It’s bogus. But if you and your ilk want to waste the rest of your lives playing Chicken Little, pointing fingers, and preaching faith over works, keep it up.

When you watch him telling people on the streets how scummy and sinful they are you certainly see a cruel streak in him that loves the thought that people are going to die then be tortured (so, not really dying at all).

Did you notice that… everyone gets eternal life, just some will have it more comfortable than others.

I chose to be a decent human being, to care about others, to respect others who will respect me and my opinions. Christianity does not offer me those things. If I had to chose a religion or die, I would chose to be a Buddhist. Even Einstein said he would choose Buddhism if he had to choose a religion to worship. He was an agnostic. Blind faith is bad.. It blazes a path to ignorance.

Yes he does.

Well, that’s that.

I agree. If someone is wounded or sick, do we have to pray to get them help? Of course we go get them help! I think that was Kirk’s point. He was making the illustration that we as Christians should not be praying about helping other people. That IS God’s will. God wants us to help others. Why should we have to pray about that.

Maybe pray how to most effectively help or pray for protection and help. Those are other reasons Christians pray.

Also, important to note is:

God does NOT cause hurricanes, tornadoes, diseases, etc. The God I serve is a good God–and also a just God.

Satan is the one who is out to destroy. Hell was created for Satan and the other fallen angels. It was not created for any human. However, if we choose not to receive Jesus then by default we have chosen Satan and will go where he goes. When Eve was tempted by Satan and ate the forbidden fruit in the Garden of Eden, she and Adam lost their authority. Before this, God told them to take dominion over the earth. When they disobeyed God (sinned), they gave their authority to Satan and he became a destructive force in the earth-diseases, calamities, mental illness, hatred, other sin etc.

But Jesus gave his life for everyone. Everyone can be saved if they accept Jesus died for them and was raised from the dead. In the name of Jesus, the dominion/ authority that was lost to Satan in the Garden is regained. By trust in Jesus comes healing, restoration, peace, strength, joy, love for others.

Now, many who say they are saved, do not have love for others. They are not saved who do not genuinely love others. Perhaps, some of you have experienced this false type of “Christian” and have been discouraged by it. Maybe you’ve been falsely judged or rejected. Let me tell you, that is not the way of Jesus. Jesus loves unconditionally and so should those who call themselves Christian.

Ways to love as a Christian: feed, clothe, shelter, teach, listen, understand, and yes, openly share Jesus–but don’t cram it down anyone’s throats. Love is never forceful. Love is never proud. Love is patient and kind.

Ah, he admits he’s evil at least!

“I tripped upon this page while checking to see if Mike Seaver was Kirk Cameron (chiding a friend of mine who really gets into The Way of the Master). I understand people thinking Kirk is cheezy, and his movie really was terrible. But I hadn’t seen this much venom yet. Wow. And then to consider the Westboro “Baptist Churchâ€? indicative of Christianity…they’re nothing but a mock “churchâ€?.

Yes, becuase the “No True Scotsman!”-Fallacy only applies to nonbelievers!

“Dear Christian Haters – Stop looking to the net, or your own bad experiences, or movie portrayals, to form your arguments against Christianity.”

No need.
I’ve read the bible.
What else would be necessary?

“Find a decent pastor/priest who you don’t already view as bigoted and ask them hard questions. Ask if there is another side. Then ask yourself if you’re capable of seeing things any other way than the way you do now. If not, then don’t waste your time, relish your own ignorance masked by “enlightenment and reasonâ€?.”

Yes, because enlightenment and reason are “of teh Debbil!”.

“I encourage you to read one book about one Christian – Mother Teresa. Cover to cover. She was direct, relentless, courageous, absolutely selfless, and had a heart with endless room for those we all would find repulsive and unforgiveable. That is a Christian. Ask yourself why she did it.”

At the same time I’ll ask myself why she thought that poor people where -supposed to suffer- according to her Gawd.

” Ask yourself if you ever could…and why not.
One of the posts above did get something right – the “Left Behindâ€? series is based on crap that was imagined a couple of centuries ago, and is not generally accepted by Christian churches.”

Being blind on purpose is now a virtue?
If so, consider your chastity belt intact.

