newyorker.com/archive/2000/10/30/2000_10_30_065_TNY_LIBRY_000021976

  214. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 1:59

    And now that I think about it, this is why I was never into John Edwards.

    He had that same kind of smarmy surface charm and pretty-boy looks as John Davidson.

  215. kingubu said,

    June 30, 2009 at 2:06

    John Davidson: what you get when you order a Pat Boone but your plan only covers the generic equivalent.

  216. Xecklothxayyquou Gilchrist said,

    June 30, 2009 at 2:15

    the “oh shit” for me in the article about the attempted Popeil hit was that I had never realized that Ron Popeil was the second schlock-vending generation of Popeils.

    News to me! The things I learn on this blog, again…

    Air Supply were Australia’s pre-emptive revenge for Everybody Loves Raymond.

    Holy shit! I’m sorry, I didn’t know they exported that bullshit. I thought that was purely domestic punishment.

    John Davidson: what you get when you order a Pat Boone but your plan only covers the generic equivalent.

    FTW.

  217. justme said,

    June 30, 2009 at 2:37

    what if your claim to wealth and fame was such schlock and you had to go through the rest of your life with that shame? I mean, these guys DO know that they made a lot of money for making crap, right? How do they live with the shame of it?

    On the one hand, a friend of mine once relayed to me a piece of wisdom told to him by someone who would know, “Careful what songs you record. You might be playing them the rest of your life.” I forget exactly which embittered has-been he was playing for at the time, but it’s worthy advice regardless.

    On the other hand, when I met him &$&%@# years ago, Larry Chance was still in fine voice and pulling down $5k a night singing “Re-mem-mem, re-member-member” in Atlantic City. Like so many of his day, he got totally hosed out of any cash from the original recordings, but at least he could still play out.

    ymmv

    As for U2, the early stuff was great. The records done with Lillywhite and then Eno/Lanois are really fine stuff. After “Joshua Tree” and “Unforgettable Fire” I think they succumbed to “David Byrne Disease.” This is where so many people tell you how much of a genius you are that you start to believe it yourself. IMHFO, they went way downhill from there. I plan on giving their new one a listen, but I’m not expecting to love it.

    And if we were truly fortunate, and if the world were a just place, every extant copy of anything Creed ever put out would spontaneously combust while Scott Stapp was simultaneously struck mute.

  218. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 2:42

    About that Popeil murder plot….

    …I wonder what the plan was…were they going to slice him, dice him, mince him up?

  219. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 2:42

    I just haven’t had a lot of time to read the dreck being published in the U.S. — with the magic of the intertoobz, I’ve been listening to Honduran radio and reading regional publications and, let me tell you, Venezuela’s TeleSur TV live stream was covering the street actions of the Honduran military and the street protests. Right up until the military began shutting down and controlling much of what was available and until they just this afternoon arrested the TeleSur team.

    These right wing shits and an occasional anti-leftist ‘liberal’ got nothing to say about the Honduran death squad military shutting down the free press of Honduras, but OMG they’ll cry about how Hugo Chavez took RCTV’s over-the-air broadcast rights away, after the TV network enthusiastically supported the failed 2002 coup against Chavez.

  220. ifthethunderdontgetya™³²®© said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:06

    Death squads are for Freedom™, El Cid.

    Also, if you don’t agree, you love Stalin and you’re an anti-semite. NO MORAL EQUIVALENCE!

    /neocons

  221. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:18

    John Davidson: what you get when you order a Pat Boone but your plan only covers the generic equivalent.

    Speaking of Pat Boone, he’s joined the birthers.

    Speaking of Pat Boone. Also.