“If anyone really wants to know what core, Biblical Christianity is all about:
1. There is a God who caused all things to happen, for purposes unknown, unprovable, un-unprovable (sp?), but real just the same.”

And if that AIN’T prime wingnut… what is?

“2. He/She/It allows us to turn away from him (sin), to feel we are smarter than we others (pride), and allows “badâ€? things to happen (evil). This does not make him evil, nor does it mean a part of him is evil. It means that without these things, his creatures (including us) would be mindless zombies with no reason to better ourselves, learn, divine his purposes, or prove that we want to follow his lead. Some cynically call that slavery. True Christians believe that is sacrificing selfishness for selflessness”

And the crusades where just misinterpreted PR-ventures!
Yep… No Wingnuttiness in that at all!

“3. He is the good and perfect judge.”.

Yeah, siccin’ rabid fuckin bears on children!

“We will be held accountable for things (why shouldn’t we be?), forgiven of things, and will live for eternity with said judgement. Some think hellfire is hyperbole (as in, imagine an unimagineably uncomfortable position), some think it is real. Inhouse debate. Point is, you don’t want to let pride and sophistry get in the way of very real accountability.”

I can’t even cumpute what this is supposed to mean.

“4. Judaism in Christ’s time had fallen to legalism, “relationship with Godâ€? was poorly understood and done, the poor (majority of people) were marginalized, and the biggest world power was a cancer that kept spreading”

A certain Monty Python sketch seem eerily pertinent.
“What has the Romans done for us?!!”
etc… etc…

” And the concept didn’t end in Christ’s time, it never will so long as man is man, and mankind sets its own view of beauty as the highest standard.”

Okay… didn’t make sense there, either, did you?

“5. God poured out his power (condescended) to become a lowly man.”

You mean he spilled his semen?

” To experience humanity as a human. To show humanity what love, truly unselfish love, really means. To heal sick people. To truly piss off the powers of the age. And to experience death, to wash sins, and come back again.”

Which is why he condemned people with his “gnashing of teeth”
Yeah, that’s “truly!” unselfish. If your standard is “truthiness”, that is.

“6. He chose disciples (more than 12) who watched this first hand. Some wrote about it. One of them betrayed him (possibly instructed to do so). 11 of the 12 closest disciples suffered and died horrific deaths defending what they saw was true. Not what they thought was true…what they SAW was true. The last (John) lived to old age, but was tortured and imprisoned during most of his life. For what HE SAW, not what others saw, or what a man dreamed.”

Believe in ages-old mystical sparkly ponies!
It will prove yer point always!

“7. And finally, Christ said the most important commandment was to love God. The second was the love thy neighbor (even the ones we think we should hate). He also commanded his disciples once to go out and do 2 things: heal the sick, and spread the word.”

Christians have a hard time adhering to that…
I present an example: YOU.

“You want to spit judgement about the “sins of Christianity?â€? Want to lump Christians into your convenient box of Kirk Cameron-esque philosophy?”

That’s YOUR bunkmates, buddy.
Kick ‘em out if you don’t like ‘em.

“Want to claim the Christian world view is responsible for more hatred, filth, atrocity and ugliness than it is worth?”

Yes. Yes, indeed I do.

“First, there were more atrocities and deaths caused by athiesm in one century than all “Christian-caused-conflictsâ€? in all of eternity – by orders of magnitude. Just count ‘em up – Hitler, Stalin, Mao Tse Tung. Yeah, atrocities in the name of Christianity were committed…but nothing on the scale of non-Christianity. Crusades? Which one? The first one, where islamic tribes conquered/killed/plundered hebrew/christian/non-religious lands and peoples? Or the ones after, when Christian nations sent troops to fight back? (Certainly not apologizing for the tactics on either side, which were cruel, but let’s be honest about what really happened, not the whitewashed middle school history book version)”

Hitler was Christian.
NEXT.

“Then, understand that Christianity is called to serve food to hungry people, found hospitals, dig wells in Africa,
help alcoholics through recovery, adopt needy children, etc etc. That’s not supposed to be a side project…that IS the project.”

Good.
Put sometimes they take it a wee bit too far and predicate their “help” on cenverting to their wingnut ways.