  222. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:19

    I’m listening right now to the ministers from the member nations of ALBA (a trade bloc built by Hugo Chavez, the previous Kirchner of Argentina, and Lula of Brazil into an alternative to U.S. dominated ‘free’ trade and diplomatic blocs) and, just like the Organization of American States yesterday, not one of these leaders have even the slightest bit of patience for these U.S.-trained Honduran death squad turds overthrowing their government so that the old guard can get rid of a populist President. Not one of them is playing any games with even the tiniest bit of respect for this nonsense story about how the fucking Electoral Court had the authority to kiss the ass of the Honduran military at the military’s urging order the Honduran military to fucking overthrow the government, assassinate the leader of the leftist opposition at his fucking god-damn home [Cesar Ham], and nominate somebody entirely outside the god-damn chain of succession as the new ‘President’.

    They tried this shit with Hugo Chavez, too, when they overthrew him, took him to an island to hold him, and named the god-damned head of the equivalent of the Venezuelan Chamber of Commerce as the new ‘President’.

    Strikingly, this uniformity of reaction has extended to the Obama administration, the U.S. ambassador (Hugo Llorens) who said that the U.S. recognizes no other President than Zelaya, and Secretary Clinton.

    The overthrown Zelaya, speaking at the ALBA meeting in Nicaragua, said he will travel BACK to Honduras next (this?) Thursday, and invited other nations’ leaders with him.

    Reports (unconfirmed) suggest that several Honduran military units may have revolted against the coup leading officers.

    If this is true, and Zelaya manages to get back in power, he ought to clean house in the god-damn military like he was a Mr. Clean fetishist on 30 cans of Red Bull. Fuck these fucking dinosaur death squad assholes and their fake parliamentary and ‘court’ beards.

    Zelaya’s a stupid, miscalculating ass, but these fuckers are worse.

  223. Bitter Scribe said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:29

    What do you want? These are the spiritual (if not actual) descendants of the people who thought Francisco Franco was God’s, or at least Catholicism’s, gift to humanity. Why would they have the slightest regard for a little thing like an election?

  224. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:32

    Excuse me. I’m sorry. In U.S. reporting, when a leftist leader is shot by soldiers coming to capture him at his home, he is neither killed nor assassinated.

    A more passive construction is required — no one kills you, you just die somehow:

    Some of Zelaya’s Cabinet members were detained by soldiers or police following his ouster, according to former government official Armando Sarmiento. And the rights group Freedom of Expression said leftist legislator Cesar Ham had died in a shootout with soldiers trying to detain him.

    I mean, there you are, minding your own business, hanging out in your home, being all ‘leftist’ and shit, and the next thing you know a squadron of soldiers from your nation’s death-squad riddled military show up at your house to forcibly capture you for god knows what destiny, and the next thing you know you have ‘died’ in some sort of a shootout, just before things got interesting, too.

  225. N__B said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:33

    John Davidson, a man notable only for a few brief appearances on Love, American Style and Hollywood Squares

    I must have watched every episode of “The Streets of San Francisco” – for what reason I cannot now remember, but I have my extreme youth at the time as a handy excuse – and the only thing I can remember of it besides the tip of Karl Malden’s nose was John Davidson as a homicidal female impersonator. He was damned cute in drag, too.

  226. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:50

    …leftist legislator Cesar Ham had died in a shootout with soldiers trying to detain him.

    That’s the equivalent of the Shithouse Troll’s entire family being wiped out in a bizarre camping accident. Because, I mean, WTF?

  227. M. Bouffant said,

    June 30, 2009 at 3:50

    Aaahh, (dismissively) U2 was pretty weak even in its earliest days, though not totally intolerable. Now, w/ the added patina of “Bonoism” or -”itis,” feh!

    Also:
    Although he conceded that he had hired private investigators in the past to follow his wife, Mr. Popeil said he did nothing to discourage the relationship between Mrs. Popeil and Ayers.

    “In fact,” he added, “I was kind of happy to have him take her off my hands.”

    In my good old days I knew a husband/live-in boyfriend or two who had this attitude. Gawd knows what they were up to while I was away w/ their significant others.

  228. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:05

    The very right wing and leftist hating President of Mexico, Felipe Calderon, has no patience for this shit either: he just announced in the strongest possible terms the complete illegitimacy of these coup idiots, and that Mexico recognized only one President of Honduras — the one chosen by its voters — and was recalling its Ambassador.

    Meanwhile, El Salvador, Guatemala, and Costa Rica were shutting down all trade with Honduras. Damn.

    You know, once again, like we see with the idiot domestic GOP, it’s possible that the Hugo Chavez-hating Honduran oligarchy may, after and if this is all over and the coup fails, may have ended up once again greatly strengthening the hand of a Hugo Chavez ally and Hugo Chavez himself — because nobody came out quicker and louder and stronger against the coup than Chavez.

  229. chicago two-step said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:05

    They’re not “death squads, they’re patriots restoring freedom and democracy to Honduras.

  230. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:08

    Aaahh, (dismissively) U2 was pretty weak even in its earliest days, though not totally intolerable. Now, w/ the added patina of “Bonoism” or -”itis,” feh!

    Well, YMMV. But you know, disregarding the Bono-centrism and just listening without watching the video, this ain’t a bad song. In fact, in comparison to probably some 90% or more of what’s out there, it’s a pretty good song.

    Sure, these guys have gone pop over the years, but they still have their own distinctive sound – a good sound to my ears anyway – and they still write and record some very listenable songs. They’ve changed it up over the years, but I don’t know how that can be avoided unless a band is content with settling into ZZ Top mode and just doing the same song over and over again. So I’m willing to forgive them not being the band they used to be and to enjoy them to the extent I can now.

  231. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:14

    They’re not “death squads, they’re patriots restoring freedom and democracy to Honduras.

    You think you’re joking. Do not underestimate the awesome dumbitude of the American right and its occasion overly left-hating centrist dogmatizers.

    From BoRev.net Via Digby:

    Whose description is the most tortured, Orwellian, or otherwise insane?

    * Candidate 1: Interim dictator Roberto Micheletti describes how he found himself in this new role: “I did not reach this position because of a coup. I am here because of an absolutely legal transition process.”

    * Candidate 2: The WSJ’s Mary Anastacia O’Grady describes the military overthrow as all part of a country’s democratic system of “checks and balances.”

    * Candidate 3: Ed Morrissey at Hot Air invents an awesome new concept. This was “less of a coup and more of a military impeachment.”

    * Candidate 4: At the Corner, Ray Walser praised the way “Congress, the courts, and the military joined forces” in a “deliberate, bipartisan manner.”

    * Candidate 5: Rick Moran at the American Thinker doesn’t care if it’s a coup, only who it serves: “Does the fact that the coup is in the interests of the United States even matter to our president?”

    Nice. I like that — it’s not a ‘coup’, it’s a military impeachment. Tee hee.

  232. chicago two-step said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:15

    The Congress and Courtd were right to act. He was holding an illegal referrendum, even importimg ballots from Venezuela when the government refused to provide them, then he began to instigatr riots in the streets. He was a socialist strongman and had to be removed. The other two branches could not just sit by and shuffle paperwork while Rome burned. It isn’t a coup, the courts and congress told the military to do their duty, to uphold the Constitution.

  233. pedestrian said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:26

    He was holding an illegal referrendum, even importimg ballots from Venezuela when the government refused to provide them, then he began to instigatr riots in the streets.

    Well, when democratically elected leaders start to instigate massive protests, you know it’s time to call in the junta. Freedom isn’t free, etc.

  234. Simba B said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:27

    Eight years, huh, Troofie? You’ve wasted eight years of your life on the Internet, trolling liberal blogs and generally looking pathetic.

    Given a generous life expectancy of eighty years, you’ve wasted ten percent of your life doing, well, nothing.

    Bet you don’t let yourself think about that much.

  235. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:30

    It is a coup. Only retarded paranoiac people in the U.S., crazy Cuban exiles, and the Honduran oligarchs believe this bullshit story.