“Choose to focus on the negative that’s fine – hundreds of thousands of Christians are too busy helping to be bothered with sending press releases or boycotting soldier funerals for stupid reasons. ”

And here you are… proving that YOU are NOT too busy…
Ouch, my fucking irony-nerve just imploded!

Dear Christian Haters – Stop looking to the net, or your own bad experiences, or movie portrayals, to form your arguments against Christianity. Find a decent pastor/priest who you don’t already view as bigoted and ask them hard questions. Ask if there is another side. Then ask yourself if you’re capable of seeing things any other way than the way you do now. If not, then don’t waste your time, relish your own ignorance masked by “enlightenment and reason”.

I encourage you to read one book about one Christian – Mother Teresa. Cover to cover. She was direct, relentless, courageous, absolutely selfless, and had a heart with endless room for those we all would find repulsive and unforgiveable. That is a Christian. Ask yourself why she did it. Ask yourself if you ever could…and why not.

One of the posts above did get something right – the “Left Behind” series is based on crap that was imagined a couple of centuries ago, and is not generally accepted by Christian churches.

If anyone really wants to know what core, Biblical Christianity is all about:
1. There is a God who caused all things to happen, for purposes unknown, unprovable, un-unprovable (sp?), but real just the same.

2. He/She/It allows us to turn away from him (sin), to feel we are smarter than we others (pride), and allows “bad” things to happen (evil). This does not make him evil, nor does it mean a part of him is evil. It means that without these things, his creatures (including us) would be mindless zombies with no reason to better ourselves, learn, divine his purposes, or prove that we want to follow his lead. Some cynically call that slavery. True Christians believe that is sacrificing selfishness for selflessness.
3. He is the good and perfect judge. He knows everything that factored into their decisions. We will be held accountable for things (why shouldn’t we be?), forgiven of things, and will live for eternity with said judgement. Some think hellfire is hyperbole (as in, imagine an unimagineably uncomfortable position), some think it is real. Inhouse debate. Point is, you don’t want to let pride and sophistry get in the way of very real accountability.

4. Judaism in Christ’s time had fallen to legalism, “relationship with God” was poorly understood and done, the poor (majority of people) were marginalized, and the biggest world power was a cancer that kept spreading. And the concept didn’t end in Christ’s time, it never will so long as man is man, and mankind sets its own view of beauty as the highest standard.

5. God poured out his power (condescended) to become a lowly man. To experience humanity as a human. To show humanity what love, truly unselfish love, really means. To heal sick people. To truly piss off the powers of the age. And to experience death, to wash sins, and come back again.

6. He chose disciples (more than 12) who watched this first hand. Some wrote about it. One of them betrayed him (possibly instructed to do so). 11 of the 12 closest disciples suffered and died horrific deaths defending what they saw was true. Not what they thought was true…what they SAW was true. The last (John) lived to old age, but was tortured and imprisoned during most of his life. For what HE SAW, not what others saw, or what a man dreamed.

7. And finally, Christ said the most important commandment was to love God. The second was the love thy neighbor (even the ones we think we should hate). He also commanded his disciples once to go out and do 2 things: heal the sick, and spread the word.

You want to spit judgement about the “sins of Christianity?” Want to lump Christians into your convenient box of Kirk Cameron-esque philosophy? Want to claim the Christian world view is responsible for more hatred, filth, atrocity and ugliness than it is worth?

First, there were more atrocities and deaths caused by athiesm in one century than all “Christian-caused-conflicts” in all of eternity – by orders of magnitude. Just count ‘em up – Hitler, Stalin, Mao Tse Tung. Yeah, atrocities in the name of Christianity were committed…but nothing on the scale of non-Christianity. Crusades? Which one? The first one, where islamic tribes conquered/killed/plundered hebrew/christian/non-religious lands and peoples? Or the ones after, when Christian nations sent troops to fight back? (Certainly not apologizing for the tactics on either side, which were cruel, but let’s be honest about what really happened, not the whitewashed middle school history book version)

Then, understand that Christianity is called to serve food to hungry people, found hospitals, dig wells in Africa, help alcoholics through recovery, adopt needy children, etc etc. That’s not supposed to be a side project…that IS the project.

Choose to focus on the negative that’s fine – hundreds of thousands of Christians are too busy helping to be bothered with sending press releases or boycotting soldier funerals for stupid reasons.