    The Supreme Court ordered nothing, nor has anyone even tried to suggest that the Honduran Supreme Court has the authority to tell the military to overthrow the elected President, expel him from the country, and pull cards out of their ass and decide by bullshit Congressional vote whom the next President was.

    The fucking Electoral Tribunal declared that the nonbinding poll / referendum was illegal and this gives this electoral court the authority to order the death squad military to throw out the President, arrest the Cabinet, and install a completely fictitious government under no rule of succession whatsoever because, woo woo, they took a vote in Congress.

    So I guess if some appellate court ruled that Obama had done something illegally, and Obama chose to ignore the ruling, why, by God, then it would be okay if not legal for the Air Force to show up at the White House, blast their way in, put Obama on a plane to Switzerland, arrest the Cabinet, and then Congress could have a vote and make Joe Lieberman the new President, all because, you know, you can do that.

  236. chicago two-step said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:34

    I luvs aktivist judges.

  237. pedestrian said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:41

    You know what other country had a one term limit on the presidency? Colombia. Do you know why Uribe is now serving his second term? Because he changed the constitution.

    Of course, it’s not a dictatorship if you are a rightwinger.

  238. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:45

    You know what other country had a one term limit on the presidency? Colombia. Do you know why Uribe is now serving his second term? Because he changed the constitution.

    This is not a fair comparison.

    After all, Uribe did not hold a poll about having a referendum which courts declared illegal.

    Uribe’s party just bribed the members of Congress necessary to vote for the 2006 revision of the re-election law. That’s completely different.

  239. Shorter Neocons' South American Policy said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:46

    IOKIYAFascist.

  240. chicago two-step said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:46

    I’m having trouble reconciling my total and unwavering support for the Iranian people (until the next time I want to bomb them into the stone age) with my contempt for the people of Honduras, who have just seen their democratically elected president removed by a violent coup. But with enough rationalizing and believing in bullshit, I’m thinking I’ll get over it soon enough. In fact, I already have!

  241. Jennifer said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:47

    So I guess if some appellate court ruled that Obama had done something illegally, and Obama chose to ignore the ruling, why, by God, then it would be okay if not legal for the Air Force to show up at the White House, blast their way in, put Obama on a plane to Switzerland, arrest the Cabinet, and then Congress could have a vote and make Joe Lieberman the new President, all because, you know, you can do that.

    In winger world, what oughtta be de facto is. And projection. Also.

    They approve of the actions of other international actors based on both “what oughtta be” (cf. making up their own reality as they go along) and wish they could get away with doing the same here.

  242. MajorKong said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:57

    They’re not “death squads, they’re patriots restoring freedom and democracy to Honduras.

    Let me guess. They’re the moral equivalent of our founding fathers?

  243. Reagan said,

    June 30, 2009 at 4:58

    Don’t quote me while Troofie’s giving me a BJ. It makes him bite down.

  244. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 5:00

    From the Washington Post, on why the U.S. is refraining from calling the Honduran situation a ‘coup’ when even the conservative government of Mexico does so, partly because, hey, it’s so confusing:

    Clinton’s remarks reflected the complex situation in Honduras, where the congress overwhelmingly voted to depose Zelaya after he had been forcibly removed. The congress then named a new president, Roberto Micheletti, from the same party.

    Yeah. Woo. It’s a complex situation.

    Who could imagine that when the death squad riddled military forces which periodically rule Honduras, with or without a civilian fig leaf, go shoot their way into the Presidential palace, arrest the Cabinet, and throw the elected President out of the country, that the brave and independent Honduran legislators might vote in such a way as to approve of the military’s just-completed shooting gallery?

    Isn’t it confusing? Doesn’t it just suggest that the situation is much, much more complex than the evil leftists like Mexico’s Calderon suggest, because obviously you would expect the famously, daringly, supremely independent Honduran legislature to stick up two big middle fingers to the U.S. trained death squad military right after they’ve carried out a violent coup d’etat.

    Gosh. Things are complicated.

  245. Brandi said,

    June 30, 2009 at 5:30

    Still not much to say about Madoff, huh?

  246. chicago two-step said,

    June 30, 2009 at 5:36

    Bernie Madoff is a super-awesome Hero of Capitalism who don’t take no shit from the illin’-ass SEC and if you say anything bad about him it means you’re racist against kikes.

  247. John Sydney McCain III said,

    June 30, 2009 at 6:02

    My Friend,

    As I travel around Arizona, I am always humbled by the dedicated men and women I meet in my home state. I am so honored to serve as one of Arizona’s Senators and I want you to know that together, we have accomplished a great deal. We are taking positive steps toward economic reform and we are preparing for a vigorous debate on healthcare in the Senate.

    But there is still more to accomplish on issues like healthcare reform, national security and earmark reform and that is why I want to continue my service to our country as a member of the United States Senate.

    You may have read that I am now facing opponents in the Republican primary. I want you to know that I am taking nothing for granted in this campaign. I am committed to winning reelection.

    You have so generously supported me in the past, and for that I am very grateful. I would not be where I am today without your support. Today, I hope you will show that you are one of my strongest supporters by signing my Reelection Pledge of Support.

    The end of June marks a key deadline for my reelection campaign, as we will be filing our fundraising numbers with the FEC. The national Democrats, the media, and my opponents will use these numbers as a sign of my reelection campaign’s strength.

    Will you show your support for my reelection effort today by adding your name to the Reelection Pledge of Support and make a special contribution of $25, $50, $100, $250 or more to help us reach our fundraising goal?

    Our campaign is very close to meeting our second quarter fundraising goal. That’s why I ask that you immediately follow this link to make your urgent contribution to my reelection effort.

    I am truly thankful for your generosity and I look forward to keeping you informed on our progress in finding solutions for our nation’s challenges.

    Sincerely,

    John McCain

    P.S. I hope to continue my service as a United States Senator, but I won’t be able to do so without your help. I’m asking you to sign my Reelection Pledge of Support and make a generous contribution of any amount so we can meet our second quarter fundraising goal. Thank you.

  248. lobbey said,

    June 30, 2009 at 6:08

    Unreadable thread? Victory for troofie?

    Yes, the sad little fucker is probably dancing around in his soiled underpants in celebration (which will end when the bailiff comes to his house to demand payment for ‘Anal Adventures’ cable channel).

  249. ckc (not kc) said,

    June 30, 2009 at 6:12

    John Sydney McCain III said,
    June 30, 2009 at 6:02

    My Friend,

    As I travel around Arizona, I am always humbled…

    …you tell it, brother!!

  250. i luv me some cheetos said,

    June 30, 2009 at 6:14

    it doesn’t involve military coups and violent censorship of the press.

    Unless, of course, the violent coup is against a Rethug Preznit and censorship is limited to Faux News. Then you’re for it FULL TILT.

    Moron.

  251. Cagney & Lacey said,

    June 30, 2009 at 6:36

    Did Chicago Two-Step leave yet?

    It saddens me, Sadly, when the quality of trolls goes down so much, and readers respond anyway. These guys don’t believe in anything, Gang. They just want to be embittered and make poopies and have people yell at them (if nobody will talk to them, which they won’t). My ex-father-in-law was one of them. He had his collection of Lyndon Larouche bullshit ideas, his racism cloaked in irony, his paranoia. He liked being persecuted because it meant somebody, somewhere, was thinking of him.

    When nobody would engage him any more because he was boring, offensive, and tone-deaf to human interaction, he would start baiting. Saying unpleasant things, accusing people. Because everyone knew he was a crackpot, they would resist confronting him back.

    When baiting didn’t work he’d start talking to himself. Eventually he would make a scene (for similar example see http://www.sadlyno.com/archives/21234.html, Breitbart vs. Whoever,) and finally there would be a ghastly and embarrassing denouement that tapered from a huge display of balls to a tiny, scaly point, much like the tail end of a rat.

    He eventually died hideously. I wouldn’t wish such a fate on anybody. But most of all, he died alone. Profoundly, engulfingly alone. Nobody cried for him. I hadn’t even thought of him for years, until just now. That’s the thing that propels the cranks, I think. What makes people become Nazis or join the Minutemen. They want to be part of something, and they want to make people react. They can’t make anyone love them, or laugh, or smile, so they say, “fuck it, I’ll go for fear and disgust.”

    All of which is to say, don’t feed the trolls. The best vengeance is silence.

  252. Cagney & Lacey said,

    June 30, 2009 at 6:39

    I meant the real Two-Step, of course. The fake shemp is pretty funny.

  253. tensor said,

    June 30, 2009 at 6:43

    “…and the next thing you know you have ‘died’ in some sort of a shootout, just before things got interesting, too.”

    Kinda like when Sec. of State Al Haig testified before Congress that some nuns had died “in an exchange of fire” with the Salvadoran soldiers/death squad (I forget exactly) who/which had brutally executed them. Family values, culture o’life, and such as.

    “Full on Cheetos”, “in the bottom”, and “Dangerously Cheesy” must be employed to describe wingnuts.

    F’zd.

  254. Smiling Mortician said,

    June 30, 2009 at 7:29

    Meat Loaf.

  255. tiny pale bishop said,

    June 30, 2009 at 8:04

    Did someone say “Pat Boone?” I love Pat Boone.

  256. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 12:41

    The real problem in Honduras is that it makes Hugo Chavez look good, because how dare Hugo Chavez be first and loudest in calling for the return of the legitimate government? Such, such evil.

    The displaced President is an evil Hugo Chavez power grabber for wanting to allow the Honduran citizens to vote on whether or not they should vote to change the Constitution to permit Zelaya to run again; real democratic leaders like Alvaro Uribe simply rely on a bribed Congress to authorize their re-election.

  257. Ted the Slacker said,

    June 30, 2009 at 13:27

    The real problem in Honduras is that it makes Hugo Chavez look good

    There’s also the issue that using the army to settle political disputes is not exactly de rigeur these days.

    One thing with wingnutz is that they can’t spare a moment to think a little more broadly than the Extreme Seriousness and Importance of corruscating a brown guy who stands up for poor brown people – imagine for a sec Obama’s lot came out and said, “Good Job, Honduran Army, for restoring the rule of law in your country”. Anyone else in the world, right now, who might not use that as cover to use his own heavies to “restore the rule of law”? Off the top of your head?

    OT: Wingnut headline right now is the on-again, off-again auction of Obama’s Kenyan birth certificate on E-Bay. Will confess that whilst I had the idea a while back that this could be a great idea to pocket some wingnut welfare for myself, this is not my auction. Mainly because the risk of being killed by a bilked wingnut far outweighed any fun, reward, or performance art enjoyment I hoped to get.

  258. El Cid said,

    June 30, 2009 at 13:38

    My link to Alvaro Vargas Llosa was simply to re-emphasize that he’s a prick who mainly exists to condemn anything that looks like it’s of the left, and for this he’s of course highly praised by the U.S. establishment commentariat.

  259. Bill Joel said,

    June 30, 2009 at 14:39

    We didn’t start the fire.

    Just sayin’ …

  260. mrak said,

    June 30, 2009 at 14:40

    Cagney & Lacey wrote:
    These guys don’t believe in anything, Gang.

    [lebowski]That must be exhausting.[/lebowski]

  261. DBR said,

    June 30, 2009 at 14:56

    A dissertation about the birth of Obama: THE TRUTH ABOUT USA PRESIDENT BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA II by the same guy that was peddling his real birth certificate from Kenya has reached $666k:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&Item=160345324422&Category=1468&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26its%3DI%26otn%3D1

  262. actor212 said,

    June 30, 2009 at 17:41

    The records done with Lillywhite and then Eno/Lanois are really fine stuff. After “Joshua Tree” and “Unforgettable Fire” I think they succumbed to “David Byrne Disease.” This is where so many people tell you how much of a genius you are that you start to believe it yourself. IMHFO, they went way downhill from there.

    I dunno. I have a soft spot for Zoo Station, altho Zooropa sucked. Time Magazine did a piece tracing U2s albums and this timeline pretty much held: Boy and War were seen as good, but not their best, then you hit “Fire” and “Tree” up at the top of their career, and then you can watch the career tank slowly, achingly slowly, beyond that, with little blips (“Dismantle” wasn’t half bad, but it wasn’t all that great, either)

  263. the_millionaire_lebowski said,

    June 30, 2009 at 17:42

    This isn’t as crazy as it sounds, even though the WSJ’s language echoes certain Cold War self-deception and doublespeak. My understanding is that Zelaya was acting unconstitutionally and ignoring the Honduran Supreme Court. The Supreme Court ordered the military to remove him. Not my idea of a democratic surrender of power either though.

    Nailed on the second reply.

    The situation is complicated, but Zelaya was fucking over the country pretty hard, ignoring the other two branches and had made enemies out of nearly every political ally he had previously. He was abusing the executive bureaucracy under the objections of the legislature and the supreme court, the latter of which requested his removal by the military.

    I think the US should stay out of this, long post short.

  264. actor212 said,

    June 30, 2009 at 17:44

    smut clyde said,

    June 30, 2009 at 0:34

    How can we induce more white women to marry one another?

    (1) Remind them that the alternatives include actor212.

    Hey, I have enough on my plate with women, thank you very much…

  265. justme said,

    June 30, 2009 at 18:41

    I dunno. I have a soft spot for Zoo Station, altho Zooropa sucked

    Actually, yeah, I’ll put “Achtung Baby” in with the good albums, but showing the start of the decline. The last of the first Eno/Lanois bunch. I didn’t even know they had gone back to the Lillywhite/Eno/Lanois trough in varying combinations for their last two records. Shows how bad I thought the two before that were. I just stopped paying attention.

    The blurb on allmusic about the new one makes it sound like I might like it. One of these days I’ll give it a spin.

  266. thomas said,

    June 30, 2009 at 19:07

    I can only imagine how Bush would have made this situation worse. Actually I can’t. Guy was full of surprises.

  267. thomas said,

    June 30, 2009 at 20:00

    Given the history of US military involvement in Honduras (and all of Central America) as well as witnessing the recent crackdown in Iran, it is definitely hard to look at this military coup as something of a step in the right direction.

    The institutions of the developed world are generally strong enough to prevent or limit dictatorial takeovers (God knows the Republicans tried), but third world countries have a very hard time getting things to work properly, thanks to the abject poverty, corruption, powerful neighbors, no pluralism among elites, etc. Military might is inevitably going to be a huge player, but in service to what or to whom?

    A Honduran friend emailed me this morning, “Las noticias y mandatarios internacionales me tienen decepcionada con la cobertura y apoyo a Mel,” (News and international leaders have disappointed me with the coverage and support for Mel) and she’s the last person to want to see soldiers in her streets. The country’s vulnerability is such that there’s no easy way to establish institutional continuity, but I get the sense that this is what people are hoping for and that’s what they are expecting the military to help with.

    I love how the WSJ article funnels down to hating Hillary Clinton, to catching her “showing her true colors.” What a bunch of fucking clowns.

  268. Lawnguylander said,

    July 1, 2009 at 2:46

    The situation is complicated, but Zelaya was fucking over the country pretty hard, ignoring the other two branches and had made enemies out of nearly every political ally he had previously. He was abusing the executive bureaucracy under the objections of the legislature and the supreme court, the latter of which requested his removal by the military.

    This is bullshit. He asked for a nonbinding referendum on whether the citizens wanted to convene a constitutional convention that might allow for more than one term. That’s it. This was after he obeyed the Supreme Court’s ruling not to put a binding referendum on the ballot.

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